Stosh

Our school is wrapping up the school year on June 2nd. Seniors are already done and graduations are starting all over the place now.

That's because they don't have a word for "God". If I recall, they just leave a space for where it is referred to, such as "Oh my ".

It's kinda sad that in this day and age, it befalls the scouting program to teach the boys common courtesies that should have been taught years earlier. We've gone from babysitters to virtual parents now.... and I'm not just referring to the boys.

That's a pretty much myopic point of view. How is anyone going to get beyond hotdogs and pop-tarts if no one thinks outside the box? Just because I don't want to eat my Spam on a stick doesn't make me a bad Scout. Sorry, but stifling creativity and experimentation and everyone has to eat the same thing prepared in the same way just isn't my thing. Not when I can out cook 95% of my scouts. When I get handed the fixin's for a foil dinner, the last thing I end up with is a foil dinner. Doin' meals and meal cleanup as a patrol is one of da great learnin' experiences of Scouting. If every lad brings his own food stash and refuses to participate in da meal prep or cleanup with the group, I'm wonderin' what we're teachin', exactly. Well, it sounds like the lesson for the day is: "adults are making up a lot of rules on how the boys can run a program. Way too much adult dictates here for my liking.

Or how's about the utensil-less cooking using onion and orange halves or scooped out green peppers which end up becoming so burnt they are inedible. And seriously has ANYONE really made a meal like that or is it only for demonstration purposes only? Sorry, I use a mess kit and cook well. I'm not really in the mood very often trying to eat a meal that's burnt onto aluminum foil.

It's kinda hard to use "God's" name when in fact in the Judean-Christian-Islamic religion tradition we don't know what his name is. God is what he is, not who he is. Early writers didn't say God, they said he was the God of Abraham, the God of Isaac, the God of Jacob. So what's his name? I dunno.

Yep, just lent my canoes out to a family that had young children and they are headed to the BWCA this month.

No there isn't.

Heck, I'd rather do BWCA at half the price and twice the fun.

What are you talking about. My grandmother used to OMG all the time "Oh, my goodness!" A lot of this verbiage is a result of what people think these "words" mean, when in fact they have no idea. @@blw2 teased me about flirting with the 3rd commandment. What most people don't realize is most people don't know what that verbiage of the commandment really means anyway. The problem lies in the double definition of the word "name". We have assumed the wrong definition. When one gets to the Pearly Gates, St. Peter is going to straighten out a ton of people on this one.

If this boy campaigned on the slogan, "What can I do to help?" he'd get elected in a heartbeat, especially if the boys saw him doing this in his patrol and troop on a regular basis.

Clarification on the can of worms..... The older boys planned on doing something on their own rather than the same-old-same-old they had been doing by going along with the others to council camp. So the vote comes in and says that no, you can't do that, you have to do the same-old-same-old once again. Be a team player here boys! Well, they aren't part of that team. They are a team of their own and given a choice of going to, lets say, Philmont or going to council camp, why waste the time and energy, lets stay home and go to the state park and camp.....There's nothing in the book that says they HAVE to go to council camp yet again especially when everyone was all excited about doing something different. So as far as the fund raising, the troop doesn't do ISA's, but it does do IPA's individual patrol accounts. A percentage of raised funds goes to the troop and a percentage goes to the patrols that raise the money. If we don't need patrol money, why are we all gung ho on putting more money in a bloated account that was supposed to be paying for a trip we can't go on anyway. I totally agreed with them. It wasn't vindictive, it just was their special activity that got shot down by everyone else in the troop because the PLC decided to vote. What it did spark in the troop was a discussion on how the patrols were to interact with this new PLC grouping. Up until now with 1 patrol it was not necessary. 2 patrols, the 2 PL's just talked to each other over the phone. Basically it was are we doing this summer camp thing together or not? They somehow always came to some kind of agreement, At that point we basically had 2 regular patrols. 3 patrols, now we have 2 regular patrols and 1 NSP.. The NSP isn't going to raise a ruckus so things still are worked out between the 2 regular patrol PL's. Now the one patrol matures to a venture level patrol and wants to take on new challenges, the old NSP moves up to regular status and a new NSP moves onto the stage. So now we have 4 patrols and the vote is taken. 1 NSP, 1 just over being NSP and 1 regular and 1 Venture. Now for the first time there's enough voters to seriously out-vote a single patrol. New territory for the boys. 3 to 1 we're going to council camp. The older boys said, that's fine have a nice time. What people don't realize was the vote was not that everyone in the troop HAD to go to council camp it just meant the majority of the boys were going to council camp. WHAT? The older boys aren't going? We voted. No, the vote was to go to camp not force the older boys to go to camp. The older boys asked if the adults were going to support them. I said I would but they needed to work things out with the PLC, being new and all. They stewed about it for a month, talked at length about what was happening and decided in the end, voting was causing more problems than it was fixing. They decided the PLC would be an information repository where all the PL's share what's happening in their patrols, but retain their individual patrol autonomy. They then asked if we as adults would support both efforts, which we did. ASM and parent took the boys to council camp and a parent and myself took the older boys on their trek. It worked out just fine and the boys picked up on some interesting dynamics that needed to be addressed as the troop grew. It never dawned on me that we were screwing up these boys' perspective on citizenship. I just figured they had this new PLC and needed to work out the kinks as to how they wanted it to work. I think they came to a consensus that made everyone happy. Isn't that what it's all about anyway? No, they didn't vote anymore, no they did not all have a common calendar, but for the most part, things turned out well and from my POV as SM, I didn't really care if they got a lesson in civics or not. They resolved their issues and that's all that I was worried about.

There are certain expectation rules for the boys. Adults can do what every they wish. I've done it both ways. I kinda like my own tent over the big wall tents, but they are all right.

If majority rules all the time, the troop will have to always cater to the lowest common denominator. Every summer will be summer camp in the council camp because the young boys aren't ever going to be old enough to vote to go to Philmont or Sea Base. And the older boys can mark that option off as never a possibility. This is why I like my boys broken into at least NSP, Regular and Venture patrols. That way the NSP can go to Council Camp, the regular patrols can if they want, branch out to a different camp or maybe something they are interested in besides camp, maybe a canoe trip, etc. and the Venture patrol can pack up and head to Philmont. Your mileage may vary, but this is how I cake care of my boys. If it strains the adult resources to do it this way, it's my job to find the help. After all these years, I've never had a problem finding people to help.

Our council is doing a week-long Cub resident camp. Monday through Friday. No parents.

It falls under a number of basic tenants we hold dear in our country. One does not need to go along with the crowd if they choose something one doesn't want to do. Nor should they be forced to pay someone elses way. "A Scout his Thrifty, he pays his own way." Why do the people in New York, Atlanta and Denver get to vote whether or not Chicago builds a new civic center? 3 patrols cannot mandate what a 4th can or cannot do. By the way, the older boy's summer trek cost less, and the boys were challenged more with their scouting skills than had they been forced to go with what the other 3 patrols wanted to do. We're not talking free-for-all tactics of a bunch of rebels here. We're talking trusted older scouts that have earned the opportunity to chose wisely the course of activity for their patrol. Instead of leading the troop, the PLC pretty much nullified it's authority by overreaching. The PLC's role and vision were permanently altered at that point. In the long run, it was a good thing that happened.

Central WY Council's camp Camp Buffalo Bill, has no tents and costs more than my local Council camp.... and as an out of council troop we would need to pay $100 more, another $25 for late registration and the adults aren't free. There's a big difference one has to check out when looking to go to any Scout Camp. When one can do 9 days in BWCA at half the cost of 5 days of summer camp, the Scout is Thrifty comes into play rather quickly.

I got into trouble for using "Stuff" on the forum. Whole big long thread about it. In my neighborhood, it was common for Junk. My mother and dad were always telling us kids to get their "Stuff" off the dining room table. Even my teachers at school used it. "Cheesh"! (for those who know what that means.... )

We'll just have to agree to disagree. On the first day of a scout's life in Cub Scouting, he IS a Tiger (or Lion if that program is set up in your council). He did nothing to earn that "rank", but simply showed up for the first den meeting. He is given the Bobcat pin with the expectation he fulfill certain requirements. Basically it is not an award, holds very little programmatic responsibility, but is cherished more than the other awards for some reason. So, anyway, HE IS A TIGER. Over the course of the next few months of programming and working at the program he may be given the Tiger award at having done certain expectations for the award. Whether he gets the award or not, he is still a TIGER. The next year, HE IS A WOLF.... If he does certain tasks he may receive the Wolf award, but it changes nothing, he is still a WOLF. See the pattern? One must also take into consideration that a boy coming into the Cub Scout program gets the Bobcat pin just like every other scout, but you go into the age appropriate level of Cub Scouts, so you may be starting out at a BEAR Scout working towards your Bear award. One cannot go back to pick up Lion, Tiger or Wolf. the way the system would work if it were the Boy Scout model of rankings. Now switch gears over to Boy Scouts. The first day of Boy Scouts he is nothing. So he stays nothing until he has fulfilled the requirements for advancement rank to that of SCOUT. Now he is a SCOUT. He does the next set of requirements AND THEN he becomes a TENDERFOOT. Up until then he is still a SCOUT. If the boy decides not to do any of the other requirements he will age out at 18 a TENDERFOOT Scout. That's the highest rank he attained. One can call it by any name they wish, rank, award, whatever, make up a name it doesn't matter. Rank starts at the bottom and works it's way up to the top SCOUT -> EAGLE in Boy Scouts. That's not the system in Cub Scouts. To say it is is misleading. One has to be careful with parents made unilateral decisions like this. A parent can't just decide that because it will look good on his college application and job resume that he start at Webelos age and "earn" the Lion, Tiger, Wolf, Bear, "ranks" too. The program is not set up that way. In Boy Scouts, regardless of your age, everyone starts at the SCOUT rank.

Not to worry, I've been known to get off he beaten track more than once along the way. I understand the SPL issue. In my troops the aspired to positions are the PL's and there were never enough spots to keep everyone happy. But you are totally correct, it can be any position of leadership whether it be a recognized POR or not. I for one, think the Grubmaster is more important than the SPL, PL, Scribe, and QM combined! If he can make good coffee, one can add ASPL, APL, TG and DC to the mix. While respect (Greek for "to look a second time" meaning the person is worth a second look) is important, I work very hard at developing SELF-respect. I am in the business of building confidence, maturity, character, and any number of important characteristics in a young boy, but self-respect is the foundation for without that, how can a boy even believe in himself and build confidence along the way. A boy that is unsure of himself will find it very difficult to take care of others and their needs. If a boy has self-respect it will encourage others to follow in giving respect. Lead by example. Do you trust yourself to take care of yourself? If yes, then others will follow. If one is going to lead, they are going to get out front and be the first to get there. Because you haven't been there before, you're going to make mistakes, don't worry, that's how you learn. If you don't know how to deal with mistakes, how can you help others when they makes mistakes? This won't work if the boy doesn't have confidence and self-respect. Once they get that under their belt and really believe it, then they can start really believing in themselves, too. It's always easier to follow someone who knows the trail and is willing to help you along it.

All the logistics of the program are going to be decided at the local level. Get in touch with them, they will know.... maybe.

Yes, these are the hard feelings one creates with a misinterpretation of the situation. There is no such thing as "flunking" or need to hold back due to some ill conceived notion that these are an incremental ranking of sorts. IT IS NOT A RANK. One does not take the next step up having achieved a step ranking, they merely turn one year older and move on to the next level of scouting. The patch only represents how well they did their best while at that level. They either earned the achievement award or they didn't. You earned it? Great, move on to the next level. You didn't earn it? Well, work harder at the next level and you might get the achievement award. OMG! My son just failed Bears and has to be held back a year? How stupid is that? In Boy Scouts they have rankings. If that system was applied to Cub Scouting, the one boy who didn't attend meetings would be in Tigers, not Webelos. Do the parents a favor, call it what it is. It's an achievement award for doing the necessary requirements to earn it. It does not signify any ranking above any other scout at that age. There are boys in Boy Scouting that do not aspire to be Eagles. Not a problem. They just progress to a certain rank and then just have fun, do their thing and that's it. A Cub Scout can take a pass on Tiger award, the Wolf award, the Bear award, the Webelos award, and then work his tail off to earn the Arrow of Light award, the highest "rank"(?) in Cub Scouts? How is that possible. No, the Arrow of Light is the highest AWARD in Cub Scouting. There's a whole different mind-set for the parent that thinks their son is flunking Cub Scouts, has had their child held back a year? What's with that? All because people are not identifying the system appropriately. Your son did not earn the Wolf award. That's unfortunate, next year he'll have a chance to earn his Bear award. (he is a younger scout who got held back during Scouts). This is a major travesty in my book. Even if a boy gets held back in school, he still, by age, moves on in Scouting! These uninformed Cub leaders have just cut a year off this boy's chances at Eagle in Boy Scouts. I would tell the parents that their son get in his age appropriate Cub program, at least work hard on the AOL and join Boy Scouts during his 10th year of age or age 11 at the latest. My guess is that this boy will soon find sports a lot more fun than putting up with Scouting.

If I use strong language, the boys know I am ticked off. Normally they know I'm mad when I either raise my voice, become sharp with my words or simply stare in silence. Yet the most powerful "statement" one can make at a difficult time is a "sigh". If one as garnered up leadership with the boys, you seriously like them and take care of them, look out for their welfare, and are trustworthy to them, when they do something stupid or about to do something stupid, and you intervene with a sigh and disappointment, there are no strong words that will top that. That old proverb about counting to 10 before reacting really applies well to this issue. Give oneself an opportunity to think clearly before reacting. A lot of times, kids are pushing buttons just for fun and if they get a rise out of you, they win. We had a guest speaker come in for the program and I don't use "sign's up" in the troop very often, if at all. I got up, waited for quiet in silence. Then spoke softly an introduction of the speaker. She started out and the material she had to work with was a bit dry for the boys but she was doing very well considering. The boys started getting a bit noisy and so when she paused I simply called out "HEY!" It caught their attention. Then in a quiet voice once more I said, "A little respect here for our speaker would be expected of a scout, Gentlemen." They remained quiet for the rest of the presentation. Had I resorted to strong language, it would have been something predictable to them, That would have been "normal" for them to have some adult rant a bit here, but when one does the unpredictable, they don't know what to do with it?

When we begin to expect perfection from our boys, we can also expect perfection from our leaders. Zero tolerance for failure.