jafyfe-bsa

In the movie, 8 Days A Week(1997) starring Joshua Schaefer and Keri Russell, Keri Russell's father, played by Patrick O'Brien, quotes a man named Zig Ziglar. I thought it was some made up name, I had no idea that the there was an inspirational speaker named Zig Ziglar. Thanks for the information.

...choose to help the Pack or choose to help the Special Needs. I believe I need to clarify this. The program I volunteered for only lasted 5 weeks and was some sort of starter program passed down from National. In other words, there was no large commitment or stress. However, though I did volunteer, no one else from my pack had. This makes me question their commitment to scouting. Why? Because there schools (both the one that the solicited at and the one they did not) are attached to this school with the special needs students. If your pack was connected with a school, wouldn't you do anything to advertise your pack? Though, Cubmaster Mike, the "talking feather" may help air dirty laundry, I think these people do enough without needing to air anything out. Besides I think it would not be well received by the group. And more so, I think it would be counter productive. Still this is something to keep in mind if other things fail. As too Cubmaster Jerry's question, does the Committee Chair and other committee members see you as a person selected by the DE to come in and "fix" a problem or as a parent wishing to help out that sees a problem? That is the question I currently struggle with. It seems as though half the group welcomes me when I discuss things such as feeder troops, setting up den chiefs from those troops, OA cross over ceremonies, camps the boys can attend, and the simple fact that I have taken it a personal mission to be as well informed as possible about the various different events in the district and council. When I mention several events, most sit there and say, "we tried to do that but it we were too late last year." After my first committee meeting, it became obvious that the groups major problem stem from what seemed like a lack of understanding of how everything works. My first position was to inform the group on Cub Scouting, events, and ceremonies; however, I believe some have viewed this as threat. Someone learning outside of the group seemed out of place by the reactions and response I got. If I had not done what I did, no one would have been informed; as I have mentioned before, no one else from the pack has shown to any roundtables, and I doubt that they had in the past. The COR does not seemed to be informed. This maybe due to the fact the COR does not seem to have been invited to certain functions.

1 If you were the chairman of a pack committee would you rather choose your own committee members or have them inserted by the local District Executive into your committee? I would take all who should an active commitment to both their child and scouting. So I guess in a way I would rather choose my own Committee Members, but never disrespect the ones I had. That would make me unkind and show a lack of courteousness towards others. I think you understand what I mean. However, my goal to this point has been to be as helpful as possible. By attending Roundtables, organizing my den, helping with membership, getting trained, attending committee meetings, and informing others of all up and coming events in the council and district. 2 How would you feel toward that "inserted" committee member? Welcoming. One of the first things that I have notice in all my years in scouting is that HELP is hard to find. Anyone willing to pull away a couple of hours, once a month and sit with a group of leaders to discuss events would be great; however, I would hope that the person could contribute all time necessary to complete all task. 3 Do you think it is right for your DE to ask a new volunteer to help a failing pack, AND help with a special needs troop? If the duties of the paid officials were not to help failing packs, then what would their duties be? Is it not the job of the District Executives to work alongside the volunteers of their District in developing and maintaining the Scouting programs assigned to them to manage on a day-to-day basis? And if said program was slipping, i.e. Committee Chairs that are telling parents that the Pack is full unless the parent wants to volunteer, the Pack does not solicit boys at a school that the Pack is attached too, causing a groups boys not to join, or other examples, would it not be the job of the paid official to step in and observe what is wrong? How would ignoring such issues benefit the boys we serve? I like to think that every boy is a Cub Scout, he just doesnt know it yet. 4 Knowing the pack was failing what did the DE think you could accomplish by putting you in without putting you in-charge? The DE was actually frustrated that no one had approached the school my children were attached too and open up the opportunity. By doing this there was the hope that some dedicated leaders would join. It was at this meeting that it was expressed that this Pack needed new leaders. Though I could never ideal think for the DE I assumed the DE took that stance that most who work with children take; find more leaders and added to the parental involvement. More boys, more leaders, less likely to fail. And by addressing a school the Pack had refused to address would open the school through new leaders to address such a school. 5 What good is recruiting boys into a failing unit if you haven't first addressed why it is failing? Simply having more boys who can quit is not an improvement. That is a good question. Based upon the number of contacts my wife and I have had with both DEs, it seems that they had no real inside link to the group; therefore, had no idea why it was failing. This applies to my simple answer above. More boys, more leaders, less likely to fail. What authority do you have to change any of this at this time? Nothing. And that is what frustrates me the most. I can see the problems, I can see why there is failure, and I can see how to help it; however every attempt in helping has seemed to be meet with a road block. As to your suggestion they all seem really helpful. I think the most helpful would be to ask the Chair how she views the health of pack. I think I was searching for away to approach the Chair without stepping on toes, but to get honesty. However I am firm believer that actions speak louder then words. Certain actions taken by Chair and other committee members make me question the health of the pack. How healthy can a Pack be of examples of immorality surface at the front?

You can have it if all Boy Scouting has become is an idealist clique. I'll send the badge too. Your statement seems so full of anger; it makes me wonder if you are truly, at the end of the day,...happy with {yourself} in life. I mean, why be so angry with an idealist organization that has no current personal bearing on your life? If your badge means nothing, then let it mean nothing; no anger, frustration, attacks, displeasure, and ultimately disappointment. Let it go without the anger, estranged resentment and dishearten response. (This message has been edited by jafyfe-bsa)

As some may have read through some of my other post, I am an Eagle Scout who is returning to Boy Scouting with my boys. I was approached by the DEs to become involved in a pack that was "failing." My first clue that it was failing was the simple fact that at recruitment, only the DEs were there (we have two because the area is really growing). At that meeting we were invited to the District Day Camp. My second clue was that at the Day Camp, no one from this pack had shown. At the day camp, the DEs asked my wife and I if we could help with a program that brings Boy Scouting to mentally handicapped children in the area. Naturally we said yes, and my third clue was given; no one else from the pack showed. Finally we get in e-mail inviting us to a Committee meeting; however this e-mail came through the DEs. Clue number four. All through out the meeting and the acts afterwards have made me second guess my commitment to this pack. The Committee Chair left 20 minutes into the meeting due to other commitments. She discussed openly her dislikes for certain leaders and favors of others. The Committee Chair sets up separate, private meetings with leaders outside of Committee meetings, where they would discuss overtaking positions of other leaders. The pack has no Cubmaster. The first person offered the position said he would if last years Committee Chair would step down (not the person mentioned above). After she did step down, the Cubmaster decided he could not give the commitment needed. The second Cubmaster wanted by a majority of the committee members agreed to the position; however, this years Committee Chair does not like and does not want him. She has been actively recruiting others with no success. Since I joined I have attended two roundtables and two training classes, at both no one else showed from the pack. This is all the grown up stuff and does not matter when it comes to the kids, but what bothers me the most about this whole group is the lack of understanding of what Cub Scouts means. First with regards to the Membership Meeting set up by the Membership Chair. The meeting has been planned by the Committee at a Committee Meeting; however the Committee Chair has redone the meeting that now seem less organize, less about scouting, and lack the core meaning behind Cub Scouts, the boys have fun. The second is that due to the fact that not a single person in the pack is trained beyond YPT, but does that excuse the lack of morals, leadership, and citizenship exemplified by the parents and taught to the Cub Scouts? Overall this group, when compared to the people I have meet at roundtable and leadership training, seem very not in the right frame of mind to be leaders in Cub Scouting. This experience has shown me that this may not be the pack for me. My questions are: 1. Do children do better at packs attached to their schools? 2. What are some ways to handle leaders that dont seem to have their mind and heart in the Cub Scout place? 3. Am I being to sensitive, and should learn to deal with these people, because they will continue to occur in scouting?

When I was a child, I had little to no involvement from my father. Though my parents were "together" in marriage, my father's job took him away from the home for most weekends, weekdays and holidays. I, and your son may be doing this himself, sought others to be a role models of manhood. When I turned to scouting I found many fathers active in the troop and in their sons lives. It was by experience with these men that taught my self not only ideals of a healthy manhood, but how to be father. Now that I have two sons of my own, I have examples of fatherhood that I turn to in times of trouble. My mother tried as hard as she could to fill both mother and father positions, but nothing can replace the contact and examples I was given in Scouting.

{Though I don't remember where I read this, I am almost positive that Tiger Den's can not have den chiefs. Bear and Wolf dens, however, can.} Tiger Cubs don't usually have DC because they have their adult partners. As to Wolfs, Bears, and Webelos, I was a DC for all of them when I was a First Class and above scout. DC are necessary to teach the boys that there is fun in scouting beyond Cub Scouts. I believe that a must be at least 13 years old or First Class scout; however if there are no such requirements, those would be my requirements.

Would one want to remove the list of Honored, those who have no more honors? For example: (Bunch of names that I am not going to verify) Though I agree, as an Eagle Scout, the lessons and leadership I learned have continued with me beyond my years as a youth; I have a hard time allowing the good name of Eagle Scout be destroyed by such examples of hatred and destruction. Beyond that, these boys have added fuel to a fire raging out of control that attacks the organization as a whole. To have them maintain with such an honor is wrong and sends the wrong message to the world. (This message has been edited by a staff member.)

{What team is the Storm with?} The San Diego Padres. {Make sure to use Fuji film containers they pop so much better than the black with grey tops.} Good tip. My boys and I will be paracticing this weekend. {So this year we aren't putting a finish time on the flyer, hoping everyone will come at the start time.} We are doing a packet to pass out with all the information needed. Hopefully that will work.

I stand on the middle of the fence with this issue. The only way that my boys joined scouting was through the DE having a meeting at their school. Through that one meeting our pack not only got my wife and I but two others just as dedicated to scouting. The Pack, though feeding from two schools, did nothing to invite the children from one school. The Pack was run by a group of people who were happy having three dens at about 5 boys per den. This year my wife is the Membership Chair and is actively recruiting from the two schools. To have the DE come in now would really not benefit the Pack. However, my wife openly communicates with the DE about our recruitment, has attended all recruitment meeting hosted by the District and DE, and has shown huge efforts in recruiting.

How long? - 1 day from 4pm to 6pm How much? - free What act.? - round robin crafts, cooking, astronomy, rope bridge Lunch provided? - no This was for the Tiger Cubs so I don't know what the rest of the group paid. This was also for the District and not the Council.

Though it has been mentioned that the leader book does have a Parent Survey, I like yours more. The one in the leader book is confusing and ask for information that really does not pretain to the skills needed for the year. At the beginning of the year I give out a package include a parent survey, but I think I shall use yours instead. Thank you. I made the following changes: 1. One per parent instead of parental unit. 2. In the "I have..." I added "a pool" (important in CA). 3. In the "I have these skills..." I added "camping", "hiking", "models."(This message has been edited by jafyfe-bsa)

I like uz2bnowl movie night. I'll probably push for something like that in the spring. As for recruiting, over the summer we got 5 boys, with a local Minor League Baseball team (Lake Elsinore Storm) allowing scouts to campout on the field, watch a game, watch a movie, feed them and patch them for $15.00. Just by mentioning this activity recruited those boys. As for active recruitment, we begin on the 25th of Aug (Back to School Night) and our Recruitment Night the first of Sep. We feed from two schools and my wife pulls from her involvements in the home school program. Our plan is to get many together and encouraged about scouting. At the Recruitment Night we will sing songs, teach the boys scout signs and the promise, and do Bottle Rockets (old film canisters with Alka-seltzer and water just for the shear reaction of whoa from the boys). Ill let you know how it goes. (This message has been edited by jafyfe-bsa)

To answer Rick's Question (Are your boys just starting in Cub Scouts, as in they are twins?): no. One will be starting Tiger Cubs while the other will be a Bear Scout. Due to the fact that we live in the "middle of nowhere" and that the children were home schooled, we never got a straight answer as to how to start them in the Cub Scout program. This year they will enter into a school that has Cub Scouts. To prevent this future confusion with home schooled parents, my wife is actively recruiting home schoolers.

After taking a 10 year "vacation" from Scouting I have return with my boys. I have received an Arrow of Light and Eagle Scout with four palms. I am also a Brotherhood memeber of the Order of the Arrow. My boys are now starting on their trail with wide-eyed excitment.