johndaigler

I'm not sure I know where to begin... why is it that some on the left hate being called liberals?... But you have showed your cards, so I know where you stand. So much for "speaking well." BrentAllen, start with my PM, then reread my post. If you're referring to me as "on the left" then you don't have a strong enough understanding of me to call me anything, and since you use the term "liberal" in a negative manner, I prefer you not use it with me. My last post didn't show any "cards", I gave a negative example of how labels are inappropriate, overly-generalized and are used when we run out of energy for IDEAS. (Apparently, it was an effective example.) Labels are a lazy way to avoid thinking about what ideas are being shared and the thinking that goes into those ideas. If we sum up people as "liberal" or "conservative" or whatever, then we mentally ball up their ideas and throw them in a pile. We don't give them the individual consideration such ideas deserve. Labels lead us to overly generalized, unsubstanciated, aggressive, personally insulting, verbal goo like the following: Maybe because conservatives take the phrase "Timeless Values" to be more than just a bumper sticker, and liberals appear to want to do away with timeless (traditional) values. jd

That's a whole new thread -- Is "Pirates" an appropriate theme? What's next: "Gangsters?"; "Pillaging Barbarians?"; maybe "Dread Lazer Taggers??". But, Alas, I'm a lowly Pack Trainer (One of several hats - obviously. You can't make decent living nowadays just being a Pack Trainer!) and not the Council's Day Camp Themer (Which, BTW, is quite the good gig, if you can get it!), so I merely run around screaming, "It's the Program! Learn it - Love it!!!" Now, I'm off to contact all these publishers, so I can try to do this the right way before I face the moral dilemma of whether to do it even if I don't get the proper permissions . . . jd

I just want to make sure I have the rules down correctly: A conservative's answer to a liberal's question, which the liberal doesn't like, is a screed and a rant. O.K., I think I've got it. Sorry, BrentAllen, apparently you don't have the rules down correctly. If you did, your post would have read more along the lines of: "I just want to make sure I have the rules down correctly: I answer LisaBob's question, Lisabob doesn't like my answer, so it's a screed and a rant. O.K., I think I've got it." See, the labels take away the personal responsibility we each have to others. If it's just "conservatives" and "liberals" hammering away, then there aren't any real people so it's OK to be rude and inaccurate. Idealogies don't have any feelings so the Scout Law doesn't really apply. Of, course, ideologies don't have any intellect either so they offer only a very little to real people. You're right, when posters use the terms "screed" and "rant" about your posts there are negative connotations. But they're personal - specific to you. They're something to be worked out between you and them. Nobody's innacurately criticising whole groups based on the actions of individuals. You have a problem with Lisabob, tell her - don't insult me. I'm offended by being labeled a "Liberal" the way you use the word. It shows your lack of understanding of me; and given how you use it, it also shows an intent to insult. Your use of the term for me would be akin to me using the term "redneck" for you -- similarly, showing a lack of understanding of the person and an intent to insult -- even without knowing how you feel about the word. Those kinds of labels represent a lazy, but aggressive, way to think and communicate. Let's stay away from them and try to focus on ideas. jd

mdcpcare, WELCOME!!! Interesting idea, there's no reason not to go ahead with it, but -- couldn't you simplify your life by meeting new Webelos in your own Council? A more distant Camp makes boys and parents that much less comfortable. Any issues would be that much harder to resolve. Your Council can't be so small that you know all the other Webelos. The more distant trip would be more expensive, wouldn't it? jd

Great thread, guys. Thanks. jd

Kaji, I agree with most of what you said, and most of your intentions. Just remember, for the Cubs, the standard is "Do Your Best". For one 4th grader, thinking "broken leg >> splint" is his best, for another "broken leg >> get out of road >> splint" is his best. The trick is to set the bar high enough that each boy can accomplish his best -- you just have to have an adjustable bar!! Though I commend challenging the boys, perhaps your bar starts a bit high -- splinting broken bones isn't exactly Webelos-level first-aid. Similarly, combining the "hurry " first aid situations and asking for judgement calls is a high bar. Remember, their first-aid to date might well have been limited to band-aids and "tell what to do in the case of ..." For many (most?!?) 10 year old boys - a good learning level of first-aid is to identify the pothole and suggest not running into it because they might break their leg!! jd (This message has been edited by johndaigler)

Welcome, Steve!!! ScoutNut is right on target. 'nuff said! My $0.02 >> The Webelos Program is ideal for "farming out" Activity Pin leadership. That is, check your local: >>YMCA to find "Aquanaut" programs >>Americorps (American Red Cross) to find "Readyman" classes >>Forest Preserves/State Parks for Naturalist, Geologist, Forester, -- ours even does Engineer >>Schools for Artist, Athlete, Fitness, and Sportsman "teachers" >>Scout Troops for Merit Badge Counselors who might be interested in leading the appropriate Webelos Activity Pin work >>etc, etc Believe me, there will be enough for you to do also, but Activity Pin advisors are a bit of a cross toward Merit Badge Counselors. Working with new adults as a Den is a great step toward working with new adults as an individual Scout pursuing a merit badge. Having the Webelos themselves make a few of these contacts is a great learning opportunity (hint -- practice with the Scout and prep the person being called!) OK, here's a few more pennies of thought to consider: >>Plan ahead and think about appropriate weather for each activity -- if your pool is indoors it doesn't matter when you do Aquanaut; if it's outdoors, . . . >>Search for, and browse, Webelos threads here at Scouter.com >>Ask tons of questions! >>Check out G2SS (Guide to Safe Scouting) and notice which activities are approved for Webelos that they couldn't do as younger Cubs >>Find out your Crossover Date and start planning backwards >>Become best friends with some of the ASMs at the local Troop -- camp and play and learn with the Boy Scouts as often as appropriate! >>Find out the dates for Webelos Woods and other Webelos focused activities >>Don't always think in whole "Pins" -- Consider a bit here and bit there. It might be a record keeping burden, but your Webelos are still only 9 or 10 and wear out (physically and mentally!) sooner than you think. >>Get a good feeling for your role in the Pack and be seen as the leaders, teachers, and exemplars that Webelos should be! >>Pick a Den Mascot -- enough of that Den number stuff -- YOU'RE WEBELOS!! Have Fun! jd

As we prepare for Day Camp 2006, I've collected a CD worth of Camp (Pirate Theme) songs and stories. I own all the CDs the individual pieces come from. Several are BSA products, and others were purchased retail. But I think I'm on thin ice - perhaps a couple of times - and I don't want to pirate my Pirate songs. Can anyone point me in the correct direction to find a layman's explanation of the appropriate music copyright rules? My original thought was to burn a CD for every boy who registers - sort of a promoter/motivator/souvenir/momento, etc. It's a long drive to Day Camp and we require each boy to supply a carpool driver/camp chaperone for one day. I thought the themed CD would come in handy in the car to and from. I'm considering selling them for the price of Day Camp ($100) and throwing in a free trip to Day Camp with each CD purchased. Another thought was to burn enough of them to use as thank you's to the Scouts and Scouters who volunteer and/or work Day Camp. Any ideas?? jd

My "SWMBO" willingly eats chip crumbs -- quite enjoys them actually -- I think I may have married her for this reason -- er, amongst many other reasons, er, obviously!!!

Good Luck -- don't surprise anyone with your selections. Take the time to preview with ALL the appropriate church leadership. I'd be interested to hear how it goes, and if you can get your non-Lutheran boys to attend (and participate?) and how Church leadership responds to your efforts and choices. I think there are many Units out there a little shy of Scout Sunday and Scout Shabbat. Your sharing will help us all with our Reverent efforts. jd

I definitely reach for a new bag of chips -- Do you really think that potato chip crumbs and bits taste the same as nice, big, roundish, whole chips?????? Not even close! Other than that, let's empty those boxes, kids (ya you, the 6 and 9 year year olds standing in my pantry!)!!! AND THEN take the six seconds needed to throw out the inner bag and fold up the box for recycling!) -- there are few things wackier than 6 boxes of cereal open at one time, but one of them is 3 empty boxes sitting on the shelf next to 3 open boxes!!! If my space wasn't cluttered, I wouldn't be able to find things!! jd

Lisa'bob, Thank you for your participation in this thread. Your intelligent, cool-headed discussion adds greatly - not just to the conversation, but to all of our efforts to meet your high standard of careful thought and respectful manners. That being said (and heart-felt), I'm not lisa'bob and I tire of the "Issues and Poitics" forum as a place without manners, respect or good thinking. Free speech is a powerful tool, let's not weaken it by overuse of labels and over-generalized, under-thought rhetoric. It's possible to debate, disagree, and even argue, without calling out or insulting those who disagree with us. I think we feed the rhetoric-asauri when we try to create archetypal truths from individual incidents. Singular events (like the 2000 Dem convention speak little as to how "democrats", "liberals", "Californians", "homosexuals", "whites", "blacks", "hispanics", "middle-aged politically connected people" or anyone else feel about Scouts, the Flag, the Convention process, or anything else. On that day, those 50 people felt that way about that moment. That moment speaks even less to the "Quality" of followers of different political agendas. IMHO, we'll be better served when we can stop summing people up with these labels -- conservative, liberal, red, blue, etc. They mean little and are almost ALWAYS used to negatively sum up an individual (or a state) so as to disregard their complicated contextual content as simple, one-dimensional and flawed. A "conservative"?? A "liberal"?? A "red" state?? A "blue" state?? This is dumbing down politics, issues and ideas. If one of our goals is to help young men grow into good citizens then we ought to teach them to fight back against these days of "sound-bite" Truths, and see ideas as more powerful than labels - to see facts as more powerful (and more useful to the general good) than opinions. The fact that 50,000 Ohioans voted Republican probably doesn't give this administration a mandate from God. Yet, when we talk about liberals, conservatives, reds and blues -- then it becomes unfortunately simple ------ I'm right, you're wrong; let's not let ideas and facts get in our way. And, BTW, not only are you wrong, but everyone in my state agrees with me that you're evil because 50 people onced booed the Boy Scouts, and WE KNOW you're just like them! Around here we use the "Issues and Politics" thread to speak freely. That's fine, but we need to stop thinking of "opinions" as "ideas", and over-generalized demagoguery as Truth. Speaking freely has little to do with speaking well. It's possible to argue ideas without lowering our behavior. But that's just my opinion... jd

Hi all, Aren't we spending too many brain cells on relatively ancient history? I think we feed the rhetoric-asauri when we try to create archetypal truths from individual incidents. That singular event speaks little as to how "democrats", "liberals", "Californians", "homosexuals", "whites", "blacks", "hispanics", "middle-aged politically connected people" or anyone else feel about Scouts, the Flag, the Convention process, or anything else. On that day, those 50 people felt that way about that moment. That moment speaks even less to the "Quality" of followers of different political agendas. IMHO, we'll be better served when we can stop summing people up with these labels -- conservative, liberal, red, blue, etc. They mean little and are almost ALWAYS used to negatively sum up an individual (or a state) so as to disregard their complicated contextual content as simple, one-dimensional and flawed. A "conservative"?? A "liberal"?? A "red" state?? A "blue" state?? This is dumbing down politics, issues and ideas. If one of our goals is to help young men grow into good citizens then we ought to teach them to fight back against these days of "sound-bite" Truths, and see ideas as more powerful than labels - to see facts as more powerful (and more useful to the general good) than opinions. But that's just my opinion, jd

Lex, WELCOME! Is the Church the CO? Are all your boys Lutheran? Can you (Should you?) step outside the traditional service texts to embrace Scouts who are not members of the Church? You can find examples of "Scout's Own" services at: http://www.scouter.com/compass/Leaders_Resource/Chaplain_Resources/ http://www.kidslist.uc.edu/kidslist/gs/neil/scown.html http://www.macscouter.com/ScoutsOwn/ http://www.dacbsa.org/CC_RR/RR-scout's-own.htm http://www.geocities.com/SoHo/Square/6487/CF_poemtitles.htm http://www.pinetreeweb.com/sctsown.htm Whatever your answers to the above questions, I think you'll find something helpful. Good Luck, jd

BaldEagle, WELCOME!!! Just as Scoutnut sent you to your council's website - you should go visit neighboring Councils' sites. 4 hours is a long way - I'm sure that would cross into neighboring councils. Your own Council should be able to help you with this -- or try the national BSA site and plug in zip codes just outside your Council's borders. If there isn't a training planned, go talk to your Council/District Training Chairs and see if they can pull one together for you -- expecially if you help organize it, and gather some other Scouters to make the class worth their efforts. Because Cub Leader turnover is so great it's good to have several Outdoor trained leaders. Another alternative is to see if they have BALOO already scheduled and work with them to add WOLT to the occasion. -- Again, volunteer to be supportive and it might tip the balance. Good Luck - have fun! jd

Great job, msnowman!!! Move that "Good Deed" coin to the other pocket!!!!!!!! jd

The thing I like about repeated electives is the demonstration of growth, -- and the boys creating, accepting and overcoming, a challenge they set for themselves. I think it gives the boys a real-life demonstration of what we're all about. And the boy usually gets that he's showing he's growing up and able to improve upon his last effort. I understand Jerry's comment -- and I like the idea of showing effort in a different content/context area. I think both situations show that the boy is growing. jd

Sorry, CMJ, but the Cubs can't use the unused pieces of Bear Badge Achievements. The Bear Cubs are told this on pp. 6 and 180 of their handbook. jd

scottteng, WELCOME! I agree FUN is truly important, but there are times and places for fun. Not to draw too dark a line, but if the local pastor has a few announcements at the end of a Sunday service and your boys break out into this song -- is that a good thing? Or at school? IMHO, "FUN" can't be our ONLY criteria for what we're doing with Cub Scouts. There's just a time and a place and a "quality" for good fun. I doubt your Pack Meeting, or anyone else's, relies on this song for the evening's FUN. There would be much greater issues to discuss, if that were true! Pack (and Den) meeting's have many opportunities for FUN -- if there's a feeling in funscout's crowd that this song goes overboard, why keep it sacred? I think funscout's crowd are better served finding their fun in the "purposeful" activities they're doing each meeting. jd

eager2learn, WELCOME!!! Bike rodeos come in all sizes, shapes and styles. Plan it yourself or with another group. I'd think that unless you're using the older boys to lead events - the activities may need to be different for the various age groups. Wear helmets, Have fun!!! jd

The Cub Scout Outdoor Activity Award is intended to be worn on the Cub shirt's right pocket flap. Does it matter if the shirt is blue or tan? Can the patch be placed on the red vest? jd

BTW, DenLeader10, The birdbath project is also an optional requirement for the CS Acad. & Sports "Wildlife Conservation" Pin. It's a whole other discussion whether to use one project for two different requirements, but given that I don't think it really is the best option for that Wolf Elective, I'd certainly be sure to count it for the WC Pin. jd

WELCOME, BobT!!! jd

Nice move -- can you do that to music????

WELCOME, JayHawk!! Laminating would be done as a memory preserver? Interesting . . . jd