Lodge 489

Just got back from Philmont. Only heard of one bear siting during our trek. A young male (around 250 pounds) was caught in Base Camp and transported up to the Baldy Town area and released. The next afternoon if showed up at Copper Park where we were camping. It was wandering around the meadow area east of the campsite where the trails from French Henry and Baldy Town come into camp. Our sister crew was coming into the meadow from Baldy Town and saw the bear. They got together and "looked big" - started yelling and screaming at the bear. The bear was about 25 yards away and just stared at them. All of the sudden another crew came into the meadow from the French Henry trail and ended up about 10 yards from the bear. The boys all started screaming bloody murder and they took off running in one direction and the bear took off running in the other direction. No harm except for the scared boys on the F.H. trail. We never considered carrying bear spray and probably wouldn't - however, do whatever makes you feel comfortable and safe. Have a great trek.

Just finished a trek at Philmont and wore Buck Naked - worked great!

At the District Round-table this month I heard two Scoutmasters and a Unit Commissioner get into a lively discussion about a young Life Scout. From what I understand he is twelve years old and just passed his Board of Review for Life last month. His Scoutmaster was telling the other Scoutmaster and UC that there is no way that he is going to let this boy earn his Eagle until he is 15 years old. He said that the boy will probably have all of his merit badges and Eagle Project completed by the end of next Summer when he is 13 years old. However, he said that he will never check him off on his Scoutmaster Conference or recommend him for Eagle until he's almost 15, so that his Eagle Court of Honor won't be until he's 15. I butted in the conversation and asked him if he had told the boy this and he said no - that he would keep "failing" him on the Unit Leader Conference requirement until he was older. The other Scoutmaster and the Unit Commissioner both agreed that there is no way that a 13 year old boy should be an Eagle Scout and that their had to be some way to keep them from obtaining it even if they met all of the qualifications. Their reasoning was is that it wouldn't be fair to the 13 year old - that the older Eagle Scouts wouldn't respect him for earning it while he was so young. They looked at it as if they were doing him a favor by holding him back until he was 15. First off, I have never heard of a boy earning his Eagle rank at 13 but I'm sure that there are some out there. My question is - can a Scoutmaster in fact refuse to recommend a boy for Eagle just because they think that he's too young - even if he's earned all the requirements? It will be interesting to follow this conversation at our future Round-tables as I'm sure it will come up again.

While I was attending a training event at the Philmont Training Center four years ago one afternoon I got to sit in on a discussion with the folks who were going through Venture Crew Leader training for the week. The couple teaching the class said that the number one problem that they had when camping with their Crew, was at night keeping the boys and girls out of each other's tents. There were probably another five or six crew leaders who spoke up and said the same thing. You put boys and girls that age together and the hormones are going to kick in. So, to say that sex isn't an issue - just take a look at the "challenges" that some crews have and you will realize it is.

The National Council is comprised of the following members: All members of its Executive Board Members of the Regional Executive Committee Local Council Representatives (president and council commissioner plus an additional member for every 5,000 youth members) Members at large elected by the National Council for 1 year terms Honorary (non-voting) members as elected by the National Council for 1 year terms.

Schools will not sponsor units unless you also allow atheists in - it's not just the ban on homosexuals.

Brewmeister may be right (I guarantee in the first press conference after the ruling, some tool will utter the words: This is a good start, but we have more work to do.) based upon this news story. It's interesting to see how a group that was OK with the proposed changes is now saying that they aren't enough - that every CO must implement this proposed policy. Furor Over Proposed Shift In Scouts No-Gays Policy By DAVID CRARY, AP National Writer Thursday, January 31, 2013 NEW YORK (AP) The Boy Scouts of America faces intensifying criticism from the left and right over a proposal to move away from a mandatory no-gays membership policy and allow troop sponsors to decide the matter for themselves. The Human Rights Campaign, a major gay-rights group that initially welcomed the BSA's possible shift, said Thursday that it was inadequate and demanded that the Scouts adopt a nationwide policy to accept gays as scouts and adult leaders. The HRC said corporations that continued to donate funds to the Scouts if any troops were allowed to discriminate would lose points in an annual evaluation of how major employers deal with gay-related workplace issues. Meanwhile, conservative groups which support the long-standing no-gays policy asked their followers to flood BSA headquarters with phone calls opposing any change, Tony Perkins, president of the conservative Family Research Council, urged callers to persist even if they couldn't get through at first. "The BSA national leadership were not prepared for the thousands of Americans who were shocked to hear that an organization that could always be counted on for standing for what's right was about to cave in to homosexual activists and corporations," Perkins said in an emailed appeal. "It is so important that you keep the pressure on, to show them how devastating this moral collapse will be for the Scouts and the country," he said. Similar appeals were made by other conservative groups across the country. The Boy Scouts, who emphatically reaffirmed the no-gays policy just seven months ago, announced on Monday that they were considering a major change. Instead of mandatory exclusion of gays, the different religious and civic groups that sponsor Scout units would be able to decide for themselves how to address the issue either maintaining the exclusion or opening up their membership. The proposal is expected to be discussed, and possibly voted on, at a meeting of the Scouts' national executive board next week in Texas. Deron Smith, the Scouts' national spokesman, declined comment on the Human Rights Campaign's announcement and also denied reports that the Scouts were taking a poll to gauge public sentiment on the controversy. "When we receive calls we allow people to provide feedback, but if the board decides to address this topic, it will be about what is in the best interest of Scouting," Smith said. "Regardless of what people think about this issue, America needs Scouting." Many Scout units are sponsored by relatively conservative religious denominations notably the Roman Catholic Church, the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, and Southern Baptist churches. Catholic and Mormon leaders have withheld official comment on the proposal, but Southern Baptist officials have criticized it. The Rev. Albert Mohler, president of the Southern Baptist Theological Seminary, wrote in a blog post that the new policy "is almost sure to please no one and to lead to disaster for the Scouts." "Those pressing for a reversal of the national policy are not likely to be satisfied with a local option," he wrote. "They had demanded a national policy mandating the full inclusion of homosexuals throughout Scouting at every level. "On the other side, those who wanted the current policy to remain in place will now have to reconsider any relationship with the Boy Scouts," Mohler added. "The scale of potential membership loss to the Boy Scouts of America is staggering." Fred Sainz, a vice president of the Human Rights Campaign, said Scout board members now needed to decide "what kind of America they want to be a part of" one that frowns on all discrimination or tolerates a degree of it. "The board has to make a decision one way or another," he said. "The policy proposal they're considering makes the problem worse, not better." The Human Rights Campaign's president, Chad Griffin, likened the proposed policy change "to a national restaurant chain saying that it will not discriminate at its corporate headquarters, but allow local restaurants to discriminate at will." To back up its stance, Griffin's organization said it would change the criteria for its annual Corporate Equality Index. To receive a perfect score, companies would have to prohibit philanthropic giving to civic organizations that have a written policy of anti-gay discrimination, or permit its chapters, affiliates, or troops to do so. Amid pressure from petition campaigns, two corporations UPS Inc. and Merck & Co. announced last year they were halting donations to the Scouts until the no-gays policy was changed. For 2011, UPS donated more than $85,000 and Merck gave $30,000 to the BSA and $10,000 to a regional Scout council.

I have found the link that you requested: http://www.gcumm.org/news/2013/01-29/statement-regarding-boy-scouts-of-americas-proposed-changes

I only have the actual email that was sent out to the Scouting Ministry Specialist. I will try to find out if they have posted it somewhere and report back.

The General Commission of the United Methodist Men (which oversees all Scouting for the UMC) has just released the following statement regarding BSA's policy change. It will be left up to each local church to determine whether or not they will allow gays and lesbians into Scouting - either as a youth or a leader. Statement from GCUMM Gilbert Hanke, top staff executive of the General Commission on United Methodist Men, says that both he and Larry Coppock, national director of scouting ministries, were consulted by the leadership at the highest levels of BSA prior to the proposal to change membership requirements. Basically this proposed change removes a national membership requirement dealing with sexual orientation and allows those decisions to be made at a local level consistent with charter organizations perspectives, said Hanke. The United Methodist Book of Discipline clearly supports the rights and liberties for all persons, regardless of sexual orientation. In 2012, 6,700 United Methodist congregations enriched the lives of 363,876 young people through 10,868 Cub Scout packs, Boy Scout troops and Venturing crews. We consider our scouting program as a ministry to the community and a way to provide the spiritual and emotional care of a fellowship that enables reconciling relations with God, with others, and with self (2012 Book of Discipline 161F), said Hanke. These proposed changes will allow local churches to reflect those tenets in their membership requirements. It does not force changes, but allows local churches control over these requirements. These proposed changes are actually more consistent with the current Book of Discipline, Hanke concluded.

The General Commission of the United Methodist Men (which oversees all Scouting for the UMC) has just released the following statement regarding BSA's policy change. It will be left up to each local church to determine whether or not they will allow gays and lesbians into Scouting - either as a youth or a leader. Statement from GCUMM Gilbert Hanke, top staff executive of the General Commission on United Methodist Men, says that both he and Larry Coppock, national director of scouting ministries, were consulted by the leadership at the highest levels of BSA prior to the proposal to change membership requirements. Basically this proposed change removes a national membership requirement dealing with sexual orientation and allows those decisions to be made at a local level consistent with charter organizations perspectives, said Hanke. The United Methodist Book of Discipline clearly supports the rights and liberties for all persons, regardless of sexual orientation. In 2012, 6,700 United Methodist congregations enriched the lives of 363,876 young people through 10,868 Cub Scout packs, Boy Scout troops and Venturing crews. We consider our scouting program as a ministry to the community and a way to provide the spiritual and emotional care of a fellowship that enables reconciling relations with God, with others, and with self (2012 Book of Discipline 161F), said Hanke. These proposed changes will allow local churches to reflect those tenets in their membership requirements. It does not force changes, but allows local churches control over these requirements. These proposed changes are actually more consistent with the current Book of Discipline, Hanke concluded.

Our District will soon be holding its Annual Business Meeting. All registered District Members at Large and Chartered Organization Representatives are eligible to vote on District nominees. I am a Chartered Org Rep but will not be able to attend this meeting due to a work conflict. My question is will I be able to provide my proxy to a registered Scouter from one or our organization's units so that they can vote?

perdidochas - I agree with you about the maturity level of the boys. I guess that they could earn the A of L award in the 4th grade and still stay for another year as a Webelos Scout while they're in the 5th grade. Based upon everyone's feedback what my Committee Chair and I are looking at doing for next year is the following: We plan on introducing a tried and proven "one year curriculum" for a boy to earn his Arrow of Light that was provided to us at the Council training workshop. We would expect (and hope) that most, if not all of those boys that actually earn their AoL would come back to the Webelos program for the next year and help provide leadership to that Den. Another benefit of this "one year curriculum" would be if a boy joins the pack as a 5th grader, then we will have a proven program in place that we can present to him and his parents. It will show them that if they will just follow the guidelines then that boy can still earn his Arrow of Light award, even if his missed his entire 4th grade year as a Webelos. Any feedback?

perdidochas; Prior to ever starting his fourth grade school year a boy would have already been a Webelos since the day after his last school day as a third grader. Most boys turn 10 years old while they are in the fourth grade - some toward the beginning and some later. So, if a boy turns 10 in October of his fourth grade school year, then six months later he would be eligible for his Arrow of Light award. That would be in the month of April and he would still be in the fourth grade. Also, if I read it right, the requirement that you quoted is not a "this AND that" requirement - it's a "this OR that" requirement. Maybe I'm interpreting it wrong. Again, I'm just asking for feedback on this matter because it was something new to us, and I thank everyone for their input. I don't think that this is just a one person renegade program that some pack is running in our council as there were quite a few people from different councils in attendance who said that they had implemented this.(This message has been edited by Lodge 489)

So, I would assume the site the quote he showed you that states "A Webelos Scout who has earned the Arrow of Light Award has now completed all the requirements for the Scout badge and may join a Boy Scout troop." May simply be outdated information. _________________________ No, it's from the current official BSA website. It's titled "Improved Webelos Transition" and this is the program that they covered with us. Like one of the above posts states, they told us that all the LDS Packs have only a one year Webelos program and that is what they're now recommending that we all implement if possible because of their success with it. Here's the link to the info and it's the fourth paragraph: http://www.scouting.org/scoutsource/BoyScouts/ImprovedWebelosTransition.aspx