gwd-scouter

Thanks for the information and the PMs folks. We have decided on Wolf Laurel and our Scouts are very excited about the trip! First time the troop has gone skiing. I can't wait to watch these guys take their first run.

Don't forget Snapple, Drakes Coffee Cake, and Junior Mints.

Such wonderful advice given so far. I was a CM for five years for a very large pack (120 plus boys) and will say looking back that I had a blast. There are times these days when I am frustrated as a SM that I wonder if my services wouldn't be better used as a CM again! Eagledad said it well in that the folks in the pack will look to you for all the answers. Training training training. But, nothing you learn in a classroom or from a book will prepare you for the real world of Cubmastership. Or, for that matter, any position you may hold in Scouting. It's in doing the job that you will learn what kind of CM you will be and what talents you have to bring to the job. For me, the biggest challenge was being the "up front" gal. I have always been terrified of public speaking and not very confident in my abilities to direct people. You know, "why would anyone want to listen to me," kind of thing. So, it was with great reluctance that I took the CM job when asked. Admittedly, I came across as very stiff and even unfriendly for several months, always being compared to the former CM who was a great guy, life of the party, fun and spontaneous. But, I began to grow into the job and the pack began to see and benefit from the strengths I did bring - organization, communication, knowledge of the program and, amazingly, the powers of gentle persuasion to get others to volunteer. With the satisfaction that those areas of Pack management were going well, easing up and enjoying the job slowly came. The result? After five years of singing, dancing, wearing costumes, and general silliness, I sure got over my fear of public speaking. Everyone here has mentioned training and I'd like to add one more - PowWow. Assuming every Council holds this, it was the best Cub Leader training I took. I signed up every year and took different modules. The notebooks from the courses were excellent resources, but the chance to visit and talk with Scouters from other areas in our Council and share ideas was invaluable. Good luck to you and have fun with your Pack.

Pizza, cake, and sodas in our Troop. We tried a couple of times to do a pot luck, covered dish thing, but the boys want pizza - so pizza it is. Where we meet has a tile floor, so mess is not as much of an issue as with you. Maybe make a gingerale or sprite and lime sherbet based punch?

so glad the chat is back up. we just got high-speed internet at home now, so I'll be logging in this weekend.

OK, I guess I'll play. Karen K. Buchanan, involved with Girl Scouting as a youth, adult involvement with BSA for 14 years Current BSA roles: Scoutmaster, Troop 313 District Training Committee-Cub Scout/Boy Scout New Leader Essentials and Cub Scout Leader Position Specific Former BSA roles: Many of them at the same time Cubscouts: Tiger Cub Den Leader, Wolf, Bear and Webelos Den Leader, Asst. Cubmaster, Cubmaster Boy Scouts: Troop Committee Advancement Chair District: Cub Roundtable Commish, Cubscout Cuboree Chair, Training Chair, Day Camp Advisor Council: Cub Resident Camp Director. I think that's it...

Back from the weekend campout. While the meal planning was a disaster, the end result - the cooked meals - was terrific. While we adults worked in our little corner fixing our meals, the boys were hard at work on their own. There were, of course, arguments over the duty roster and a lot of "if you take my place cooking this time, I'll do yours next time" and so on. Scouts made their first ever dutch oven cinnamon rolls and I have to admit they turned out better than those cooked by the adults (we knew they had put that on their menu so we added it to ours and cooked them side-by-side). The Scouts were so proud when theirs turned out golden brown and thoroughly cooked while ours were indeed golden brown, but raw in the middle - too much charcoal on top of the oven for the adults!). They made tacos for lunch and learned that it is not a good idea to let the biggest eater in the group begin by serving himself! Boys had planned to make s'mores for Friday night around the campfire and peach cobbler for Saturday night. But, they took so long getting camp set up and a fire started on Friday that it was too late for the s'mores. So, when Saturday evening rolled around many of them asked the PL if they could have both the s'mores and cobbler for Saturday night. He said no, they could only have one, so they settled on the s'mores. Ah, another learning moment. Better cooperation doing set up the night before and they could have had the s'mores Friday and then have the cobbler Saturday. Something learned for next time. They took great pleasure in the fact that the adults were somehow without the bread needed to make grilled cheese sandwiches for lunch (I know I bought that loaf of bread, now where did I put it?). They took special glee in the fact that it was the SM (me) that forgot the bread! We made do with the dinner rolls that were supposed to go with our Saturday dinner. All day Saturday we had some Webelos Scouts and their parents visiting with us. I received a nice note from the parents saying that while they still had another Troop to visit, they are strongly inclined to join our Troop. They really liked the way our Scouts worked together, on their own, and how the adults sat back and watched, only occasionally whispering in the PL's ear with a suggestion or two. End result of our campout. Boys won Saturday breakfast, boys won Saturday lunch, they got to taste the adults' dinner and said they liked it better than theirs - so adults won Saturday dinner, and probably a tie for Sunday breakfast. Way to go Scouts!

We had our end of year Court of Honor last night. What a wonderful ceremony the Scouts put on. All but three of our Scouts (who had prior commitments) arrived in full official uniform, including our custom troop neckerchief. SPL led the ceremony and began with Pledge of Allegiance. Then the candle lighting to the points of the Scout Law - each Scout taking a turn to recite a point of the law while lighting a candle. The final candle for Reverent was lit by our Chaplain's Aid who then led our opening prayer. SPL began the rank awards - highest first. In last night's case, 1st Class. New 1st Class Scout then awarded Tenderfoot rank. Tenderfoot Scout then presented the Scout badges. Wonderful! Our JASM presented the merit badges earned and the Paul Bunyan Woodsman Award. Paul Bunyan recipient then gave out the Totin' Chip and Firem'n Chit awards. Finally, it was my turn for a few special recognitions and SM Minute. While taking a moment to recognize those Scouts in PORs for the Troop, it occurred to me that all but one of them is in a position, but doesn't "need" it for rank advancement. What I mean is, our SPL for example is a Life Scout, has already been credited for his POR for Eagle, but nevertheless ran and was elected SPL. I hear all the time "Johnny Scout NEEDS a POR for such and such rank" and here are these boys in front of me working hard at PORs that are not needed for rank advancement, but will surely count in their growth as Scouts. Sorry, I digress... SPL then gathered the Scouts together in a circle to do our traditional closing "Day is done, gone the sun..." Full gathering of parents, grandparents and siblings. During our after-party of pizza and cake, I walked around chatting with the parents. I noticed that ALL of our Scouts were gathered together in a corner of the room, talking, laughing, comparing awards received and generally having a good time. ALL OF THEM! No one left out of the group. No separate groups. What an amazing Troop of Scouts I have. Our Troop will take a little break now for the Holidays. I sure do look forward to when we return in January and another fanastic year of Scouting.

A ship is safe in its harbor, as are the men who serve on her. But, that is neither why the ship was built, nor why the men chose to serve.

Thanks everyone for the helpful tips. I guess what this comes down to for me is just that perhaps my expectations have become too high. We've made so many advances in our troop with the guys working hard in their PORs, younger Scouts watching and learning from the older Scouts, more boy-led than adult-led. So, with all these wonderful improvements (many of which I shamelessly boasted about on this forum), it is hard for me to watch when a disaster happens like last Monday. But, I guess good for me, I did not interfere until the very end. Sat downstairs and listened while the arguments went on above my head. Finally, after close to an hour I heard desperation in the SPL's voice. So, I just walked upstairs and stood in the back of the room to see what was going on. It was then that SPL, PL and I talked briefly and I gave them some suggestions. But, as I stated earlier, the end result was the two older guys making the menu and telling the younger guys that "this is what we're going to have." You are right of course that it is part of the process and a learning and growing experience for our guys. Yes, the guys were given a task to do the week before and no one followed through. Yes, there was a different mix of boys in this group which probably led to the more than usual ensuing chaos. Yes, we are still struggling to set up patrols since we don't usually have more that 6-8 guys on a trip. So, with your suggestions in hand I will bring this up with the PLC at their next meeting. And I will continue to work on understanding this messy process of training boys. Thanks folks. PS - Local1400: The Scout in charge of buying food for the boys this weekend has the recipe book so I'll send you the Dorito Casserole recipe next week.

Trev - just a perfect example of how imprecise the typed word on these forums can be and how our posts may be misinterpreted: I am, in fact, the wife and I only have one husband. My post was meant to convey two different responses to the same question. I should have put response #1 to husband and response #2 to husband. Oh boy, just the thought of a second husband....that's for another thread. :-)

In our house: Husband to wife: need anything from the store? Wife to husband #1: no, not really. Translation: Bad day today, better bring home a chocolate bar. Wife to husband #2: nope, we're good. Translation: Great day today, just come on home.

Thanks for the suggestions so far. A little more detail: Yes, we do have 12 Scouts in the Troop. While we initially thought everyone was going on the trip, after last night only 8 are going and only five of them were involved in the menu planning last night. Admittedly, one of those guys is a chief instigator of roudiness and inattention in our troop and hasn't always been present at other times when menus were being planned (the more successful times). He's the kind of boy you'd like to ask "would you like some cheese to go with that whine?" Heh heh. Great kid, but exasperating! We have cookbooks and a bunch of simple recipes downloaded from the Internet all put in binders. For this upcoming trip, SPL asked the Scouts a couple of weeks ago to bring some recipes from home or to at least think about something they like and bring ideas for last night's meeting. I thought that was a great idea, but none of the guys followed through on it. My take on your suggestions so far is that I will not be undermining our efforts toward boy-led if, as SM, I step in with some suggested parameters for menus. Please keep those suggestions coming!

Last night our Scouts worked on planning menus for the upcoming campout. While this activity never goes as smoothly or as well as I think it could (or should), last night's was a disaster. It took forty minutes for the guys just to decide whether to cook Friday night, bring a bag supper, or eat at home before we leave. So much bickering back and forth about who likes what, or more precisely who doesn't like what. Arguments over pancakes or eggs for breakfast - so and so doesn't like eggs, so and so thinks cleaning up after pancakes is too hard. OK, let's forget about breakfast and move on to lunch. That was fairly easy and the guys all agreed on tacos. But, after agreeing on tacos they started arguing over hard shells or soft. Finally, one of our older Scouts mentioned that soft shells travel better than hard shells. That seemed to solve the argument. Then dinner. Dorito casserole is a favorite, with three guys saying to put it on the menu. Two others chimed in saying they wouldn't eat anything that was called a casserole. With only fifteen minutes left in the meeting, it all finally came down to two of the older more experienced Scouts basically telling the younger guys "this is what we're going to eat and that's it." What can I as SM do to help with this situation? Should we have a few meetings as a type of training dedicated to teaching these guys how to plan meals? Should I talk with the PLC at their next meeting and suggest that guidelines be given for menu plans: i.e., one meal must be dutch oven prepared, one meal must be open fire prepared, one meal must be a new recipe. Or, suggest that they make sample menus and the guys will choose from those. I know the younger guys would be happy eating peanut butter and jelly sandwiches and poptarts for every meal. Should that be OK? If so, I know the older guys will quit coming on campouts - they want REAL food. As adults, while the boys are preparing their own meals, we always cook something new so the guys can see how it's done, smell its delicousness and even have a sample. Sure, after that they all say "oh yeah, we need to make that on our next campout. That was so easy. Dutch ovens are great. Wow, not too much cleanup. Etc. etc." But, next campout comes around and the bickering begins with no thought to the new things they learned. I talked with the SPL and PL last night after watching their growing frustration. They are really at a loss on how to fix this. As an adult, it would be very easy for me to step in, take control and run the menu planning meeting, but that's not the direction our troop has work so hard to take these past two years. I would just like some suggestions on how I can help these guys without personally controlling the situation. Thanks.

In the Cub Scout thread the question is asked about where to pour dishwater after washing up and it was said to dig a hole and pour it in. Couple of years ago at Outdoor Leader Skills, I was taught that method had been changed and we are now supposed to sling the water so as to dispurse it over a large area. Which is correct?

ddhanso, In our troop we split the costs of a campout evenly among the scouts/adults. We figure in cost for food ($10 per person), gas, and whatever fee may be needed to camp. With the exception of summer camp, white water rafting, and the ski trip planned for January, our monthly campouts rarely cost more than $20 each. Backpacking trips are generally free since the boys/adults buy their own food individually, we don't have to pull the trailer so gas cost is reduced, and we try to find free locations to camp. Those times that a campsite may require a fee, we take that amount out of the Troop treasury. We have had the good fortune to have camping fees waived at our local State Park and other parks if we arrange in advance to do a service/conservation project for them. We, too, like to use our Council Camp since it free during the off-season - and a GREAT place to camp. We are a small troop and haven't had much luck (or interest if truth be told) with fundraising over the years. But, the scouts are making bigger and more exciting campout plans now and will have to start thinking more about fund raising to help keep costs down. By the way, I see no problem going to the movies as an outing. If the scouts plan it - they can do it. We took our guys to an amusement theme park last summer because it's what they put on the calendar.

With the recent postings about the ultimate demise of the BSA, I thought I'd update this thread with some good news. It does not have any impact nationally, but then I'm more concerned about what goes on closer to home. This past Monday saw 100% attendance at our Scout meeting. For the past year I've noticed attendance increasing, with usually about 75% week after week. The boys are engaged in their meetings, they are making the plans and running the show. Sure, it's messy some times, but it is wonderful to sit and watch them take charge. Had sign ups for the upcoming camping trip. Twelve Scouts in our Troop: 8 signed up immediately, 2 signed up but weren't sure - just notified me that they are going, 2 can't go due to other commitments. Amazing, we haven't had a turnout like this since the White Water Rafting trip last August. The most amazing thing was our two High School Seniors, both stalled Life Scouts that have decided that THIS is the year to get busy working toward Eagle. Both have only attended one outing each this past year. Both came up to me and very excitedly said they are going on the campout. One of them, a very very busy lad, said he'd just work to change his other plans so he could go on the campout. The other Scout is the guy that always has something "better" come up and won't commit to an outing. I can't say for sure, but the look on his face when he told me he was going on the campout was as if he was very pleased with himself because, by going, he was pleasing me. (He and I have had many SM Conferences this past year, all in an effort to light a spark under him and get him excited about being a Boy Scout again - I think it's working). Finally, I just got confirmation that the Webelos Scouts mentioned earlier in this thread are coming on the campout with their parents. They will not be staying over night, just coming for the Saturday activities and leaving after dinner. What surprises me the most about this is that the campsite is almost two hours away from where we live and these folks are all going to drive up Saturday morning and home that evening. Yes, I sure am proud of "my" boys. (This message has been edited by gwd-scouter)(This message has been edited by gwd-scouter)

We have custom neckerchiefs, designed by the Scouts, that match our T-shirts and hats. They are worn, by Scouts and Scouters, at formal occasions such as Court of Honor, Scout Sunday, and Webelos crossover ceremony. During summer camp we wear them on Wednesdays for family day when we have the parade of troops just before flag lowering and evening meal. Most of our Scouts also wear them for SM Conference and BOR.

I've been reading this thread with great interest. Have just been contacted by a Webelos Den Leader. She wants to bring her den of 10 boys and their parents to a couple of meetings and will be joining us on our December campout. The ideas and suggestions posted so far will be a big help when I talk to the parents about our Troop and the differences in Boy Scouting and Cub Scouting. Must admit that while reading the posts here, I've had several "Duh" moments - smack my forehead and mumble "why didn't I think of that" when we had our four new Webelos crossovers last Spring.

Our "planned" cold-weather campout is coming up in a few weeks. We always go to our Council Camp and use the Adirondacks (3 sided wooden structures with bunks built into the walls). I put planned in quotation marks because while we may plan for cold weather, the weather may not cooperate. This week, daytime temps are in the 70s. Back in October during our District Camporee, daytime temps were high 50s-low 60s and got down to freezing at night. One year on our winter campout it snowed. Guys had a great time with a game they made up. Form pairs. Put one Scout in a large plastic trashcan. Second Scout is the "driver." Say go, teams push the can across the snow covered meadow. Huge unplanned fun that they still talk about. They also still talk about the fall trip several years ago when temps at night dropped into the teens and their pancake batter froze as they were trying to mix it. Here in the South the weather changes dramatically during the winter. One cold weather campout saw temps in the 80s during the day and 50s at night. Another saw 30s during the day and teens at night. We've had rain, ice and snow in the morning; sun, heat and humidity in the afternoon or the next day. Ask any Southerner - in the Winter we are known to have the heat running in our cars in the morning, air-conditioning in the afternoon. Our cold weather campout to our Council camp is planned for the same time every year. The boys plan for a nature hike, orienteering and a service project. At night, campfire of course.

Has anyone taken your troop skiing in the Southeast? Scouts want to do a snow skiing/snow boarding trip in January. Have found a lot of websites in North Carolina, Tennessee, and West Virginia, but know nothing about them. Was hoping some of you out there had real experience you could share. By no means exclusive, but would like to know if you have information on resorts that have a program designed with Scouts in mind, and also group plans that include some kind of group lodging, ski rentals and lessons, even perhaps a meal plan, etc. Thanks in advance.

Update on recent visits: Father with two sons looking to change troops came on Monday. As we were sitting upstairs talking about the troop, he heard his boys laughing downstairs. He said he hadn't heard his boys laugh at a scout meeting in a very long time. Good sign. Then as he was leaving, he said he got a call from the SM of his current troop. Seems SM heard about Dad considering changing troops and called an emergency meeting of all the ASMs to talk about what is going on in their troop. Interesting. Hey Beavah - what's that you said about 20 Webelos knocking on our door? Yesterday I got an email from the Den Leader I mentioned earlier. She had talked to her assistant (the Mom that brought her Webelos son to our meeting) and she wants to bring her entire den of Webelos (10 of them) to a couple of our meetings and our December campout. I don't know how all this will turn out. The best I can hope for is that when those boys come to visit they will go away with a good feeling about our troop and decide to join. I know, of course, that they will be visiting other troops and may decide differently.

Beavah, I have often thought about the size of our troop and "how big do we want to be." My answer, so far, has always been - at least big enough to have real patrols. Right now, we have one patrol. We have 12 scouts and have tried to make two patrols, but this always falls apart. The boys decided on the patrol make-up themselves. Younger guys aligning together, older guys together. The result has always been when a campout comes up, older guys rarely go leaving us again with one patrol. So, this is something we continue to struggle with and work on. The first thing I thought of when I was contacted by the folks wanting to change troops was that we could finally work toward implementing the patrol method as it is meant to be. We have two very large troops in our District, along with the handful of small troops like ours. The one thing I have noticed in the large troops is that the adult leadership seems very disconnected from the Scouts. I really enjoy the fact that because we are small, I can get to know each Scout individually. This helps, too, in that I've found that since no two boys are alike, the methods I use to motivitate and encourage them are different. What I say to one Scout to motivate him, may fall on deaf ears to another. Also, what works when a boy is eleven, may not work when that boy is sixteen. In my post I mentioned that we have a few Webelos and their parents coming to visit, too. They looked at our website and liked all the plans on our calendar for the next year. I talked to our SPL about these folks coming on Monday and mentioned their interest in our activities (that same SPL that said "if we plan it, we can do it" posted in another thread). Should have seen him beam and puff out his chest with pride.

Next month, our Troop will be bringing a few Webelos along for our campout. Our PLC is meeting this Monday to make plans for the campout and I was hoping to get some information here on what they could plan specifically for the Webelos. Last minute, I know. I was only just contacted last week about the Webelos wanting to camp with us before they crossover in February. Our December campout would be a perfect venue for such an activity, since we are using our council camp. Just notified our SPL about this so he is prepared to keep some time open for Webelos specific activity at the campout. I was a Webelos den leader and also CM for many years so I am still familiar with their advancement requirements and outdoor activity guidelines. I will also speak to the den leaders involved and find out if they have anything specific in mind for their Scouts. I was hoping some of you here have some suggestions or plans that worked out well for you in the past. I am especially interested in those activities that were planned and conducted by the Boy Scouts themselves as both fun and instructional for the Webelos. Our Scouts have come a long way in planning and carrying out their outings, so I would like the Webelos/parents to see this in action, rather than have an adult take the little guys on a nature hike, etc. The Webelos that are visiting are from the pack for which I was CM several years ago. They always crossed over to the Troop with same CO, so this is a big deal that they are coming to take a look at us.

What an amazing week this has been. I've had the wonderful surpise of being greated with a few PMs from one of our forum bretheren with kind words and encouragement for what is going on in our troop. Another forum member has PMd me a few times asking about the difficulties we've had with our troop, since since he is having similar woes. Then, a call from an old friend. He was the den leader for my younger son from Tigers through Webelos, while I was the Cubmaster. He, his two sons, and all the boys in the den joined the troop with the same CO as our pack, while son and I went on to the troop for which I am now SM. After 2 1/2 years, he and his boys are now looking to make a change and is coming to visit our Troop on Monday. Then, an email arrived from a lady who was a Tiger Den Leader during my last year as CM. Her son is going to crossover in February and she heard I had a troop and is coming to visit on Monday. Then, another email from the CM that took over when I stepped down. Seems he's not happy with the troop he and his older son are in (same troop mentioned above), younger son will crossover from Webelos in February, and they are coming to visit our troop on Monday. The two with 2nd year Webelos also noticed from our website that our troop has a campout coming up in December and asked if it would be possible for their sons to join us. They both also asked if it would be OK to mention it to the other boys/parents in their dens. Amazing week! Sorry if this comes across as a boast. I just wanted to share this wonderful news.