MaCraven

I'm so glad I posted. I've gained a lot of info I didn't know or didn't think about. We have a lot more options available to us than we realized. These postings have made me a little more brave about voicing my opinion w/ less tact than I've used before. In doing so, I've also recently realized that I have more allies in our pack than I knew. Before I didn't want to push to hard against the grain but now I figure what have I (or my sons) got to lose. I really don't want to pull my W2 out this late in the game with an established friend base in his den. Scout Nut, you had asked how my boys feel about their pack/dens. My W2 says the den mtgs are "ok but were better before". By "before" he means before we paired up with the other W1 den. In terms of his own den, he likes it, he has a good leader and I'm the asst. As for pack mtgs, he says "mostly boring, sometimes ok", he just likes to hang with his friends. My Wolf says the pack mtgs are boring and the den mtgs are "too crazy" (he does not mean it in a good way, he likes fun but hates chaos). I'm the asst in that den and we have some out of control kids (one being the leader's son). I try to keep things to a dull roar but am often undermined by the leader who says, "well there just being boys, it's ok" (while her son runs out of the room & up and down the halls). We'll see how this yr goes. At least if we move on next yr my second son will only be a bear. I'm not expecting to move mountains, just maybe chisel a little character into a boring square mountain. If not,..onward and forward.

Scout Nut & Scouting Mom, Thank You so Much!! Your posts were so helpful. We like the people in this pack and really don't want to jump ship yet but we've been so frustrated. DH was involved in the CA pack but said life was too short to deal with the whiners in this pack. "Chipping away at a mountain" is exactly how it feels, great analogy! When you see the potential of that mountain it makes it real hard to give up. Our CO is very much like Souting Mom's CO. He shows up for the pledge drive and rarely makes it to a round-up other than that he's a man in a nice costume. Our council is a little flaky too. We'd been to one res camp and one family camp, both huge disappoinments. It wasn't until recently that we found out that we could go to other council's activities. We did and it was great. As far as training, well I decided this past yr that I was taking that into my own hands. I have been getting parents YP cert'd and have decided on an outside council to do my BALOO. To give you an idea on how training is prioritized in our pack; they didn't have a pack trainer for 06-07 and when I offered I was told they'd get back to me. I've given some reminders but I'm still waiting. Scout Nut, I will keep working on your suggestions. However, every time this has been tried, CC brings the hammer down and puts an end to any ideas that are not her own. I realize it is not CC's job to make friends but it is her job to work in the best interest of ALL the boys not just her own preferences. Scouting Mom, you give me hope. Our pack sounds exactly as yours was. Thank you everyone

I'm sorry. I thought that my knowledge & involvment in the flag ceremony, the derby, and the committee would have made it clear that I am a trained leader (for 2 dens), and involved in various other facets. I also mentioned "we figured we'd just share ideas and maybe add some life to this stagnant pack" and there's obviously no other way to effect change than to be involved, so I figured my invovlment would be a given. I was just hoping someone might be able to shed light on some way to come across that may be get a better response from the powers that be. I feel like my hands are tied because they just are so stuck in running this pack with no life or excitment. I am not the only person involved in this pack who feels this way, however only two of us have spoken up and the other person left this yr (their son is a bear). The most frustrating thing is that they just won't listen to input, it's their way or the highway. Is this the way most packs are run?? Our CA pack was not, were they the exception to the rule? Isn't there supposed to be voting for majority rule at committee mtgs? Our CA pack was my only frame of reference and I'm just trying to figure out what the norm is? I understand I had the option of staying with the original pack but at the time I didn't feel it would make much sense to stay in the pack being the only wolf because it wouldn't be much of a den mtg. Next yr, we will move, if need be. Would mtg with Bears but working on our own acheivments / electives have been an option, just curious?

I'm not sure where to begin. My rant has been festering for 3 yrs. When we moved here we left a pack that we absolutely loved (excited, dedicated, involved leaders). After spring round-up we decided on an active outdoors type pack, to later be told that our son was the only wolf they had but another pack had more wolfs but only one (?). so we were switched to a different pack. From the first mtg it just didn't "fit" but we figured we'd just share ideas and maybe add some life to this stagnant pack (baby steps). EVERY idea was not even entertained, quickly dismissed as too much hassle, time, or effort. Even the very simple "Flashlight Flag Ceremony" w/ the four freedoms was barely tolerated. I was even asked, "Why can't you do just a regular one?" The Pinewood Derby has even been described as "too much time & effort". No fuss, no fan fair. The derby is done in an hour & 1/2! Actually, I think this past yr went for a whole 2 hrs because they "decided" that it wouldn't be so bad to actually race for 1st place, yet the boys were, again, not entered to district. They won't even participate in the Cub Scout Olympics. Most of the leaders & committee members can't wait for the pack mtg to end, like if it can't be crammed into 60 minutes they're going to implode, most of the parents feel the same way but most likely because they're bored to death (no skits, no jokes, no fun). I even had a leader back out of a really cool event because it was too far which was probably just as well, the 3 families that went were much more fun than a bunch of whiners. The problem is that, out of 30+ families/leaders, the whiners out number the scout focused people and many of the whiners call themselves leaders. I would just like to hear WOW, that sounds great, lets do it! or Hey, that would be a fun skit to get the families involved in! or Oh, the kids would love that! instead of Do we have to? Waahh It takes too long Waahh Its so much work Waahh Waahh Waahh Dont get me wrong, Im completely for KISS MIF but the limited amount of effort they are willing to put into the scouting experience is just ridiculous. I wouldnt even call it an experience. Then there is the committee,. what committee!?! There's just the CC, who allows people to speak and then does whatever fits his/her fancy with no regard to majority opinion. The job comes across as well, if I have to do this, Im doing it my way There's less than a handful of people in this pack who don't treat it like some parental torture they're forced to endure! I feel truly sorry for the boys because they really are not getting the full scout experience. I think weve tried to be a part of the team and have been very patient but were just at our wits end. Any ideas? Oh, also, a quick question; does the CC have ultimate power in his/her replacement or should there be a vote among the committee or between CC & CM? Thanks for allowing the rant. Any thoughts would be much appreciated.

Thank You!! I was under the impression that there were some major changes. It looks like they just changed some verbage and did some condensing. The electives weren't listed. Do you know if the electives changed? Thanks again,

Hello scouters! I'm in a bit of a qaundry. All of my bears went to day camp. We just recieved the list of acheivements/electives comleted at day camp. There's just one minor problem! The list is useless because they based it on the old bear book (prior to 2003). We've been trying to contact the person who made the list or anyone in our pack w/ a an old bear book but with no luck. Can anyone help? The activities weren't even listed so we can't even match them up. We tried interagating our boys but that was a wild goose chase. If someone has an old bear book (?-2002)maybe I can email the list and ask someone to cross ref. it for me? or even a phone call. Help!