mbscoutmom

Twocubdad, I already apologized and said I was finished with this thread. You didn't need to add another attack. Now I would like to ask the moderator to please delete this thread, but not the other one. The posters there have been kinder in their comments and have given me some information that may be helpful to me and other people in similar situations. (This message has been edited by a staff member.)

Oak Tree, you seem to want me to stop posting here, but you asked me some questions, so I will answer them. "Someone at the Chartered Organization must not want you at the meetings. Who told you that you are not allowed to attend?" The CO, but he told me the reason was because the council forbade it, and as soon as the council tells him I can attend meetings, he will allow it. "A parent recommendation is one of the requirements for Eagle. How was that handled?" I have no idea. "Plus, you signed him up for Scouting. You did sign him up, right? And didn't have him removed from the program?" Yes, we originally signed him up, and we did not have him removed from the program. "I have never seen a Scout bring a scrapbook to an Eagle BoR" Maybe that's a regional thing, but we were told to do it for our other son. "Your interactions here on the forum make you come across as argumentative and controlling." I'm sorry you perceive my interactions here that way. They were not meant to be. I have tried to answer questions honestly and to correct misunderstandings when they have occurred, but I may also have reacted strongly to the rash judgment against me from many posters. "Can we imagine that your son might have grown to hate such an environment? Well, I can. But I don't know. Maybe you really are a great mom and your son just had other issues." I would say that I'm a good-enough mom. Not perfect, but not so bad that my kids can't wait to leave home because of me. I have four other children and a grandson who still like me, so I can't be all bad. We adopted our oldest son when he was 8, and he brought issues with him from his earlier life. "ScoutNut answered your questions. I answered your questions as best I could. What more do you want here?" Thank you. Your responses have been very helpful. "Now, I know you didn't ask for opinions or for recommendations for family therapy, but since everyone here seems to be giving you the same response, might it make any sense to consider what people are saying?" I would be willing to participate in family therapy, but my son will not, so there is nothing I can do about that. Now if there are no other questions, I am finished with this thread.

moosetracker, thank you for your courteous response to my question. Lisabob, and everyone else who reads this, I'm sorry if I have offended you by posting here. I thought y'all could help me understand the troop leaders' thinking about what my son was doing, and you have, so thank you for all of your responses. And if my son or anyone in the troop is reading this, I want you to know that I forgive you for anything you did that inadvertently or intentionally hurt me, and I ask you to forgive me for anything I have said here that hurt your feelings.

I am already allowed to attend courts of honor, and the CO has no personal objection to me being there. He is just trying to follow the directions from the council as he sees them. And once he makes a decision he does not change his mind. The only way to change it is to for him to receive new directions from the council. Thank you for the reference to the guide to safe scouting. That may help.

"None of us here have the details to say one way or another." What details do you need? I told you that he deliberately kept information from his parents that we had a right to know. In that act alone, he broke several of the scout laws to some degree: trustworthy, loyal, kind, obedient, friendly, courteous, and reverent, and maybe cheerful and brave as well. (I'm looking at the explanations of these laws here: http://usscouts.org/advance/boyscout/bslaw.asp) Based on the responses here, I have another question. Do the scout oath and law really mean anything anymore? Do we expect scouts, and especially eagle scouts, to really try to live by them, or is it just something you memorize and repeat at scout meetings? Because if an eagle scout can't be expected to try his best to uphold those ideals, I don't know why we bother with the program at all.

Eagle92, I'm getting the picture. It's scary how much harm someone can do to an innocent person and they have no way to fight back. In my case, my son did not directly cause my membership to be revoked. He was locked up with no way to contact the outside world at the time, and I doubt that he would even have thought of it. An adult leader in our troop must have reported it to the council.

"A Board of Review with a lot more information made a decision." The information they had is something I wonder about. I have not been present at one so I don't know what kind of questions they ask. For my other son, I made a scrapbook to take along, and included pictures and awards received in scouting and in other activities. I was told that they wanted to know that he was a well-rounded person. Would there have been questions about his home life or how he gets along with his parents and siblings? If they knew he was on probation until his 18th birthday would that have had an impact on their decision? I just don't know enough about it to guess whether or not that kind of thing matters.

"Gee, I thought the question was "Does every boy deserve Eagle?" Apparently that really wasn't the question. So what's the question now, should your son have been awarded Eagle without your permission?" Sorry for the misunderstanding. "Does every boy deserve an Eagle" is the title of the thread, but the original question is this: "My question: did he deserve an eagle when he was breaking several points of the scout law while getting it?"

"My point was even if the Council said you were ok to return your CO can still exclude you." Okay, I understand now. But the CO wouldn't do that. I'm only an "unacceptable risk" to the BSA. In the same buildings where I'm not allowed to enter a scout meeting, I teach Sunday School to 25 6th and 7th grade boys every week. If you met me, you would not seriously think that I could physically harm a boy of boy scout age. I'm a 56 year old grandmother of small stature with arthritic hands. My son's accusation had no substance. From the time he arrived in our home at age 7, I couldn't even run fast enough to catch him, much less inflict any bruises on him. The report to the council had no substance. They didn't investigate anything, just simply acted on hearsay. If I were selfish, I would insist that my husband and sons leave the troop, but I won't make them give up something they enjoy because it causes me pain.

"Something doesn't make any sense...... I doubt that the council would act on just a rumor In my opinion, your selfish needs are not worth the risk you pose to the boys whether the accusations are real or not....." It doesn't make sense to me, either, but it happened, and you, like the council, are judging me with no evidence. "You have lost your oldest, instead of worrying about scouting maybe you should focus on the other two...." I completely agree. "Done with this conversation......" Bye.

"I understand perfectly why the CO, SM and CC don't want you at the meetings......" Because I insist on people understanding what I say and not reading other meanings into it that are not there? I never said the CO, SM, and CC don't want me at the meetings. They never said that, and in fact they all have supported my efforts to be reinstated.

I didn't come here to rant. I came to ask a question, but you asked me a question, so I will try to answer it. "What did the leaders and your son say when you accused the SM's wife of having ulterior motives?" I didn't say she had "ulterior motives". I said "her own reasons". You have interpreted what I said in a negative way, and that is not what was meant. "When you accused them of working behind your back?" I didn't accuse them of anything. There is no denying that the eagle was obtained without our knowledge. I stated in the first post what they said when my husband talked to them about it: they did it that way because it was the only way he would get his eagle. "Of shutting your son out of your lives and perpetuating the rift?" This is just a statement of the way things are, not an accusation. My son wants to shut us out, and they are going along with whatever he wants. "You had to have had some sort of a conversation with them about it to allow your husband and other sons to continue in the troop." Why?

"District or Council cannot tell a CO or Troop who is allowed to attend meetings." Are you saying they can't tell them whether I can or cannot attend meetings? The letter revoking my membership stated that I must "sever all connections with scouting." The CO interpreted this to mean that I could not be at meetings or other scouting activities. After talking to someone from the council, he revised that to say that I can attend events where parents are generally invited, but not regular meetings, campouts, or other events. So, for example, I could attend the annual scout banquet on Friday night, but could not drive scouts to drop off scouting for food bags the next morning.

Thank you, ScoutNut. That was a helpful answer to my actual question. shortridge, that's why I haven't posted all the details. If my son and the troop leaders see themselves here, that's fine. Go back and read what I posted, the actual things I said, not a negative interpretation of them. I haven't said anything here that I wouldn't have said to their faces.

Nike, my husband and sons have friends in this troop and don't want to leave it. I'm not going to ask them to leave the troop for my sake, but if it becomes too painful for my husband to be there because of the eagle thing, he may quit being a leader. Thank you, John-in-KC. I have been looking for something like that. I'm not worried about getting into "deeper waters" because there really is no case against me. If they would do a background check on me, they would find nothing worse than a traffic ticket. As for hiring an attorney, it would probably not accomplish anything but making people at the BSA mad. As they say, they have the right to refuse membership to anyone and don't have to prove that I did anything wrong.