Horizon

I am in a college town, and would welcome a university level student wanting to get involved. I would interview him, but would take him. A friend of mine who earned his Eagle tried to volunteer at a local troop. My friend had two young daughters and wanted to give back to his community through Boy Scouting (the girls weren't old enough for Brownies yet). The troop rejected his application, so he put his energy into Rotary instead.

I tell the boys the same thing - get a copy of your Scoutnet records when you are at the Scout Shop / Council Office. Check them against your blue cards. For my Eagle candidates, I tell them to start cleaning up their records at least 3 months early to be safe (especially for those how are 17 years old).

We do a presentation every year on backpacking for the new Scouts, and it is a skit of sorts. The Scout Leader has his bag, with the heaviest version of everything attached. The Venturer has HIS bag. Scout leader pulls out his heavy sleeping bag, Venturer pulls his out and compares. Scout Leader talks about, "but it is only a 1 pound difference!" You can see where this goes. Great experience, lots of fun when the 100 pound Scouts try to put on the Leader's backpack too. ------ As to what the Scouts carry - the rule is that after your first backpack trip you can carry whatever you want to. I have had a Scout bring a 6 pack of soda that he cooled in the leftover snow. His choice, younger Scouts thought he was cool, it was all fine. This is the same Scout who, on a training hike, carried a watermelon to share as his snack.

I have sat in on boards in my suit, after being asked last minute to serve. I don't keep my dress uniform handing in the car (yes, I have a dress uniform separate from the one I camp in or go to regular meetings in). So when the call goes out for a replacement member, I show up in a jacket and tie or a suit (depending on what I am wearing). I would have my uniform on if I could though.

If they grill everyone in a similar manner, I am partially appeased. Grill the 18 year old who got his info in on time, the 16 year old who drops out every fall for football, or the 14 year old for rushing it. Make it a growing experience for the boy. However, taking your bias into the room to that level for a boy that is going that hard? Why do it other than to hear yourself speak? Bravo to the Scout.

Eamonn: Perhaps we need an OWB movement - Occupy WoodBadge!!! We can pitch tents at our respective District HQs (or down in Irving).

Man - I just violated mentally straight. That should be "Who's With Me!!!!!" I will admit that this topic was meant to be slightly tongue in cheek in s Swiftian way. Scoutfish does make a good point - do we do a good job of making ourselves better examples of the Oath? Do we call ourselves out when we violate one of the Laws? At least once per year my Scoutmaster's minute focuses on my own violations of the Oath and Law. I make a public apology to the boys of the Troop for not following the ideals of Scouting as their Scoutmaster.

BS-87 - not sure where you are going here with your claim of abuse. I am, however, laughing my head off at the accusations of me being a liberal. Is it my background? I can understand your concern. My wayward youth with the left wing United States Marine Corps unit? My evil indoctrination as a researcher at the Hoover Institution on War, Revolution and Peace? The outlandish publication I ran as the editor of a weekly Review paper? (patterned off of the first one - the Dartmouth Review)? My party registration as a Republican since the day I turned 18? Perhaps it is that nonsense graduate degree in Business that identifies me as another relative morality hippy. I will admit to lambasting my party for their abject failures in the law of Thrifty, and self-identifying as a Libertarian due to my disgust with the fiscal ineptitude of the Republican party over the past many years. I don't think that turns me into a liberal, however. None of this has anything to do with my desire to ensure that all leaders in the Boy Scouts of America best represent the ideals as enshrined in our Oath. No gays No fatties No idiots We must follow the path led by our betters, and have Dean Wormer's immortal words be added to the Adult Leader application, "Fat Drunk and Stupid is no way..." to be a Scout Leader. Now - whose with me?

packsaddle, singing lines from Rocky Horror is a violation of, well, something. Or not. Maybe.

The BSA takes one hard line in the interpretation of the Oath: Morally Straight means no gays. Some have argued that they do not want the example of a gay Scout leader. So how about other obvious violations of the Oath? Physically Strong: If you are fat, get out of the uniform. We can set it so that if you can't qualify for Philmont, you obviously do not follow the Physically Strong aspect of our oath. Mentally Awake: Any belief in Astrology, a numbers system for Las Vegas, or other beliefs that can not stand up to scientific scrutiny, perhaps you are not a good example for the boys. Duty to Country: If you have not voted in 75% of recent elections, you are not fulfilling your duty. Why allow the hard line nitpicking on just one issue - let's start excluding the rest of the people who don't follow our Oath.

Scoutmom0618 said "Just seems to me that if people cared and were actually concerned enough about it, they would leave BSA and start their own BSA type of organization or is it just that a few people want to force their beliefs and way of life on those who don't want to live that way? Hmm...wonder how many people would join that new type of organization? I may be wrong but I do not think it would have much of a following especially in my neck of the woods. " Simple - the gay issue is only one issue. The BSA is still one of the best organizations for young men around, and does a great job of developing leadership, citizenship and a general love of the outdoors. I have put decades into Scouting, and have no wish to end it. While I disagree with the anti-gay stance of the BSA, that is not enough to get me to quit. That does not mean, however, that I won't work within the system to try to reform it to match the moral stance of my church. Right now the BSA does not follow the Law of Reverent in regards to my congregation (PCUSA), nor does the BSA align with the membership rules of my former employer, The United States Marine Corps. http://articles.latimes.com/2011/oct/09/local/la-me-1009-gay-pride-marines-20111010 Now - I don't want the BSA to be required to take gay leaders. I simply want the Charter Orgs to be allowed to make this decision as it pertains to their faith. If your unit doesn't want to camp with one with a gay leader at summer camp - fine with me. I already had the Mormons kick my unit out of their summer camp week one year at the Council Camp - I am used to it.

I realize that, I am more interested in what the general Scouting public think about that. How many people are in an integrated Troop, but would rather have a Troop that does not allow certain groups in leadership positions? I wonder how many people are even aware that the unit has that right? The only units around me that I am aware of that limit are the LDS Troops (leaders must be members of the congregation).

If I ran a secret ballot at my Troop, it would probably be around 50/50 or so. Then again, how about a secret ballot about letting Mormon, Muslim or Jewish leaders into your unit? How about women as Scoutmasters? I am sure that in any unit there are people that, in secret, would happily exclude a large number of people from leadership positions in Scouting. As to camping - I have sent my son on multi-day trip with his gay youth Minister. I had no concerns any more than I was worried about the female youth leaders. I know the people and trust them. I would love to see a good survey of former Scouts with sons, to see if the current restrictions prevent them from enrolling their children. I know of some anecdotally (two Eagles who are hesitant to enroll their sons), but I don't know what the national numbers are.

Fehler - bankruptcy does not erase student loan debt.

What the governor should be doing is shifting money into Vocational Technical training for kids in high school so that they can learn a trade. Then he can look at the engineering programs, but they can be worthless unless you are cutting edge. As for social sciences - I have one of those degrees (Political Science and Economics), but from a top tier school. Engineers work for me, coding products that I design. I don't care HOW they design it, I focus on the end user experience. We need both. I would rather hire a psychology major who wants to work in business and understands that they do not know business terms, than a business major who thinks that they understand my world. Psych majors require statistics (more important than calculus), lots of writing (something most engineers need more of), and the understanding of people (great for market research, customer support, etc.) Long ago, we believed in the concept of the renaissance man - someone who had skills across all spectrums. Over time we have fallen back into specialization, and lost the understanding that a good citizen should know art, history, politics, mathematics, etc.

Everyone, you can call me Horizon, and sometimes I yell "Signs Up." I would say that 90% of the time I put a sign up and look at my watch until things quiet down. They only time I shout "signs up" is typically during a SNAFU operation with troop gear where it is the fastest way to get everyone's attention and stop the 25 different actions that are going on that might just cause a problem. However, based on this thread - I am going to try to reduce that bit even more. Sometimes though, I need the attention of the entire Troop FAST - and "Signs Up" has always been the go-to shout instead of some variation of Shut Up / Atten HUT.

I have an association with academia, so every year before I plan a guest lecture to undergrads I check the Mindset List from Beloit. http://www.beloit.edu/mindset/2015/ So, for the class of 2015 (those boys who just aged out of your Troop, but are still in your Crew or one your Ship): Andre the Giant, River Phoenix, Frank Zappa, Arthur Ashe and the Commodore 64 have always been dead. Their classmates could include Taylor Momsen, Angus Jones, Howard Stern's daughter Ashley, and the Dilley Sextuplets. There has always been an Internet ramp onto the information highway. Ferris Bueller and Sloane Peterson could be their parents. States and Velcro parents have always been requiring that they wear their bike helmets. The only significant labor disputes in their lifetimes have been in major league sports. There have nearly always been at least two women on the Supreme Court, and women have always commanded U.S. Navy ships. They swipe cards, not merchandise. As theyve grown up on websites and cell phones, adult experts have constantly fretted about their alleged deficits of empathy and concentration. Their schools blackboards have always been getting smarter. Dont touch that dial!.what dial? American tax forms have always been available in Spanish. More Americans have always traveled to Latin America than to Europe. Amazon has never been just a river in South America. Refer to LBJ, and they might assume you're talking about LeBron James. All their lives, Whitney Houston has always been declaring I Will Always Love You. O.J. Simpson has always been looking for the killers of Nicole Simpson and Ronald Goldman. Women have never been too old to have children. Japan has always been importing rice.

Mesh bag for drying after washing holds... Spork: http://www.amazon.com/Columbia-River-Knife-Tool-9100C/dp/B0030IRKHA Frisbee: Anything works for that. They are heavy plastic, with a ridge that holds the sauce, and you can play with it between meals. Sierra Cup: I am old school - I like my original Sierra Club Sierra Cup.

We have a great program based in Newport Beach, CA thanks to a city that rents us waterfront space for pennies and generous donors that have made a great Seabase. I would hate to see what it would take to get a slip without that support. If I had to create a program, I would try to find a yacht club willing to sponsor and provide space and advice, and build from there. I agree on the issue with Council. Our ships are pretty small, yet already have too many Scouts (not always room on the Ship for a cruise). When Council staff is paid for new units (not going to happen unless you can find another slip!) or growth (limited due to capacity, plus the issues around available interested Scouts), you can find some problems. After that is the usual conflict with Scoutmasters worried about losing Scouts. I PUSH my older Scouts to give Sea Scouts a try (and I also have a Crew). However, there are plenty of Scoutmasters who don't want their older Scouts to get lured by the sea.

Our Scout office prints the record for anyone who asks. You walk up to the desk (staffed by volunteers), write down your unit and name, and they print you a record from the database. It shows all units, and a complete history of the dates. It is great for when a boy is registering for Eagle he has the official dates of every MB and Rank.

I tell my boys that once a year when they hit the Scout Shop, to stop by the desk and get a print out of their records. They can then check those records against their handbook and make sure everything is clean. Any issues they can bring to our Advancement Chair.

I don't like how it was handled, but if the COR does not want someone as a leader - then they should be allowed to remove them as a leader. The leader did not fit into the COR's definition of a good leader. Now, I personally do not agree with the COR, nor do I agree with the BSA's limitations - but I think that the COR should be allowed to make this choice. I just wish the BSA would allow that same decision making to be made by more CORs, so that I could start a new unit at my church (a Covenant Network member of the Presbyterian Church USA).

Beavah: My Venture Crew won the Iron Chef competition at Camporee by serving Beef Wellington for dinner and fresh crepes for dessert, all cooked over a 2 burner Coleman.

I am in burn ban for 80% of my campouts, so we use the two burner Coleman stoves or backpacking stoves.

nldscout: You should look up the Alford plea - it does NOT admit guilt. It admits that there is a lot of evidence, but that you are still proclaiming your innocence. From wikipedia (good enough source for this one. An Alford plea (also called a Kennedy plea [1], an Alford guilty plea[2][3][4] and the Alford doctrine[5][6][7]) in United States law is a guilty plea in criminal court,[8][9][10] where the defendant does not admit the act and asserts innocence.[11][12][13] Under the Alford plea, the defendant admits that sufficient evidence exists with which the prosecution could likely convince a judge or jury to find the defendant guilty beyond a reasonable doubt.[5][14][15][16][17] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alford_plea Add in police misconduct, missing records, coercion and the new DNA evidence - PLUS the fact that one of the defendants has an IQ in the 70s, and you can find some possible issues. This might not be another re-enactment of The Crucible, but it still smells a bit.