Stosh

The topic of this thread is troop treasurer and the contact person for the boys would be the Scribe because part of that POR is handling of the troop money. I'm sure the year end reports to the committee would be handled by the scribe as well as would any correspondence and administrative tasks such as lining up O/A elections, summer camp registration, cabin reservations, and such but those duties wouldn't fall under the conversation of the thread.

We had a camporee on an desolate island once. The port-a-potties on the barge was the real scouting touch. Biggest complaint was having to haul in water. I think the next year it was suggested we do a Holiday Inn camporee.

What's the privacy issue if the money all belongs to the CO? If there seems to be a "privacy" issue involved here, then I would be calling for an audit and honesty check all the way around on how the books are cooked in that unit. If the scouts are to be given the responsibility (POR) to do a job, they should also be given the authority to do it. Otherwise, just wear the patch for six months and don't worry about it. This is the #1 reason why I NEVER take on the responsibility of being a treasurer for any organization. I have been asked many times and I 100% decline.

My only concern would be when all the checks and balances one goes through before being awarded the Eagle rank. This could be a problem......

Two kids in the ax yard at the same time?! Teaching the younger boy to sharpen an ax without securing it first? He's going to sharpen that unsecured ax in his lap with a file and no protective gloves? Boy am I glad that the boys in that picture are not scouts!

However, if the funeral home has a crematorium, one could do pizza for the whole district.....

After one has done their part, if the next group let's it fail, it's not their problem anymore, they have moved on. I had a director of education come to me in a panic saying she had called everyone in the congregation and they couldn't get anyone to teach 3rd grade Sunday School. I asked how many kids did that affect and she said two. I made one phone call and they had their teacher. It's always surprising how many people lie to their pastors. No one in today's society practices the art of brinkmanship anymore. It's too bad.

I try to eat pretty much the same way I eat at home when I'm camping. It's not that hard to do. To think that one has to forego the culinary arts and replace with a tear open boil option is not what I have in mind. I for one don't cook 3 meals a day at home, why would that change when I'm in the field? A lot of the culinary arts are left to boxed meals because one hasn't learned how to actually cook. Thus the MB. However, if the Cooking MB isn't going to really teach anyone to cook, what's the sense of having it? After all, any Cub Scout can have burnt foil dinners any day of the week, but with the same ingredients, I have hamburger and onion gravy over mashed potatoes with brown sugar glazed carrots on the side. Cooking MB should teach actual cooking.

I think if given the choice, I'd go with the pizza place.

Boil and eat? Sounds tasty. Trail meals for me entail a lot more than just boil and eat. If one has a fire source to boil something they also have the same source to cook something. The boil and eat method of trail food is because no one wants to take the time to really cook and if this is a cooking MB I would think the requirements would be on cooking, not just boiling water with food in it. In one of the former units I was in they were planning on doing a canoe outing for the day and had plans for hot dogs for lunch. That way they could start a fire, get the water hot and dump in the hot dogs. I told them to count me out, I would bring my own food. I too made a fire, cooked sweet and sour pork over rice for lunch with a coffee chaser. I was done before their cauldron of hot dogs reached a boil. If one does it right, it actually can be a learning experience. I learned to boil water at a very young age. I did boil eggs, hot dogs, potatoes, etc. but it wasn't until I got a fry pan in my hands did I learn to really cook!

Yes, a for-profit corporation can charter a scout unit. We have a pizza place in our area that charters a Cub pack.

When my son was in Tigers, there was no DL. The parents each planned an event and the boys showed up. No bling, no hassle, just a lot of fun. One parent had us visit the airport where the boys got to go up into the tower, see the fire/rescue equipment, get back into the luggage handling areas, and see a ton of stuff not available to the public. Another took the boys to the library, every boy got their own library card, got to check out a book, sat in on story time, went back into the archives, got to ask questions at the research area, use the microfilm machines. We of course did the traditional police tour and fire dept tour, the local museum, etc. It was really one of the best years for the boys. No pressure to do anything except have fun.

We have always used the premise that the boys need teach each skill to another person as the way to demonstrate their knowledge. One of the first things each boy does when he comes into the troop is learn how to teach. It's a 5 minute process and it works. It's surprising how many boys eventually catch on it's nothing more than a modified EDGE approach.

Had a bad wind storm come through at summer camp, took down all the wall tents in camp except 2. The 2 remaining tents were the adult tents. I was a good gentleman and set up the female ASM's tent for her along with mine. Boys all set up their tents but they relied on the stupid wood tighteners that all gave way in the wind storm. Took down the 2 dining flies, but one was still standing... yep, the adult fly. The PL came over to the adult area and asked for some help all the tents went down in the storm. It was still raining, so I got up and took him over to my tent and asked him why my tent as still standing. He looked for the longest time and then finally said, you tied everything with knots. Yep. Then I said, "would you like me to come over and teach the boys to tie the knows that they are supposed to know how to tie?" He looked at me and said, "That'll be a good start." Twice more that week, I saw the PL over with the boys practicing their knots as a patrol. It's amazing what a little incentive will do for the program.

The reports we get from our summer camp staff on rank requirements are only attendance in the class. It is not meant to be an indication that the requirement has been fulfilled. That is up to the troop once they are home to do the testing before signing off.

I have always operated with one ASM. I have 2 active boys right now, but I have had as many as 28. Still just one ASM. My current ASM asked to be my ASM because she wanted to know about the boy-led, patrol-method approach I use. She is also the District Commissioner. The committee and parents know there are only the two of us and always stand ready to step in as needed to cover 2-deep. All are YTP trained.

I'm kinda lost with this conversation. What does one do for 30 minutes during a SMC? If the requirements aren't being met, SMC or BOR isn't going to solve that problem. Basically I use the SMC near the end to review with the boy his accomplishments since his last rank advancement. Basically asking him if he thinks he's ready for the BOR and give him an opportunity to ask any questions of me before the BOR. I never retest the boys, but I do have the right to ask questions. For example. It says here in the book that you learned how to tie the taunt-line hitch. Is that true? It says here you made meals for your patrol for a weekend. Is that true? If one does this at every SMC for a couple of the requirements, the boys will know that each time such questions will arise. I have had "feedback" over the years during training sessions and have had the teachers tell the new kids, they had better learn this because if they don't they will have to lie to Mr.Stosh at their SMC.

@ This was a starter Troop so I have had my challenges with not having older boys to lead or teach. Excuse my French but it SUCKS! LOL It's nice to know I'm not the only one on this forum that is in this boat. That founder's patch and William D. Boyce knot are more important to me than even the District Award of Merit knot. I've earned it twice in the past 15 years. And you are correct, it really does suck!

Cooking for 6-8 boys is a management task. Leading one's own patrol, developing a rapport with them, working with one's buddies, taking care of your own boys. is what I'm talking about. Leadership is stripped out and left with nothing but managing a task to get pencil whipped through the requirement and if one were to go back and read the cited article on boy-led it also indicates that the boys, just because they are boy-led, cannot change the policies and procedures of the program. Cooking meals for one's own patrol means one dribbles the ball, they don't just run with it to get it down the court and into the basket. Like I said, they are stripping the leadership out of the requirement to expedite the process. Oh, by the way, how does one fulfill this requirement when the troop isn't using the patrol-method in the first place. I would find it very difficult to imagine how anyone gets beyond the Tenderfoot requirement that talks about identifying the name, describing the flag and giving the yell of a patrol that doesn't exist. Gotta be pretty callus to get through that requirement honestly for a few troops out there.

Yes, but, Fred you have identified servant leadership. Note the non-management highlights above, They all are clear indicators of servant leadership that makes it work for you and your boys. If that process was cultured so as to infect the whole troop, you'd be out of a job and the boys would set the world on fire!

I have run into PL's like that as well. Don't use the SPL's unless I have a larger troop and the one boy that I did have as SPL was really great at it. The secret I have found, and is the core of the servant leadership concept is the person has to genuinely want care about other people or it isn't going to work. If all they care about is the job, it's not going to work (Joe Management). And if all they care about is themselves it's not going to work either (Johnny Narcissism). Give me a person who cares and I can open up his world to servant leadership and I can even help with some basic management lessons to help get him more effective with getting things done, too. But they'll figure those things out on their own as they help others with their needs. Give me a person who only worries about the job. I can help them get the job done, but when they complain no one listens to their directions, no one wants to help out, etc. then I can suggest to them servant leadership, but until they care it never works. Give me a person who only worries about himself, I just introduce him to an Eagle Mill troop and suggest maybe he'd be happier there. The "natural born" leader is one who has quickly matured beyond his/her age level and capitalizes on it from an early age. I once had someone explain "maturity" to me once. When a person is born it is totally selfish. I'm wet, I'm hungry, I'm tired, take care of me! Now! For those who have ever had a newborn in their house, they will know what I mean. As they get older they begin to give up their selfishness and start thinking about the world beyond themselves and how they fit in. Eventually they become a mature person who is focused on helping out others, like parents taking care of their children and eventually in return, their parents when they become elderly and can no longer care for themselves. This cycle is the life of a person here on earth. Those that don't grow up and can't take care of themselves in society end up institutionalized either in a medical or penal setting. We happen to catch the age group on the final years of development before the child enters "full maturity" of adulthood. What we do with those final years is what scouting is all about. We see the transition from budding maturity to full maturity and the final stages of taking care of no one but themselves to "helping other people at all times." How quickly we assist these boys in developing maturity, caring and subsequent leadership varies from one person to the next. BSA offers very little specific training in this area. This is why it is important to be able to teach true leadership to these boys. It means one meets some fantastic young people that are constantly leaving huge voids in one's life, but it's worth it. Even to the point where one travels half-way across the country to attend a wedding of a young man that wasn't YOUR son, but he's important anyway. It's an emotionally "painful" process, but it does keep one from burning out along the way.

I have found with my working with youth, some of the best leaders tend to be terrible managers. They are so into taking care of others, the administration duties just aren't important to them, they just focus on what it takes to make it happen. If it isn't just perfect or it didn't follow instructions precisely, so what, it got the job done and it helped the other person. Inverse this we have great managers that get the job done, but the people doing it are secondary to them. They are just there to provide hands to accomplish the task. Just imagine the duty roster. The names are put on there not because of any skill the person may have for the task. One doesn't need to worry about the people, just what they need do for the task at hand. One needs to identify in their minds why these people are missed when they leave? What was it that endeared people to them? What was that dynamic that seemed to draw people in and want to be around them? Why is it people genuinely like them? What's missing when they are not around? Tough questions, but once one gets a feel for the answers, some really neat things will begin to happen. If one is able to instill those qualities into others, you too will be a great leader. It's all part of taking care of your people. The really interesting thing about the whole thing is once the leadership is developed, the management dynamics just seem to fall into place and thing get done, usually with far less effort. Otherwise, one manager can be replaced with the next and as long as "the job" gets done no one really notices or even cares. But they all but mourn when they lose a good leader.

No, your challenge is to turn all your boys into such leaders. All the boys should get the same chance to be "raised" like this. Every boy that comes into my unit gets the same opportunity to be greatly missed when they leave. The "greatly missed" is the void one feels when true leadership is lost from the group. The truly great leaders will be those that may not have served as PL's SPL's JASM's or ASM and still produce a profound void in your troop when they leave.

@@Cambridgeskip I don't know if you realize it or not, but you just gave the perfect example of what servant leadership is all about! Thank you! Here you have two extremely powerful leaders in your group that regardless of what they did, they inspired, they stood out, they were powerful, their leadership gave a sense that anyone would want to emulate, and most importantly of all, when they are no longer leading they will be palpably missed. Even you were caught up in the power of these two! They have some proper team spirit to them. Their patrol, while by no means the cleanest, tidiest (their patrol kitchen at summer camp…. Oh good grief!) or most smartly dressed in the troop (uniform can be shambolic) are clearly the most tight knit in the troop and properly look out for each other. Without them the troop is going to be a calmer, tidier, more disciplined place. It’s going to be a lot less fun though. And this is why organizational management can never replace the true power of servant leadership! From what you have experienced in these two, work hard at helping others see what you see. If these two ever did "hook up as a couple" (I'd bet money that later in life they do. ) they will be a powerful force to reckon with!

Please explain what is meant by "develop leadership as a natural part of completing the adventures." It seems to me that the scout will develop management skills as part of completing the tasks of adventures. Organizing the activity, preparation and finally the doing of the actual task at hand. I see people coming to these events more as self-entertainment rather than actually all that worried about leading anyone.