gwd-scouter

What an amazing weekend! Project started Friday afternoon with the arrival of a bunch of Scouts with work gloves and shovels. Patrick had arranged for a generous Scouter to come with his bobcat to dig up the old sidewalk. Scouter and bobcat had not arrived, so Patrick got the guys to start busting it up with sledges and hauling the pieces to the dumpster. Then the bobcat arrived. I could tell Patrick was relieved. Not only did our fellow Scouter make quick work of digging up the old sidewalk, but he took the time to dig up one of the areas in the gardens that the Director asked to have removed. Not part of Patrick's project, but the Director figured if the bobcat was there and the Scouter was willing - why not? Guys proceeded to dig up the areas the bobcat couldn't get to, smooth out the walkway and get it reasonably level. Friday night's work was done. Saturday morning's arrival saw the huge pile of sand that our very generous fellow Scouter had delivered before our arrival. Wheel barrows and shovels and lot's of helpers moved the sand to the project site and hours of shoveling and compacting began. All the while, Patrick's tension was rising. The bricks had not been delivered yet. He called a few times but only got voice mail. At about noon he called again. I overheard his call and cringed. He said something along the lines of "I thought we had agreed you would deliver the bricks today at 9:00." Not the best way to deal with someone who is donating the bricks and delivering them. I thought to myself, well buddy, you may have just kissed those bricks goodbye. Much relief on his face when he got a call around 1:00 that the bricks were on the way. Scouts and adults came and went through the day. One of our new ASMs is a general contractor and gave Patrick great advice. The boys worked hard. It was a long day. Many of the parents that dropped off their sons hung around for a while to watch. I received very nice comments from them. Most were amazed at the Eagle project process and were impressed. The railroad museum and trains were open on Saturday and lot's of folks had to walk through the work area to get to the trains. The conductors told the visitors that an Eagle Scout project was in progress and to watch their step. That was cool. I had a chance to talk to the conductors and both were Eagle Scouts and thanked us over and over again about doing work for the museum. I took pictures - that was my #1 assignment. Patrick also asked me to keep the time log of the guys that showed up and when they left. I sat in a lawn chair and stayed out of the way. Really was a great way to spend the day, sitting in the sun, watching the action, talking to the parents. The sidewalk is a little over half way finished. Patrick will have to ask for more bricks and sand and schedule another work day. Speaking as a proud Mom and proud Scoutmaster, he's done a marvelous job so far. Just the look on his face at dinner last night, I can tell he's proud too. Eric (Eagle 2001) came home from college to help. That pleased Patrick more than anything.

I have always enjoyed this forum and read everything. Sometimes the discussions take a sour turn, but I have learned a lot from this valuable resource over the years. I especially enjoy seeing all the new folks come online and share their stories.

For added fun - every year at summer camp we host another troop in our campsite one evening for a campfire. Last year, along with the tradition of roasting pineapples, we all wore Hawaiian shirts and greeted our guests with flower leis.

Don't forget the neatly stacked clean underwear returning home in the footlocker. I remember that from both my boys after their first year at summer camp. Gross! I can't say precisely what the parents in our Troop expect when they join or even after their sons have been in for a while. Those that have been with us for a while have come to expect that their sons will have fun, work hard, learn, and, oh yeah, have fun. Advancement comes as a part of the process. From what I've heard from the parents of our new Scouts, they liked our troop because of our high expectations. They liked how respectful the Scouts are to the adults, and the adults to the Scouts. The liked our older Scouts and how they run the Troop. Most of all, they heard from their sons that they had fun when they visited and camped with us. Guess that was the selling point. Everyone is signed up for summer camp! New guys will go through the pathfinder program - the new Scout program at our camp that works on the requirements from Tenderfoot - First Class. Parents seem happy that the guys will stay together through the week and learn a lot. They also understand that the program does not automatically sign off on the requirements - the boys must demonstrate the skills to their PL or Troop Guide to get signed off. We do have a few boys that need extra help with swimming and the parents are excited that the boys can get that help at camp and then again back home - one of our parents offers up his swimming pool every summer for us to work with the boys. Finally, I think the parents expect their boys to come home from camp happy, excited to tell stories about the week, dirty, tired, hungry for Mom's real food, some advancements checked off or merit badges earned, and eager to do the next fun thing with the Troop. Hopefully, that's exactly how we will return their sons to them. As a side note: All those new guys showed up for Patrick's Eagle project workdays yesterday and Friday. Parents hung around for a while watching. They all got a first hand glimpse of their sons' futures if they so choose.

Place a whole pineapple on a very hot bed of embers, charcoal or wood. Every five minutes or so, rotate the pineapple a bit (use the leaves on top as a handle). Once the pineapple is black on the outside all the way around and you can see juices starting to ooze out, it's done. Usually about 30 minutes depending on the heat. Slice away and eat. Hot, juicy, sweet, yummy!

Pack - there is a BIG difference in your District Advancement guy and ours and the process. Ours meets with the candidate during monthly roundtable meetings to go over the proposed project - after all the other signatures are secured. He will make suggestions about things to include or perhaps rewording for clarification. Now, the stuff you posted about Council. It's been a year since our last Eagle Scout so things may have changed. I was able to simply fax his application to the office and the registrar called to tell me everything was fine. Then he had his BOR, got his signature from District Advancement person, mailed the app to the Council Office where I assume the SE signed it and sent it to National. Eagle Scout got his credentials about six weeks later. Your description of Council records, however, is completely in line with my experiences over the years - a disaster. When I fax the Eagle app, I also fax a copy of the Scout's advancement record from Troop Master. So far, I haven't had any problems. But, as I said, it's been a year. Perhaps Patrick's process will not go as easily.

There is no limit on the number of guys each scout can elect. Each scout voting can elect all the names on the ballot, some of them, or none of them.

In our area open fires are banned for a great part of the year, so no campfires. When we do have them, songs and skits are very popular. Just had a campout a few weeks ago with all our new Scouts. Patrols planned their skits and it was a lot of fun. Fortunately, we have a good group of older Scouts that actually enjoy acting goofy and leading silly songs, so that encourages the younger guys. At summer camp our Troop invites another Troop to our campsite one night for a campfire. We usually invite an out of council Troop. Stories are shared, a couple of pineapples are roasted on the fire, and fun is had by all.

I read about the onerous process other Council's put on Eagle candidates. Thankfully, our Council's process is not so difficult. The only thing that gets sent to Council is the Eagle application. They do ask that it be sent before the EBOR so that everything can be checked. Simple enough to fax it up there, the registrar checks the dates, and sends a message back that everything is OK. EBOR is held. Application is signed and then taken or mailed to Council to sign and then off to National. I've sat on EBOR's in our district and the reference letters are never asked for. Nope, council doesn't want them either. At least, that's the way it has been - haven't seen the new application yet. Frankly, I don't know if the references listed on the application are ever called. Guess I'll find out soon enough - Patrick is working on his project starting today and is in the process of finishing personal fitness merit badge. If all goes well, by the first of June he will be completing is application. Edit to add: packsaddle and I are in the same council. Pack, if your experience with the Eagle process is different than what I've described, I'd be interested in reading about it. Maybe it's on the District end that it's different?(This message has been edited by gwd-scouter)

Using my observations of my two sons: Eric was 14 when he did his Eagle Project, Patrick is almost 16. Patrick has done more on his own and worked through the bugs and problems he encountered along the way better than Eric did. It may not just be about age. When Eric was in the Troop, it was very adult-led and PORs weren't much more than a patch on the sleeve. Patrick, on the other hand, has had more experience in organizing things and working with people. Not to mention a couple of summers working at camp and a lot of activity with the OA - things I think have helped him, too. Thinking about all the things Patrick has had to do to get ready for his project, I can say there isn't a Scout in our Troop at age 14 or under that could have pulled it off without a lot of adult help. At least not at this point.

Actually, I'm amazed at how much he's organized on his own. Working with the Railroad Museum Director, the city to arrange for a dumpster, a private contractor he's arranged to come with his Bobcat to dig up the old sidewalks, the guy donating the bricks and another donating sand. He makes a lot of phone calls when he gets home from school and before I get home. He's home this week for spring break and happily the weather is going to be terrific tomorrow and Saturday. He just sent me an instant message. He's frustrated. Seems everyone is responding to his emails, facebook invite, etc. He's getting calls on our home phone, his cell phone, emails, and instant messages all from guys wanting more details - what time should I be there, etc. His IM to me said he can't believe how hard it is getting all these guys organized. Hmmm, seems his older brother, Eric, said the same thing when he was doing his project. Proud Mom and Proud Scoutmaster.

Yeah, I thought about it after I mentioned having 20 guys show up at the same time may not be a good idea. Should have left it alone and let him deal with it. I'll make a better effort to control myself.

Well, I do receive the eye-roll when I ask about writing to his senator as his last remaining requirement for Cit Nation. Guess he'll get around to it eventually.

Younger son, Patrick, will start the work on his Eagle project this weekend. He's been planning the project since December and has spent a lot of time on the phone, on email, and in meetings with the organization for whom he's doing the work. Now it's time to get dirty. I have tried to stay out of things, being his Scoutmaster I do not want any appearance of favoritism. The thing is, I know full well that other guys' parents help them out in planning and coordinating Eagle projects. Not necessarily doing any of the work for them, but reminding them to make phone calls, advice on scheduling, etc. I've thought many times that in my efforts to treat my son as any other Scout, I've been unfair to him. Patrick sent an email to our Troop distribution list and set up a facebook group invitation to all his facebook friends about his project. A good idea I thought. When I opened the invitation link he sent to me I noticed that the times he had listed were not the same as he had announced earlier. He listed the start time on Saturday as noon rather than 9:00 am. He fixed the time and sent another email out. I also suggested to him that he stagger the times that the guys show up. Laying out the bricks for the pathway he's building will be a long hard job, but not something that 20 guys can do all at one time. That left me wondering if I overstepped. It really is the kind of advice, as Scoutmaster, I'd give and have given to any other Scout working on his Eagle project. It is also the kind of advice I imagine other parents give their sons. (This message has been edited by gwd-scouter)

As I said in another post, I am taking things much too personally these days. Time for me to go away for a while.

Maybe feeling a bit the same, but not for the same reasons. Been suffering with lupus for three years now. I am tired. I am very tired. I absolutely love being involved with Scouting and have for the past 15 years. But, again, I'm tired. I am very tired. Maybe it's just something in the air or maybe because I've been in some ways ignoring the pleas from my body to take it slower, my normally thick skin and let it go nature is weakening. I take things much too personally these days. The Troop is at a place I envisioned several years ago. A good set of junior leaders that know what they're doing, the middle school scouts coming of age in leadership, and lot's of new Scouts and adults in training. Time for me to spend the year becoming less involved and handing off to the next generation. I am a very goal oriented person. I've accomplished what I set out to do. What do I do next? Makes me sad to think about stepping down, but it's something I will have to do. I think I would still remain active in Scouting in some way, is some less demanding role, but I can't say that for sure. Did I say I'm tired, I'm very very tired?

Since this thread was spun from my post about budgeting, guess I'll wade in first. I do not see how having a budget for food purchases (even if adult mandated) in any way takes away from attempts to be a boy-led, patrol method troop. I just don't see what the problem is in teaching the boys to work within a budget. I daresay budgeting is a lesson many Americans were not taught well. Boy-led does not mean the adults abdicate their responsibilities to teach, nor does teaching equate to adults micromanaging. I would wager that everyone on this forum in some way guides their scouts in things that are not written by national or council. Having said that, I'm sure someone will post here about how perfect his/her troop is and how it is so wonderfully boy-led that the adults would never dream of "mandating, directing, guiding" the scouts. Sorry for tenor of my post. I just get frustrated by the seemingly perfect among us.

Guess we will just have to disagree on that, Stosh.

Does anyone ask their SPL to attend monthly roundtable meetings? A lot of information is given out at roundtable, many times info that has to then be passed down by the SM to the PLC. Seems like it would be helpful if SPLs attended and got the info directly.

I think imposing a budget does teach the boys a valuable lesson. We all must learn to live within a budget - or at least we should. If no budget is imposed and the per boy cost for food is high, the pushback will not come from the Scouts - it will come from the parents. In our Troop, I know of only two Scouts that actually use their own money to pay for trips and food - my son and another older Scout. I do wish the "Scout is Thrifty" law - a Scout pays his own way - was taken more seriously (or given any consideration) by parents, but in our Troop it just isn't so. As for our trip costs and food costs. They are combined into one fee which, with the exception of the two boys mentioned above, is paid by the parents usually in the form of a check. We do ask for them to pay in cash whenever possible. That way, when the grubmaster for a patrol is selected, he is given cash to go shopping. We will reimburse if he goes over, but our experience is that these guys try very hard to stay in their budget and are enormously proud when they do - always bringing me the receipt to show how well they did. As far as big items like charcoal and propane, the quartermaster checks the supply before we leave for a trip. If anything is needed, he tells our ASM/quartermaster and he guys whatever is necessary out of Troop funds. We keep a food box with left over nonperishables the guys can go through before shopping to see if they can use anything. They have gotten better about bringing some things from home rather than buying new - spices for instance - which saves them money. The worst money waste seems to come from orange juice. Guys always have that on their breakfast menus and then hardly drink it. I brought home four full containers of OJ from our last campout. Good news - brought it back to Monday's meeting and the new Scouts were happy to drink it after they worked on their Tenderfoot fitness requirement.

Lifetime warranty? I didn't know about that. Have a pair of switchbacks on which the left ankle zipper broke. Do I have to return to Scoutstuff or will my Council shop give me a replacement?

We would have a big problem getting to the 50% if all the new Scouts abstain. We started with nine Scouts and in the course of a couple of weeks received twelve new Scouts (just had another new guy walk through the door last Monday). So, you see, new Scouts make up more than 50% of our Troop. I am going to ask around at roundtable tonight and see what suggestions I get from the adult OA members and experienced Scouters.

Ever since the switchback pants came out, we've never had a problem with the guys wearing the full uniform. I can see why they like them better than the old style. The guys wear them on campouts and backpack trips. Hardly ever see blue jeans anymore. Younger son and a friend work on camp staff and wear the Venturing uniform. They both have worn the gray shorts/pants to school. Guess it's because of the color - they don't look like Boy Scout pants. Then again, both these boys along with a few others are known to wear Boy Scouting Tshirts to school, too. So far, a few of our Scouts have purchased the new shirt and say the like it much better than the old. The material is more comfortable and the green isn't as flashy. All of our new Scouts have the new shirt. As far as the change from red to green. I also heard (from a trading post clerk) that it was because of animals. I wonder how that rumor started? I like the new uniforms and the new colors, with one exception - the chest pockets. I just don't see the need for their design. Don't look bad on men, but kind of ridiculous on women. Eventually, I'm going to sew mine down.

our patrol budgets are $10 per Scout. Same for the adults. Sometimes they go over a bit, but are very proud when they buy everything they need within their budget. They eat very well on that budget, too, so do the adults. Long ago, older son was in a Troop that did it differently. They had no budget. The Scout that buys the food brings the receipt to the next meeting and the boys are told they must pay their share. Not knowing any better, I wrote out a check after every campout for whatever amount I was told. Gotta say, I got a bit peeved when those amounts were in the $20 range, and this was ten years ago! From what my son told me they ate, I couldn't figure why it cost so much. Of course when he said they ate beef, perhaps it was filet mignon. I don't know if they still do it that way.

Indeed. A well chosen Scoutmaster's minute will probably gain the Scouts' attention more than a long lecture.