MattR

I want to talk about how to set up a bunch of scout units for success. But everything you used to use to solve this problem can't be used because, well, it's gone. Call it a thought experiment or call it reality, but here are the ground rules. Membership is down, all of your volunteers are new to scouting and don't have a lot of outdoor experience. You've got to get a small district up and running but there is no DE. You can have some media with information in it that would be useful to the new volunteers and scouts - sections of the handbook, field book, whatever you'd like. There can be one person with experience to help guide them, but they can only help a few hours a week. You can count on some camps that you can use and any money you need will have to be raised by the scouts, i.e., no more donations. If you're lucky you can find a list of old codgers that can help teach some skills now and then but they aren't going to do any heavy lifting, or camping in cold weather. You can't count on finding volunteers from local businesses or any other experts that will volunteer lots of time. The only volunteers you're going to get are parents of kids that want to be scouts. There will be no training, no camporees, no organized summer camp (but there will be some camps) Now, there is one premise you can build on. Scouts and adults can put up with a lot of bad news as long as they are having fun and moving forward (improving, growing, reaching their goals). If you get them started and going they will become self motivated and within a couple of years will be the volunteers that can come back and teach some skills. Your goal, should you decide to accept it, is to write a manual to be given to unit leaders on how to grow scouting. It has to be simple enough to get them started, have fun and make progress. It should have a way for units to help other units when they get stuck (because you can't help them). What would you do? I ask this because I think that's not too far off from where the BSA will be next year. The BSA will not provide help and councils won't do much either. Districts are also hurting.

Do you remember the early days of credit cards when a transaction consisted of putting the card and carbon paper into the slide gizmo that would imprint the card information onto the paper and then the clerk would write the totals in and you'd sign it? The cost of that was probably a few dollars per transaction. Now I tap my card against the reader. Rather than forms and signatures how about a driver's license and a phone app? Drive the price down so every school and church wants to use it as well. As people have said, CSA is likely widespread. So why not work on a global solution? I know, the BSA can't solve technical problems. But maybe if they tried they'd describe the problem they and all youth activities have to some companies that do these searches and just one of them would see an opportunity. This issue of background checks is not a fundamental problem. It's just a technical one. A bigger issue is changing adult perceptions consistently across the organization. Most scouters understand CSA but I've seen too many that think they know better about everything. That's okay when it comes to rank advancement but when they screw up and suddenly my troop no longer has a camp to use, it's a problem for all of us.

I googled costs to do a search on known sex offenders and it's anywhere from free to $5. Assuming that's close to correct, and just maybe the BSA could get a group discount or unlimited access for a reasonable price, I don't see the problem. At what price per adult per year for a tailored background check does the background issue go away?

Sounds like great fun. Well done. And your own meeting place where you can camp! Nice combination. My first troop had their own land with a cabin. I never thought much of it as a scout but now that sounds wonderful. Sounds like there's a reason you're growing. Thanks for the good news.

Sure, if suspected then it's a problem that should be brought to the attention of the court, where the truth can be found and a solution dispensed. However, that doesn't appear to be happening. Until we know for a fact that any of these things have happened they are nothing but rumors being used in the court of public opinion to sway votes. Honestly, if these rumors are not pursued in court then what else are they?

Therefore, nobody should whine about what Ken is doing, it's just part of the game. I think it's time for this thread to get back to what's happening in the court.

So, kossnoff has tweeted about passwords in the clear, lawyers might have quit the coalition, and things the coalition said might be illegal. And none of this has been raised with the court. Who's trying to sway the vote?

Welcome to the forum, @HtownScouter

Here's my ABSOLUTELY FREE, Brilliant idea of the day. For each MB write a companion pamphlet that a patrol can use to have fun/challenge/interest/service doing the subject of the MB. It would be similar to program features but would include requirements that would lead to a patch or ribbon for a patrol flag. Also, there would be no talking requirements, just doing as a patrol. Also, completing such a patrol badge would not imply anything about the associated MB. A lot of fun could go into making patrol badges. So, for art MB as an example, a service project could be for a patrol to paint a mural on a wall. For welding, a patrol could weld a frame for a soap box car. All the normally fun MBs would be easy to turn into a patrol badge. If nobody can think of how to make a patrol-MB for a normal MB, then maybe that MB needs reconsideration. That's the end of my brilliant idea. Do not use within 30 minutes of swimming. Do not take with grapefruit, grapefruit juice, or lima beans. Do not take while operating heavy machinery or while trying to cancel your cable subscription. Call a doctor immediately if, while using this idea, you start having hives, hot flashes or a desire to sing repeat after me songs.

Not sure if this means anything but our CO was hesitant from the start some 15-20 years ago about liability. Consequently, our COR has always been both an active parent in the troop as well as active in the church as well. They have taken the position seriously.

I read that page. It contains a lot of creative logic. Yes, the bsa is funding the largest sex abuse settlement, but there is a much larger group of claimants. So, yes, it is low. Either way, an interesting number that was on the posted dashboards is cost to run the council per youth served. One was around $300/yr/scout and the other was about $1000/yr/scout. Those are amazingly high numbers. For that much money I would expect membership to go up. Anyway, this seems to be where the rub is. I suspect the BSA says it requires so much money at the council level because of the high cost per scout and the TCC says it shouldn't cost that much. And yet neither side wants to defend their view. Anybody know why?

My kids used to play at the Leslie Groves park in Richland WA, the other plutonium manufacturing site. Fascinating history and still not cleaned up.

Is this comment worthy of a new thread?

I've always ignored them. Let's put it this way, if a problem really needs solving then the organization would turn its focus towards it. It would not need a new committee or group. The organization would be the committee. For example, any company that has a "quality committee" is not nearly as interested in quality as an organization that makes quality a day to day subject that everyone is involved in. It's not clear to me what the BSA's core product is. I'm not saying it has no focus, only that I don't know what it is.

As long as we're admitting fallibility: We thought we put it out. Then we put the garbage bag full of ashes in the back of the truck. Then we fanned it at 60 mph. Then we pulled over and took it out of the back of the truck as quickly as we could. But our lesson really was FREE! (No damage other than slight melting of truck bed liner) Humility is a hard skill to learn.

This wasn't brought up before very well. Thanks for that. Lawyers that don't represent their clients very well is wrong, but is it legally wrong? And if so, what are the consequences? Can it be proven and can the judge remove them from the table?

You're right, we still don't know the details. And as is typical, I don't think the BSA knows them either. It could be nefarious or it could be the usual, not very well thought out idea. It would have a lot more appeal if they had used the TCC's version. Instead, it's very coalition centric. Given how the voting is going, the optics are certainly not good.

I found pictures of them and they don't look related.

Is it just me or did anyone else get the vibe that this is advertising for the plan? TCC not at all part of this. Duration ends after voting is over. Regular meetings and probably regular reports. It will turn into the organization that the bsa and coalition agreed upon. Again, no TCC. No information about voting. While there is a fixed number of survivors on this board the bsa side has "at least 6". Disappointed again but still not surprised.

I'm glad I'm not a scout anymore. I would have been the token minority. I don't think anyone has thought through how those conversations will really happen. Peer pressure is rough and the minority scouts will mostly not be equipped to bring up tough issues in a good way. So they will just gloss over issues they barely understand themselves.

Why not have patrols compete against each other? We do that at every camporee.

Except in the BSA case he's not being grandiose enough? This thread seems to be nothing but attacking the character of one of the lawyers. Everyone, find something else to talk about.

You're right that nobody will get what they might and here's my explanation. Because it's a bankruptcy nobody is going to receive what they would if they're one of the first to go to court. There isn't enough money to cover that many cases. The argument now is what that total pot of money is. What hasn't been discussed is how it's going to be divided based on whether a state is open, closed or somewhere between. There are hints (different levels of grey) but the numbers are TBD. I think it's a tough ethical decision but ethics has little to do with bankruptcy.

Welcome to the forum, @DJ72

No, next week.