Its Me

You can't do the outdoors man too many times. Have the ones that have earned this requirement already begin sleeping in boy only tents. The aquanatics badge is a formalized play date. Do that again no one will complain. Citizenship, that a main pillar in scouting. Just do it a little different than you did it last time. I can see a solid push on your part to re-do some of the requirements and your boys won't mind a bit. Of course the parents have to come up strong too. If they all don't make it, so what! You just out the polishing touch on your long term boys.

Thanks Brent

Ok who has been there? Where to stay? What to do? your itinerary?

He is a lurker. watching your every move.(This message has been edited by Its Me)

Congratulations on the Eagle. Next summer is a ways off and if he is 18 and in school his priorities change fast. I have hike in the rookies and done the BWCA. I loved both but I personally choose BWCA. I would bet (a small amount) that in the end he pick neither.

Well the subject line says it all. I have a boy in Boy Scouts and a girl in a Venture crew. Presently I am more involved in the Boy Scout program than the Venture Crew program. If you have taken the powderhorn course I would sure like to hear your experience.(This message has been edited by Its Me)

If socuters aren't supposed to work on merit badges at troop meetings then what is the purose of troop meeting if it is not a conduit for advancement? No advancement at campouts either? When are they suppose to work on scouting stuff? Let's add the hours Troop meetings 4 x 1.5 = 6 One campout a month: Sat = 8 sun = 2 Total = 16 hours/month of scouting and no advancement?

From The Guide to safe scouting: "Reporting Deaths or Serious Injury Adult leaders are responsible for informing their council Scout executive or designee, as soon as possible, of a death or serious injury or illness. A serious injury or illness is defined as: 1. Any period of unconsciousness; 2. Any hospital inpatient admission; or 3. Any surgical intervention other than suturing of the skin or setting of simple fractures. Leaders should be prepared to give specific facts of:" So BSA does not require the reporting of fractures and sutures. What is in patient admission? By these rules: A scouter (adult or youth) who sprains a leg at summer camp goes to a clinic sees a doctor (maybe x-rayed) gets it wrapped and released after a few hours. Must an injury report be filed with Council? Would the camp have generated an injury report. Should any reports be given to the charter organization? Should the troop mainatin an injury report on this incident? I found no reference to injury reporting in the scout master handbook.

Kudu, I like what you have written. A couple of thoughts. We have a Scout Master that thinks camping in public RV campground is The Great Outdoors. One month we camped right next to RVs running their generators with satellite TV dishes set up in clearings. Coax-cables ran across roads and through campsites. I can only imagine that one of these nature lovers mumbled blasted forest is ruining my reception. Another month we camped in a public group site adjacent to a group of hard drinking, country folks. They were loud, their music was louder but on the positive side, when a fight broke out it was broken up quickly. Four of our last five campouts have been in these types of parks. The fifth was on a military base. I am pushing to camp away from these distractions. I argue that these places are not instilling the type of qualities that we want in our youths. The Scout Master argues that they tried the hiking thing once and he met with flack. That is why I like your analogy of the rich man dropping the urban kids off in the great outdoors and then observing that they just didnt know what to do. Lets look at another parable; baseball is a fun and relatively easy game to understand. Take 18 boys one ball some gloves and bats and let them loose on a ball diamond. If they have never been taught how to play baseball they wont know what to do. They would use the bat and gloves wrong and likely use them for games they already know. It would be boring. In general the more baseball skills they have the more they enjoy the game. Further more, I have an old 1949 Boy Scout handbook. It reads much differently then the current books. It reads more like an adventure book. Something more like the book, My Side of the Mountain. Its one part instructional and one part adventure story. Although there are instructions on how to track a Moose. It seems to me that the book was written for the boy to get as much, if not more pleasure in reading about moose tracking then actually doing it. The current book is less about feeding a boys soul through literature than it is about being a text book. It has all the trappings of a text book, he reads a section then takes a test at the end of the section. No doubt it's a text book. The adventure must be scouting, both in perception and in the actual. Build up the outdoors through stories and skill development. Let the boy for a month in advance imagine what it will be like on the trail. Then take up to the trail away from RVs and parking lots. Let him rely on his skills. I cant imagine anything more wonderful.

This: CPR was given in the ambulance to save his life becuase he stopped breathing. And This: He was released at 6:00 AM the next morning. Tests are scheduled for later this week. Don't match. Maybe for posting purposes you decided to water down the story to keep the typing to a minimum. However, if this is the story pretty much as the mom told you then, she is nuts. The boy would not have been released from the hospital unless the doctors were confident that they knew the cause. Heck he could have had another siezure on the way home.

How in the world do you hold troop meeting that provide time nd opportunities for scouts to work on the 11 require MB's? It seem like the whole thing can become a jumbled mess. Earn a total of 21 merit badges (10 more than you already have), including the following: First Aid Citizenship in the Community Citizenship in the Nation Citizenship in the World Communications Personal Fitness Emergency Preparedness OR Lifesaving Environmental Science Personal Management Swimming OR Hiking OR Cycling Camping, and Family Life *

Have your wife and other den leaders, present at the clean-up, hand out the patches to the boys, great idea. Do it at a time and place where the CM and ACM are not present; Naw! Not a good idea and a bit over reactive to what transpired. This is more of a personal issue with and your in-need wife not getting the help promised and the obvious lack of pack leadership.

None of the local school calendars match. All the private schools match each other. Mainly because of Cristian holidays such as Cristmass and Easter. The private ones all take early winter breaks and March Spring breaks. But the public schools, noooooooo the standardized testing comes right in the middle of the traditional Easter week. No day offs for either Good Friday or Easter monday. Only two days off in March, one for the county fair and one for grading. Not even one for President's day in February. On top of that, when my kids went to public school, teaching & learning ended the day after state wide testing. So for the ten weeks following the March testing it was school-light. Standardized test are likely helping our schools / studentx. However, the traditional school calendar has been hacked into unrecognizable form. School start dates had been pushed all the way to the first few days in August. Some even into July. That is until the State passed a law saying that schools must not start prior to a week before labor day. This is now the new and improved calendar taking the new law into effect. So if the districts are trying to get as much time as possible before the State wide exams why not move these exams to mid May? I so wanted to take the boys on a 30 mile, five day hike in the spring so they could earn their backpacking merit badge. Now I will either have to jam it into an already crowded Cristmass break or hold off until June. (This message has been edited by Its Me)(This message has been edited by Its Me)

"Here is my question Do I take the hard line stance and make our PLC stick to their plans or should I be flexible and let them take the easy way? " Be flexible, if the SPL is representing the wishes of the PLC. As a cubscout by son camped at this one council camp 2-3 times a year, plus he went to day camps there, plus we had PWD out there. He was/is in love with that place. It was comfortable, relaxing, he could map out the trails in his head. Knew how long it would take to get from one area to another. It was like a second home. Just because they have gone there a lot does not mean that it should be banned. There is a ceratin amount of relaxation that can only occur in a place where you feel comfortable. Every campout? No! More than you would like? Yes! Remeber growing up, going into high school, learning how to kiss a girl, learning how to drive a car, there are so many unknowns in these kids lives that a weekend campout at a place where they can relax is exactly what they need.

If you look at some of the cited incident, kid getting lost, kid knocking logs in a river and falls-in river these are, dare I say it, "Baby sitting issues". I will argue that the G2SS meets the needs as they have developed over the years. G2SS has the word "swim" in it 152 times. Clearly safety and swimming have been an issue for scouts and and national has adressed this. In the SWEET 16 BSA SAFETY RULES, qualified supervision is number one. I believe that the majority of injuries to youths occur on harmless trecks and not on pushing the envelope of high adventure. Kids are wondering out camp and getting lost in the woods more often than a rappelling line gives way. BSA seems to focus on this with the qualified supervision, the buddy system even the program itself with patrol leaders and SPL all looking out for the less experienced. On one hand she writes her boy is too skilled and experienced from her own family travels and on the other hand BSA takes too many chances. She wants it both ways, not interesting enough but too risky.

No I have not encountered someone that bizzare in a position of authority in a volunteer organization. Yes she was only there for the children .

Has anyone ever had a question answered when posting here? - Yes all time and really good answers too. Does it just lead to more questions? - It better otherwise this discussion board would get pretty dull. Remember, the program is for the Scouts, not the adults. - Is there a specific post where you saw otherwise?

I came across the White Stag Leadership program (see link). It is obviously intertwined with BSA but I can't quite make the connection. I like its comprhensive approach to leadership devlopment. Take a look at site (its huge but unorganized) and tell me what you think of the program. I am especially interested in scouters who have taught or attended their coucnil's Youth Ledership program. But I welcome all comments. http://www.whitestag.org/skills/index.html

I am glad you posted this. We need more of these types of posts.

I respect what you are up against I faced a similar incident about 8 months ago. We did not kick out the cub then either. However, I think in this case I would have defaulted to what the PLC decided and expel the boy. A true "gang of boy" should be able to have their leaders come together and expel a troublesome kid. Who will want this boy in their patrol, as a swim buddy, as a tent partner? The adults just say "shake hands and now go play nice." Fine for the adults to say but we don't have to live with the demon child. In our case the boy pulled the knife on kids from another pack. He was well liked within his den. On the other hand, I believe and support your decision. In all it is the right decision for this incident. I know there are more facts and circumstances involved in this issue than can be conveyed within a couple of posts. I am sure you have weighed them all. Good luck with turning this boy around and with redirecting this troop to more positive activities.

Without the knife this a low grade incident. Boys poperty is missing. The boys should have known not to even the score themselves. A prank is panned. A seemingly benign retalatory act but again this should not have happened. More property is damaged. To this point, if S did not take the targets he has done nothing wrong. S challenges other boy to fight. Maybe S's first mistake. Boy accept challenge. Another mistake. S pulls a knife. Big Mistake! S throws the knife in direction of other boy to do harm. The Biggest Mistake. All chase S. Non issue. Although mistakes were made by P & G they weren't enough to send a kid home from summer camp. I agree that more conversations are needed. That P & G and all need to be counciled and should be required to write open letters of apollogies. S needs more. Maybe even kicked out (consider history in troop). Ceratinly banned from one or two camp outs, plus write letters and add on communitty service.

So what would he have taken 25 years ago that he now claims is Wood Badge? In fact he says that Wood Badge used to be called Wood Lore (or a similar name). A search of the web had no connection to Wood Badge and a similarily named course. I suspect that what he went to was a junior leadership training course similar to Buck skin. Bear Patrol SR 676

Our scoumaster shuns all that is wood badge. When I state that the trainig was invaluable he says he went to it when it was called wood lore. He is about 48-50 years old and I believe he went either as a senior patrol leader or as a junior assistant scout master. He certainly has not gone to any "wood" training in the last 20 years. Can you help me on what he went to? He claims that they are essentially the same thing.

I really dislike the show. Too often I am sitting there with my tenderfoot scout and venture crew scout pointing out dumb things this guy does. He traveles at high noon in the desert. He climbed up walls that would have been way too technical and too risky to do unless you were an escaping prisnor. Too much shomanship for this family.

I see it (as some have mentioned) as an instrument for character building but I see it little different. The teaching of the knot by a youth leader is where the character development comes in. The teacher must have the skills, patients and preparedness to bring his student to the desired proficiency. The knots: the two half and taught line are simple two & three turn loops around a rope. This is something a boy can readily master in anywhere from an 60 - 90 minutes. The skill level is low. The function is tactile. The results are immediate. Perfect for a young boy to teach a younger boy. The learning-boy is convinced that these knots are essential for camping so the whole time he is learning, he is imagining all the times he will use the knot in the outdoors. His interest is held, even if the teaching is awkward. The skill is simple and thus the teacher can remain proficient. The student is eager. A perfect recipe for all to succeed. Thus if your scouts are not the ones teaching knots then your boys are missing out on a built in character development program.