Stosh

Is that what that is? I'm not into any agenda branding. I never vote for a party, just the person. Well sometimes I vote against a person as well. I always just thought of my self as an Independent with Constitutionalist leanings. At best I just render unto Caesar that which belongs to Caesar.... and my soul doesn't belong to Caesar.

Next time the adults get to chit chatting about interfering in the operation of the unit, one might want to consider dropping a few hint-bombs, like "Gee, that didn't work out that well when it came to SPL. Maybe we ought to just let the PL's figure it out on their own and if they ask questions we can deal with it at that point. That way when things get sticky like they are now, it's not our fault, but the boys'." NEVER GET CAUGHT HOLDING THE BAG!! Oh, by the way the young ASPL, was never elected to be SPL. Stepping up is not what the boys voted on. They voted him to be the ASPL, they need to re-vote for an SPL. Or in your case, dump the stupid adult rules and let the boys pick who they want to do those jobs and let the chips fall where they may. It can't be any worse than what one has now!

The same camp that regales the boys with steak on Thursday evening is the same camp that has bratwurst (glorified hot dog) for their leader appreciation dinner. It's all for the boys! Now if that out-of-state council ever figures out how to prepare bratwurst Lambeau Field style we'd be okay.....they just boil them. Eeewwwhh. The potato salad is okay though.

People need to be allowed to associate with whom they want and not associate with those whom they do not want. The government and any other authoritative body should not interfere with one's personal freedoms, such as the freedom to associate with others on their terms, not the government's. With that being said, we now apply the authoritative presumption of fuzzy logic. It's okay for the boys to associate with liars, cheats, gossipers, adulterers, homosexuals, bullies, etc. the kinds of morality that doesn't show up on a background check. People have the freedom to determine who they wish to have associating with their children and once that line of choice becomes hazy enough the parents will simply avoid the questionable issue. Sure, homosexuals can be SM's, but that doesn't mean there's anything wrong with a parent picking a unit where the SM is heterosexual. Blur the lines enough, the parent will find an alternative activity for their children altogether. I for one have taught my children to respect all people regardless of race, sex, religion, social status or whatever. One can respect them and treat them decently, but one does not have to allow them the right to dictate any moral instruction to them because of that. Once the organization no longer designates such clear cut choices, the trust factor tanks, and alternative programs are out there that do have clear cut choices that one's children can participate in. If a clergy begins to promote morality contrary to the tenets of the religion, there is nothing holding me from moving on down the road to some place where the tenets of the religion are adhered to. It's not an issue of hatred, I don't need to ply any political agenda, I don't have to force my will on others, all I have to do is express my personal freedom of choice. Just like everyone else. I have no right to impose my choices on others and they have no right to impose theirs on me. Anything other than that is hypocrisy on the one hand and tyranny on the other. The Bill of Rights used to define that rather clearly.

Remember the position is Advisor - not adult leader because soon those Venturing "youth" will be adults, too. At that point they will be peers. Might want to start that process early. I ran a successful Venturing crew for 12-13 years and always treated all the members the same... as adults. If I was going to go kayaking with another couple of couples, I would act and interact with them as I did with my Venturing "peers". It didn't take very long to establish trust and respect and when they figured out what Servant Leadership was, it was often times nicer than if I were with two other couples.

While the cats away the rats shall play. Like I tell my boys, if they leave the door open, an adult will walk in and take over. As a side note. If any boy is reluctant to take a POR, he should be honest enough to decline the opportunity and let someone who does want the job the chance to try out his leadership. In my troop when it become obvious a boy doesn't want to do the job, he can and usually is replaced on the spot. We don't have term limits. A NSP PL can serve in that position until he ages out if that's what he and his boys in the patrol want.

Whereas lay personnel have their gatherings and there are gatherings of clergy lead lay groups. But there are also gatherings of clergy where such topics are shared not only within one's own persuasion, but those of others in the neighborhood. I cannot cite who said what from which authoritative body, but it is a discussion that has come up and doesn't seem to be going away anytime soon. Armed security, conceal carry in churches, and a number of other issues are not just talk anymore. What was "never going to ever happen in America" is happening. Oh, by the way, confidentiality is a strong trump card when it comes to clergy.

I always know what's best for my boys, but that's never the criteria for going against what they think is best for them. I trust them and if need be, I help dust them off and send them on down the road when necessary. That little bump in the road might have been the necessary failure needed for that boy to become a good leader. On the other hand, if I insisted on my way and we hit the little bump in the road, it might be the necessary failure I needed to get out of the way and let the boys become the good leaders I want them to be.

And now one can understand that pre-paring a scout for such a possibility is well within the realm of taking care of one's boys. Not all EBOR's are held at Camelot. Even with a questionable board member, the boy should be prepared to handle anything that might arise and feel comfortable with even such situations that require standing up for oneself.

I don't know if it's my upbringing or my aging loss of hearing, but ignoring people has become quite handy at times. I like pie with my coffee. Ala mode? Sure, why not. Oh, looky, a squirrel....! (Peter Principle 101)

The clergy in our area have already been warned that saying homosexuality is a sin constitutes hate speech. I suppose reading that out loud from Scripture in a public forum, i.e. Sunday Worship, will cause reason for arrest. These are not just murmurings, they are published documents from major church sources. We are that far down the slippery slope.

But then there's the old WB people. They don't have the right stuff and need to take the real 21st Century stuff to be cool. No thanks, I'm doing just fine with the training I've gotten. Used to irk them that I am allowed to wear the beads and tartan and not be in the cool group. But that's been solved. I have no idea were my beads and woggle are. I wear the troop necker, but still get a rise out of the few that think the beads and woggle need to be worn with the tartan necker.

If the adults are all fired up about a certain camp, they can take the boys that want to go to that camp and have a nice summer camp. Those adults that are all fired up about another camp, they can take the boys that want to go to that camp and have a nice summer camp. Otherwise the adults can stay out of it and let the boys go where they want to go. I haven't been to council camp for at least 10 years now. My ASM's husband is a big backer of the council camp. He's there every day year around working and doing camp improvements (he's retired). When it came time to pick a camp that would suit our new boys, she suggested a good out of council camp. Ya go where the boys want and will get the best return on their investment. The adult part of this scenario is driving and drinking coffee and being the 2-deep leadership the camp requires. Nothing more. And @@Eagle94-A1 it gets far less complicated when the adults stay out of it.

Tim Jeal

My boys were not satisfied with the local Council camp after a really bad experience with them. I told them to find a new camp to attend. They got on the internet and came up with a camp an hour and a half away that was owned by an OUT OF STATE council. Train 'em, TRUST 'EM, let them lead! - love that line, it works!

Not really. "The lawsuit is known in legal circles as a “pre-enforcement challenge,†a lawsuit that allows citizens to challenge a law—in this case, a law that threatens First Amendment freedoms—before the government enforces it against them. For example, organizations such as the American Civil Liberties Union and Planned Parenthood routinely file such lawsuits against laws they oppose." The emphasis is my addition to point out that no one's been dragged out of the pulpit....yet. It's a sad day in America when we see the slow train wreck coming from a long way away. It's even sadder to think that this possibility even exists in America. Once they try and take their Bibles and their guns, the silent will not stay silent. The war has already started. It's just that history hasn't figured it out. Was it Nat Turner, John Brown or P. T. Beauregard that really started the war? Or how many people were killed by Gavrilo Princip's one bullet?

But if the lawyer knows a good lawyer everything will be just fine.

I see it more as a BSA CYA issue. Mr. SE, my little Johnny was supposed to be home last night and he didn't show up. Where is he? Don't worry, our records show that he got home last night. At this point guess who gets thrown under the bus.

First of all, welcome to the forum! I did the patrol names for the AOL boys I had this year. The curriculum alluded to it so we went along with it. They did form nice patrols and for the time they had together it worked well. Once they got to Boy Scouts they needed to merge because not all the boys crossed over and some quit the program but they kept a bit of the continuity with the NSP (New Scout Patrol) in my troop. There are those troops out there that don't use NSP's and so the boys will need to start over again with a new patrol of new people. If the boys don't care, then any troop will do. If they wish to stay as a group, they need to find a troop that allows that.

One thing the notice didn't mention.... while walking in the woods, make noise, whistle, sing, talk loudly. Some people carry small bells or put them on their shoes to make noise. Yes, it scares away the wildlife. If one wishes to view wildlife, sit quietly and observe, don't walk around. If one is walking make noise, the last thing one wants to do is come across a bear and startle it. Give it fair warning and like everything else it will move off out of the way.

When I was in the ministry every fall I would get this annual complaint that they don't have enough Sunday School teachers. They "asked everybody!!!" Even the regular school teachers won't step up and teach! So, we have a person doing teaching 5 days of the week and doing extra work on the weekend to do the next five days. So now the church wants them to add another on their "day of rest?" I don't think so! Boys sit 5 days a week in school, and with any religious instruction maybe Saturday confirmation and Sunday school, and now BSA wants to put them in a classroom..... Yeah, right. I don't blame the boys one bit for balking at such nonsense. Tables and chairs should be outlawed in Scouting! A stump and a stick to poke in the fire is all a boy needs.

I usually go to the "leaders" meeting at summer camp to get coffee. Sometimes they have treats, too. Other than that, they're pretty much a waste of time.

Towing trailers is not part of any driving instruction anywhere. It is a skill acquired after the license is issued. I have been around camping trailers, utility trailers, boat trailers all my life and have come to the realization that there are a ton of information out there that describes the differences between towing and non-towing activities. RichardB's article points out many, but does not cover the finer details that pertain to weight and stopping/accelerating issues, turning radii, backing, etc. One doesn't need a last-minute lesson when one has a carload of boys in their vehicle. Just their presence can add and additional 500# of weight to a normal vehicle situation. Add a trailer and gear and now one has a serious issue. Stopping maybe an extra ton or two of inertia that the vehicle's brakes were never designed to do? Good luck with that. Add a cross-wind and any minor slight over corrections can throw side weight on a vehicle suspension system never designed to handle. Did you know that when passed by a semi, the air flow between you and him can have a tremendous amount of influence if you're pulling a trailer. Even the owner manuals of a non-trailering pickup truck will state that a loaded pickup handles far less than an empty one. Ever wonder why people up north have sandbags in the back of their pickups in the winter? Just getting into a vehicle and heading down the road requires (as qwazse mentions) getting one's head in the game. If you've never pulled a trailer in your life behind your vehicle, please don't start with a load of boys tagging along.

Not necessarily. A religious CO may have a problem with a pastor that threatens the welfare of the organization and have totally no interest in knowing what's going on with any of their individual program directors. Unless it's threatening the welfare of the CO, I would suspect they really don't care. They might dump the SM as fast as they dump the Sunday School director if what is going on is viewed poorly by the community around them, but other than that, I doubt whether the subject of the BSA charter is addressed at any CO's governing board. They are a mere entry in the CO's budget to cover the cost of chartering each year in 99% of most cases.

That's kind of a nice forum feature.