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I don't think he had been SM very long, may have resisted training a little as he was one of those guys whose career and personal intrest made him qualified to teach practically all the skills. But, although this is out of the district our troop and so out of district for the one I am training chair on, the troop is in my tiny rural home town, so I know the last 2 Scout Masters therefore this one must be pretty new. Anyway he has offered to be on my training staff for othe IOLS trainings, and I may take him up on it even though he is out of district. He was a very knowledgable person. He is thinking of leaving this troop and forming a Sea Scout crew. I always thought you had to be close to an ocean, but he says kayaks in our town lake and some outings to the ocean are fine. Someone else interested in starting it with him has a big sail boat that they can use, but I believe it is not on our lake, but they need to travel to reach it, so only can use it on occasion.

So, I hosted my first Intro to out Leader training.. Most went well except for me.. Thank goodness for my son who saved the day, anyway another story.. I was talking to a participant who is outside my district. He (the scoutmaster) and someone else another registered adult leader took the scouts on an camping outing. They return to be informed by the committee that the boys can not get credit for the event, (I guess in it counting toward the camping merit badge, or camping trips to get into OA).. Here is the reason. Neither of them had taken the "Intro to outdoor leader training".. So the boys are being punished if the Registered adult leaders don't take their required training?? Give me a break!!! I guess I should the info to the council training chair since the people our out of our district.

Your council may be like ours, for some reason you have to submit it with a registration regardless of how many times you have submited it before.. Why are you only complaining about that and not the resubmission of your adult registration application, that you have to redo for all the new positions you take on. That takes more time to fill out, and uses more paper..

Don't forget the countless times you have to refill out the Adult applications, because someone did not enter you into the system in the first place. Or with us, they tend to toss meritbadge councilors off the system every now and then, and you have to reapply. They are suppose to come out with new software for Adult training (not Scoutnet).. Before required training is officially started. What that will have I don't know, but hopefully will allow us more control over entering the training, and checking it for accuracy, and allow units the opportunity to check who in their units are getting trained and keep up with items like YPT and who is not.

been a while since my son was in cub scouts. but our pack had an annual christmas sleep-over party, with pizza and santa visited and gave each boy a present (alway a pinewood derby car kit after the 2nd year you knew what it was.). they held it at the school, played basketball and other things (like some sort of christmas craft activity).. then bunked down on the school gym floor for an overnight.

Since the incident happened over a year back, you may want to discuss now if there was a better course the adult leaders could take in a certain situation.. But best if in that case you open the tread to be a more general question then a discussion of a particular incident. For example .---------------------------------------------------------------------------------. Subject: "How would you deal with over-indulgent parents" Body: You know the type? Those that their kids can do no wrong. Those that at a troop meeting will jump up and argue with the adult leaders to let their son do whatever they want, even if it is disrupting the meeting, or endangering other scouts? Blah.. Blah.. blah.. Are there any ways that we as Adult Leaders get control of the situation? .------------------------------------------------------------------------------- If you posed your question in this fashion, you would get responses to it without people scratching their heads wondering where you are coming from.. So in answer to the question in general. You can try to get the parent to not constantly shadow the child, and see if you can work with them better when mom/dad isnt present. You can discuss with the parent that it isnt all about Junior, but you have a responsibility to make sure the program is fair, fun and safe for all scouts. But, bottom line if the parent is upsetting the entire program for the entire unit to try to allow his son to get whatever his heart desires, and there is no reasoning with him. Then first the unit as a whole is being lead and manipulated by an adult. The Adult leaders must regain control of the program, and if this means eliminating the parent & child for the good of the rest of the unit then that should be the action. You can start out by giving the parent warning that if he doesnt stop trying to manipulate the unit, then he is not welcome at the unit meetings (if that means the loss of his son, so be it.). I think you really cant bar a parent from attending, because I know even for an OA initiation, you cant bar a parent from attending. But, if you can remove a child from your program for their behavior.. then you should be able to do so for a parent, even if that means the child is also barred due to the parents behavior. Your unit should have the right to be able to maintain control and safety, and should be allowed to remove anyone who is threatening it.

Sorry about your first meeting, but I am thrilled you stayed with it, and did so much better on the second try.

I always felt sorry for the APL whose PL was not doing his job. They ended up either doing the PL position due to a majorly absent PL, or had the more difficult job of mopping up after a PL that wasn't qualified to be in that position. And for no credit, so they may also be holding down another troop job to fullfill their own POR.. Should the SM step up to fix this, by speaking to the PL about if he has decided to drop the program, or why did he run when he knew he would be out half the time for some sport activity.. Or help with guiding the PL so he can preform the job better??? Yes, but there's another issue.

Very difficult,IMO. I was on a Troop & a Venturing Crew at the same time. Both had different licenses.. To have two troop masters on the same computer with 2 licenses.. Your asking for trouble!.. As everyone says the normal duties of UC come first. Does your district offer Troop master training? Mine has at the round table, and at some program kick-offs. You can either get members of your unit to go to those. Or see if they cannot either invite you to their home or have their troopmaster with their license & information on a laptop. Where you can sit with them and show them some great tricks. After all doing it for them would not be the answer. Giving them information and advice that they can use for themselves would be what you would want to do.

Maybe your "coup stick" is what we call our "brag flag". My husband used a flagpole stick, bought two of those tops that are for tieing ribbons onto the flag, and that holds alot of ribbons (maybe about 75 - 100 ribbons per. one of the tops he put on the top. One he figured how to put lower down, Then lower down then that he screwed in eye hooks and the eye hooks will each hold several ribbons a peice. They also have a ribbon holder top on the troop flag pole too, for our newest ribbons. Our troops been around since the 1940's we have ALOT of ribbons!!! The old ones our neat for troop history, so we never want to throw any out.

SoMy son is 19. When he started as a tiger, about 14 years ago we had a child in the den that was mentally disabled, our den thought the world of him. He had a hard time grasping things that required memorization, but he was very athletic and put his heart and soal into everything he did. The smile that would light up his face was wonderful. When we crossed over half the den went to one troop, the other half went to the other. We chose the same troop as them, and we chose the wrong troop. The other boys of the den, dis-associated with him in order to fit in. My son would stay with him and be his tent mate and partner. My son, though not disabled, is a naturally slow mover, just plods along.. This boy was speedy, but mentally slow. This meant between them they were slower setting up their tents, taking them down or doing an activity.. They were both labled "not the right fit" for the troop. But, they weren't the only ones, this troop recruited about 30 boys a year due to the troop had amazing older boys involved. What you didn't realize is those older boys came to be by selecting about 10 of the new year's crop, and getting rid of the rest by neglecting them, making fun of them, making things more difficult for them etc. By the time the next cross-overs came for a visit they could model the perfect troop again. Our family choose to leave before the family with the disabled boy, we tried to talk them into moving to the troop we were going to, but it was a longer drive. When I left I and the mother of another boy who was leaving with us, gave the troop leaders a piece of our minds.. I brought up the disabled boy, and how they were pushing him out by their actions. There comment was, "Well it really would be best if he did go..." So yes you are right with some troops. But our Den & Pack did make an effort with this boy, and truely enjoyed him in the group. It really does depend on the Leaders of the unit, and how they teach their scouts how to work with and handle others with disabilities.

Welcome John, I had a nice long writing, but the send didn't work right, and I lost the whole thing. Don't have patients to type the whole thing in. I don't have patience to type it all pretty again. So unfortunatly you get the condensed version. 1) Everyone is welcome. Come and join the forums. You may learn how to re-enter the scouting world in a capacity that is perfect for you. From your writing I can tell you are a very intellegent person. Scouting needs all types of people with all types of skills. I can't tie a knot to save my life either.. 2) we had a disabled scout in our troop. the mother was no help either, she would tell him he couldn't do things and even would tell him he was stupid. The leaders would move her away to try to work with the scout, but we are all volunteers without professional training, our headway was slow and this frustrated not only the scout, but the adult leaders. One leader went to a weekend BSA training on how to work with handicap scouts. It was wonderful, she came back and got the scout to open up. She taught other leaders the right and wrong way to motivate him. All frustration was gone. Then the mother took him out for a petty reason. We think she was not happy we were succeeding, she really wanted him to be very dependent on her. Anyway frustration can go both ways. It is not because other people do not want to help, but just don't know how to help.

Welcome, I hope you enjoy the journey, sounds like you will be kept on your toes with your scouts.

acco40 - you left us hanging with a story with no ending!!! That is not very nice.. So, did you tell the scout and the mother, no because he had not served as a POR? Did you have to inform the Advancement chair of the true facts? Or, were you forced to cave in, and give him an undeserved POR?

Ahhh.. Sorry.. I forget there are 2 bases.. Yes it was the Sea Base in the Bahamas.. But yes they do have their own funny money. I did not go as it was a 100% male ship, but I was presented with a $1 bill from my son because he couldn't turn it in. The front states "These notes are legal tender under the central bank of the Bahamas, act 2000" some govenor guy on the front and fishes.. the back has a whole band of horn blowers in some sort of uniform. But if the U.S. wont honor them, they must be funny money in some way..

We did for the scouts those preallocated cards so they weren't holding onto money. This was a problem, because their was a minimum and some places would not take it. Also for some reason my husbands card told him he was out of cash when he had only used it once and was sure he was not.. Came back, 6 months later the person who purchased the cards told him she got notification he had $XXX amount unused on the card and to use it or loose it. Nice to get it back, but would of been nice if it had worked during the trip!!!.. All the way around, it was a good idea gone bad.. If you used cash, they have their own currency, they will take american cash, but you will get their currency back. Do your best to use this up, we were told you couldn't exchange it once you came back to the US.. Sounds funny, and won't be surprised if someone calls me out on this, but this is what our scouts were told.. So do your best to use it up. Also the sea base T-shirts there was no store, so you ordered them, they would have them waiting for you on the return trip, but they only took cash. Most kids forgot to hold this money in reserve. So take the money for the seabase souveniers up-front, and act like the store they have just purchased from.. Yes, this goes against teaching the scouts responsibility.. But, if you don't the scouts will end up unable to bring a seabase T-shirt / hat whatever momento home from the trip.

Welcome. Hope to see you around the forums.

You talked about the big bucks you could earn if you turn pro (yuk, yuk).. More likely would be that learning leadership skills in scouting will help you when you get into the working world, and that will improve your earning potential.. There may even be big bucks.. For sports you forgot all the popularity and the girls that want to date you.. Although I think there was a recent post that said the boy scout uniform was considered sexy... Nah... I think more girls still go for the jocks of their school..

Marine1 - Personal opinion, but as far as I am concerned, parents wanting to get involved should always be encouraged.. Just watch out that you are encouraging your son to keep pace, and don't become one of those parents bent on pushing their sons to be the over-acheiver.. If your son is naturally an over-acheiver then don't discourage him. But, too many parents push their scouts to prove they have the better scout, and ultimately burn their sons out.. Your son and you have a long trail ahead that is filled with wonderful learning, and adventure. If you stay an involved parent, (but not a pushy parent) it will be a connection with him that can last throughout his teen years when other parents are searching for somethin to connect with there children about. It will be a connection that will fill you with pride as you watch him become a young adult who is self-motivated and confident and whose judgement you can trust in and respect. Learn to guide when needed, step back when appropriate and enjoy watching the magic unfold.. Happy journeys to you and your son.

Mythbuster, unfortunatly with all the duties and responsibilities we put on Scoutmasters, one of their required job functions is not "be a walking encyclopidia".. The scoutmaster will not know all rules verbatim and be able to regurgitate every one of them at the drop for each parent that asks a question.. He knows the basics of the scout program, he knows in the troop, with the boys at least he has the right to follow BSA rule to the letter, or tighten it up, but not weaken and delude it. But that the COR is King or Queen and their rules everyone as long as they too don't ignore BSA rules. So what he tells a mother is his viewpoint on the situation. Can he stand there and rattle off the rule book, not unless you have an SM with a photographic memory. Doesn't matter, unless the rule book stated that the Den Chief must be Life scout, if he makes a rule for his troop that it must be First Class then that is now that troops rule. But he didn't even make it a rule in the example. But he could have, and that would have been fine.. The gray area happens though when the troop rules do stand long enough for the troop to not remember it as a troop rule, and those running the troop believe it to be a BSA rule. They can go on to become trainers or other district members and rattle it off as a BSA rule. This is where it is a problem. That is why it is good for everyone to know and then review the BSA rules for themselves, or take training courses (which hopefully don't have trainers that have troop rules mixed in with BSA rules.) You always should figure out the BSA rules, but know and follow the troop rules, if your troop has added their own (or your councils rules which could also be added).. Then if your troop rules don't work anymore you feel within your right to take them out or change them. We were in a troop as new parents, and got the troop telling us all sorts of very strict rules as policy.. Rules they should not have changed. For example, if you completed a merit badge but lost the blue card, you had to retake the MB again.. REGARDLESS of if it was properly logged at council, or your Advancment Chair or MBC could produce records for it. Many others like that. We were shocked when we took training and found it to be untrue.. These type of rule changing was not good because they were adding to the requirements of a boys advancement. Still even with this background history, I see nothing wrong with troops modify the BSA program to benifit their troop for their personal makeup. As long as you modify what you can, and don't tinker with what you should not, and don't disregard or weaken the BSA rules.. You have to know what is black & white and what you can modify, and allow the units to modify what they can. In this example there was nothing wrong that I saw happening.

CPA Mom - agree, if they want to write a check for not selling that is fine, I was only commenting on the fact the Pack shouldn't have to foot the bill due to these excuses. I understand the council is linked to Popcorn take, that does not improve the products value or ease to sell it. As the products value goes down and the price goes up, they too will receive less and less either because units can't sell the stuff though they try, or because units find a better fund-raiser. Message to BSA National is "Your fund-raising product is in serious trouble. Change vendors, or change product or do something".. And if National doesn't listen then they loose. The best seller years ago was the small $5 pack. The bigger pack was more value, but $5 was something most people would consider a worthwhile donation to Boyscouts. We would sell 100 of them.. $12 is not what people consider a worthwhile donation, so what do they do? They donate $1 or $5 and don't buy the product. So now we sell 3 $12 packs rather then 100 $5 packs, and receive $100 in donations. The unit will still do ok.. The council will only get a percentage of the 3 packs of popcorn sold.. Any way you look at it Council will loose if the trend of popcorn continues. Girl scout cookies are still affordable to buy 1 or 2 boxes whether you like the product or not just to donate to Girl scouts. Thin mints still seem a good value, but for most of them, there are a small amount of cookies in the box.. Doesn't matter, the price of the product is small enough to consider it a donation to a good cause. Also the products quality of the classics hasn't deteriorated either. Don't know about the quality of the new varieties they try, I tend to stay with the classics.

Oh good! Sounds like if not this troop, then one just as special. Your off to a good start if you start visiting and can say "I like" rather then measuring the pros and cons. You said "My son's former troop" is he currently Troopless until he finds a new one?

Welcome to forums. Boy your pack knows a softie! Secretly though you must love it, otherwise you would stay away from that recruitment night, as that seems to be your downfall.. I only had one boy to go through recruitment night with, but except for the first grade when we signed him up, we never went to recruitment night again. After all, we were recruited.. And it seems with your pack they sign you up for a position without asking whether you are present to say "No" or not. So going or staying home would make no difference except you might not volunteer yourself.. (In our troop if you are missing from a meeting you might be volunteered, but not if you are present.) So yep, you have a thing for this Recruitment night. It is so weird how some people step up to volunteer for everything and some will not volunteer for anything, (like those Thursday night tiger parents..) Who could not even take over the den meetings to help you out when you could not make it. I would imagine some of those parents were quick to complain over your lack of commitment also. Not even giving you credit that you were running two tiger den meetings and that your child was not even part of their den group.

Both parents with excuses sound flimsy to me for a show 'n sell. If you have show-n-sell slots the parent of the two cubs should not get off with not knowing who to sell to. Our kid sold door to door, but we live in a nice neighborhood, and we always went with him. I know in some neighborhoods that is not possible parents or no parents. But a show 'n sell you just sell to strangers who are walking out of the store. The popcorn allergy too, seems he could do something at a show 'n sell.. Just don't have him handeling the merchandise but he can talk to people, get their attention and answer questions. Unless he has allergies so severe he can't even walk into any store or convient mart that sells a candy bar with peanuts in it. Personally though, that was one thing I was glad my son no longer had to participate in. The price was a little high but reasonable for a fundraiser when he was a cub scout. The prices have become unreasonable, and the quality and quanity of the merchandise has gone down over the years.. It made every year increasing harder to sell the stuff.

Seems like you dived right into it if you are only in year two and already taking woodbadge. Those scouts are lucky to have a den leader so trained. I am sure it will allow you to bring wonderful energy to the the program for them.