Stosh

I didn't wait until after they screwed around on the job. They were told up front what was needed to keep the job. They didn't need a SMC for me to tell them again, they already knew they were going to get left in the dust. I had boys even refuse leadership positions because they knew they weren't going to be able to do a good job for the others. At least by cutting to the chase right from the beginning, a lot of hassles can be avoided. I should also mention that I don't fire the leadership, the boys do it. If their PL isn't doing the job, they simply hold an election and get a new one in. With one patrol there's no SPL, but we did have a change of PL leadership a couple of weeks ago.

I'm not focusing in one the maturity of the scouts in as much as the leadership/training maturity of the boys called to lead. Suppose you had never been expected to teach a class of 40 junior high school students and now you have to and you went to college to be a forester, not a teacher.... Good luck with that. It's not just the "students/scouts" or just the "teacher/(S)PL" it's a combination of both. What we have in most scout troops is immature leaders trying to lead immature scouts. BP felt that handling 5-7 other boys was a pretty fair handful for any fledgling leader. I tend to agree with him. Being SPL and trying to run a troop of 25 boys? I would NEVER put any of my boys in a position to do that. That's why I think the patrol-method is necessary before even considering being a boy-led operation. A good SPL should be able to handle 5-6 PL's under his wing with each of the 6 PL's having 8 boys under their wings which would make a troop of 50 boys with everyone's responsibility well within their maturity and comfort levels.

Most people feel they are called by their God to do the ministry they have the gifts for. That decision cannot be made by another. If one pounds hard enough they can get a square peg in a round hole, but in the long run it's going to work out very well.

Better to wear out than rust out.

I can guarantee you don't teach 6th, 7th, or 8th graders.... I would guarantee the maturity level of a college student is not found very often in a Boy Scout troop.

BSA can do what it wants, if I have one boy bullying or sexually harassing another boy, he's out of the troop. That's been my policy long before the homosexual issue was politically correct. I was a CA for 15 years and I didn't tolerate any bullying or sexual harassment from anyone whether they were homosexual or heterosexual. BSA has it's policies, I have mine. If anyone in my units does not feel safe and comfortable, the reason for that discomfort or danger is removed, no second chances. As long as the youth know that up front, there shouldn't be a problem. I have held that standard for the past 45 years working with youth and never had the experience of removing a participant from any of the programs I have worked with.

I'm having trouble wrapping my head around this issue. The SPL and ASPL are trying to run a troop of 25 boys. Good luck with that. A highly trained professional teacher would have a fit with a classroom of that size and they can demand compliance with a snap of a finger or the evil eye. And you expect an immature boy to be able to do that? That is how one sets boys up to fail. 10 seconds after seeing an SPL with electronics that are not allowed, he wouldn't be SPL anymore. He is totally unable to lead by example. No one's listening to the ASPL, now the SPL? No problem have the SPL direct all the PL's to take charge of their boys and get organized as a patrol. Your comments never mentioned the PL's doing anything. It's about time they start. If one has a boy-led program it HAS to be patrol-method. The group of responsibility is too large otherwise. The new SPL is there to help the PL's get their patrols in order, not do it for them. The PL's need to step up or be replace on the spot. Otherwise let them wallow in their ineptitude. It's not the SPL's job to babysit patrol members, just PL's. So, what's the issue here? First of all there is a total lack of leadership skill showing at all. Marginal management skills are there, but not sufficient to handle that large of a crowd. Here's how it works. Friday night, the SPL directs (management) the PL's to separate themselves from each other and set up patrol camps. No more troop camping. PL's are now responsible to take care of their boys. If they need help, send their APL over to get the SPL. So the APL shows up and asks for the SPL's assistance. He goes over to the patrol and the PL says Johnny won't help out with anything. SPL confirms that Johnny isn't doing anything. Asks PL what he wants him to do about it. SPL is there to assist the PL, not do his job for him. PL says he doesn't know. SPL says when he figures it out, send the APL to fetch him. Until the boys realize the game is self-responsibility, they are all going to slack off. When no one shows up to feed them, tuck them into bed and read them a bedtime story, they will quit acting like invalids. If we are expecting the boys to grow up into manhood, it is a good time to quit coddling them like infants and expect them to man up. As long as there are adults there to be their personal chef and valet, they are not going to lift a finger. Heck, if I were to be waited on hand and foot, I'd slack off too. Boy-led only works in the patrol-method troops. The reason you think it works better in the smaller troops is because a troop of 8 boys is really only a patrol. When one gets up to 25 boys there has to be 3-4 PL's working to make it work.

Find another fundraiser that doesn't involve being in the sun. Tell the parents that if they want a plane wash, they need to do it on their own time, but with the situation as is, it's too risky for crew members. You'll have to be the parent for the kids...and for their parents.

I have a boat load of experience with just about anything BSA has to offer, former EMT-A, ministry, camping, fishing, hiking, canoeing, 45 years of working with youth, 35 of them in Scouting, etc. etc. etc. and I don't teach anyone but boys. No WB, no NYLT, no basic training, nothing. I don't even do U of Scouting anymore. By the time one gets through the politics, it just isn't worth it. When I get done with Scouting, it's going to be just me and the Mrs. and she's just as trained as I am. So we'll just go and have a good time instead. The Mrs. likes a glass of wine when she sits by the fire. That's the only thing I have to remember.

@@robhixkg welcome to the forum. Have them and their spouses over for a backyard picnic. Make sure the spouses are recognized for their sacrifice as well!

Conduct is a result of one's orientation.

In my state both open and conceal carry is allowed. No permit to open carry, permit required for conceal carry. It's kinda interesting how when you buy a coat, you need a permit. But then just because we have legislators who honor the 2nd Amendment doesn't mean they are exempt from making stupid laws. I used to do historical reenacting. Traveling in the car the gun needed to be in a case, but if I carried a gun in a case away from the car it was illegal, but if I took it out of the case and walked into a school, it was okay. In the winter, I had to be sure my coat was opened so my handgun and sword would be visible. What's the sense of a winter coat if you can't button it? It is just easier to get the permit and not worry about it. One needs to remember that the spouse needs the permit too. If you leave your gun loaded in the glove box and she's driving, she could be in big trouble.

Dating in the crew is not a YPT issue? Guys and gals can tent together all they want? It has nothing to do with the sexual orientation of those involved.... Yeah right. I always thought that YPT has EVERYTHING to do with the sexual orientation of those involved. They must have gotten special dispensation exceptions for the gays.

This is why conceal carry. More and more of this stuff is happening as our society fragments into small intolerant sects. Next thing you know it we'll be back to feudal/tribal petty tyranny once again.

OMG, the Minions are swearing in front of little kids. Step away from the burgers and fries! All one has to do is THINK it's bad language to make it so in our intolerant society. Free speech has just been crossed off the Bill of Rights in our Constitution, we're down to 9 and working on the rest.

Point taken...@@MrBob I do have to give him credit, however, if it was me and a hammock, all one would see in the picture is grass and dirt.

I no longer do business with a number of national accounts because of their stand on squelching free speech in America. They can keep their Chinese made products, The price I pay extra is the cost of doing business correctly, not politically.

Love the view, but if you sit up next time before taking the picture, I wouldn't have a crick in my neck now.

Welcome to the forum, @@Langstroth

YPT handled situation. If a scouter gets kicked out for inappropriate touching of a scout, the same holds true for another scout.

Roses? What roses, I don't see or even smell any roses. Gotta go.....

And if the tackle didn't work because the muscles were frozen, they could both be dead. #1 rule of emergency medical rescues is don't endanger yourself or there will be two rescues needed.

Yep they've trashed the meaning of a lot of perfectly good words over the years, too. I still get called on the carpet for using words like homosexual, Negro, Indian, etc. Well, they never were offensive words until someone out of the blue said they were. Well, people, I'm white, I'm male, I'm not handicapped, so in order to no longer offend me, you can just call me Your Highness and kiss my... ah... er.... ring. Yeah, ring, that's the ticket. So to take a perfectly good historical icon and trash it seems to be a bit off base. I guess I'll just keep trashing the anti-Indian, anti-Negro flag of today, you know the one our valiant soldiers died trying to defend, EXCLUDING of course those who fought under the CSA's battle flag. Their flag is a disgrace today and so is the soldier's reason for dying for it.

One doesn't need to do a solo expedition into the rain forest of the Amazon or a solo trek to the North Pole here. I'd say five to ten miles into some nature preserve one has in just about every state in the union. Around where I live I can find hundreds of places where I can get off the road far enough to not have to listen to the drone of traffic all night long. A little solitude relying on the skills I have learned to make/put up shelter, build a fire, cook eat and be comfortable with nature for just one night. Listen and journal all the things I normally miss on a backpacking trek and maybe learn something new about myself along the way. For a change of pace, I'll canoe/kayak a river and camp along the way on a sand bar doing the same old thing I do in the woods, but maybe fish a bit, too. I do it all the time, have since I was 12 years old, couple times a year. It's the best medicine in the world for tension headaches and high blood-pressure.

Totally, totally disagree with this statement. When a volunteer steps up it becomes a way of life and a mission to serve. Kapeesh?