Gold Winger

I do think that it is a shame that most, if not all packs, equate earning the AOL with "crossing over." A boy can earn the AOL long before cross over and continue to work on belt loops, activity pins and the like. When I mentioned this to my sons' Den Leader, the response was "what's the point?"

The Arrow of Ligh HAS been there for a long time but it wasn't always called that. In my 1967 "Webelos Scout Book" says, "The Webelos Award may be earned by any Webelos Scout or Cub Scout beginning at age 10 years 3 months." Those were the good old days when you couldn't join Boy Scouts until your 11th birthday. I think that avoided the entire mess of New Scout Patrols, New Scout ASMs and the grand mess of "making Tenderfoot before Summer Camp."

I'm much more fit than the most men my age, does that make me immoral?

I'd guess that she could do the work but it wouldn't count for anything.

Uneven? I don't have a problem with mine. I do press mine flat with a hot iron so they don't filp around on the epaulettes.

What infoscouter said is true. Once you remove that black belt, it will next to imposssi.ble to put it back in. It can be done but requires two men, a small boy and a Siberian Husky.

I don't know if it is a choice or not but no one puts a gun to their head and says, "do these strange things." Okay, most of the time there's no gun involved.

" Switchback Pants were one of those "non-approved" changes (a change in material, not in color or look/function)" They definately are a different color. Tehy look different. They function differently too.

"Goldwing...don't forget "more humble"!!!" I believe it was Mickey Mantle who said, "it aint braggin' if its true." :-)

This is not to say that anyone on this board is making the claim but let's look at this in a differnt light. I'm always amazed at how people who claim to be poor and broke always have money for cigarettes and beer. I don't smoke but I think that the cost of a pack of smokes is around $5. Stop smoking and that's $1800 a year for a pack a day smoker. I drink about six beers a year but I bet that cutting out those weekly visits to Billy-bob's Bar would save a similar amount. I work with a fellow who tells me that he can't afford a computer or internet access. I was going to give him a computer until he revealed that he spends over $100 a month for cable TV with all the extras. I can't afford a Scout uniform is the cry of the fellow who owns a Harley and wears a Harley jacket, Harley boots and a harley helmet and carries a harley wallet and pocket watch. Going to Philmont put a good sized hit on my savings account but $1300 isn't going to make that much of a difference in four years of college. What's that today? One class? It's always a matter of priorities. No, I'm not perfect but I keep working at it.

"wonder on what basis you think you can speak for the 'average heterosexual man'?" You're right, I cannot. I'm smarter than average. Taller than average. Better looking than average (or so I'm told). Fitter than average. Dress better than average. And have far better taste in cars and motorcycles than average. :-) Actually, I base my comments on my interactions with a wide cross section of people, of all ages and from many walks of life.

""Signs UP" indicates that what we are going to say furthers the Three Points." Okay, yeah, sure. How about the announcement that tree fell on the blue car in the parking lot? Okay, that could be duty to others. How about "no ones turned in their permisiion slips for the ski trip"?

"Dan, I sometimes think that homophobia is diminishing. And then I have to wonder if I'm deceiving myself by that. " Its not truly a phobia which means fear. It is a general dislike for the actions and activities and I really dont think that is diminishing despite what the PC crowd and Hollywood want us to believe. Hamsters, billiard balls and the general attitude that they know how to dress better than the rest of us is what drives the distaste of the average heterosexual man for homosexulaity.

I'd heard that term used before.. It doesn't seem like that big of a change. The OA members who come to the troop to run elections always tell the scouts that they should consider who they'd want to go camping with.

You miss my point entirely Dan. Society considers that heterosexual men cannot be trusted with young women because we're driven by urges that we cannot control. It follows that homosexual men cannot be trusted with young men because they suffer similar urges. I'm not driven mad with lust by my daughters girl scout troop and I'm sure that tj isn't driven mad with lust by boy scouts but isn't it better to be safe than sorry? At least that's what they tell me.

"It's a temporary patch, so right pocket, ideally for no more than six months but only the Uniform Police are going to actually keep track how long it stays there..." That's an urban myth. There's no ideal time for how long one should wear a temporary patch. You can wear one forever and be in violation of no policy. You can dig out ones from 1967 when you were a cub scout and wear it.

It's very 21st century to have it electronically but you can't take the computer into the john with you :-) Also it is far easier to pull the book out of your briefcase to show that Scouter where his position patch goes than digging out your notebook computer, turning on and then surfing to www.scouting.org. Electronic books may be a useful aid but theyll never fully replace the printed versins.

First. The scout sign is not with the arm and hand extended above the head, that's something else. the scout sign is with the upper arm parallel to the floor and the forearm straight up. Secnd. Never yell "signs up" just put it up and wait.

"* 1998- The OA adopted the new arrowhead logo and redefined itself as Scoutings National Honor Society" OA didn't blip onto my radar until after 98. What was it before then?

Any married man knows that when dealing with women, "whats mine is mine and whats yours is mine." For some reason it is okay for GSUSA to say that only women can be leaders (men can only be assistants) because girls need a positive female role model. But when men say that womone shouldn't be in BSA because boys need positive male role models we're called neanderthals and behind the times. Women went to court to invade mens clubs but there are still womens clubs around. I wanted to work at Victoria's Secret but they wouldn't even let me fill out an application. Go down to Men's Warehouse or Jos. Banks and half of the staff are women. What Lola wants, Lola gets!

"Thinking homosexually is wrong based on your religious and other beliefs may be a good reason to exclude them but, all other things being equal, I dont believe a gay man is inherently any more of a sexual threat to a boy then a straight woman." Since most of the universe seems to think that a heterosexual man is a threat to the virtue of a teenaged girl. We should follow that thought process and treat homosexual men as threats to the virtue of teenaged boys. I posed this issue before but all tj did was dance and say, "were already out there. ha. ha." (paraphrashing)

I don't think that ed's missed the point. Changing your position because of the natterings of outsiders never makes an organization stronger. Look at the Girl Scouts. They keep changing trying to be relevant but they don't seem to attract the girls that they change to please.

I missed the post about the threatening comments. Now he did something to warrant exclusion. Packs don't have to accept all comers.

Since the bylaws and rules are not generally available to the average member, I'll go with what I know of other organizations. Im sure that if you read the rules the Cheif Scout or board of directors has powers beyond those specified in writing which makes their decisions the same as an enumerated rule. Just like the EPA publishing a rule, it may not have been enacted by congress but they have the power to do so and you and I have to toe the line.

Yep. Yessir. Yeperoonie. Uh-huh. Da. Ja. Si. Oui. Sure ting.