GKlose

I've seen many different variations of Arrow of Light ceremonies and Crossover ceremonies. For example, my son's pack combines the two into one ceremony, delivered at the Blue and Gold banquet (which is treated as an "end of the program year" banquet). In an adjacent town, I've talked with a Scoutmaster who is adamant: "the Crossover ceremony is our ceremony." There is no waffling with him -- if the pack wants to do an Arrow of Light ceremony at their Blue and Gold Banquet, it is just fine with him. He takes care of the crossover ceremony for those coming into the troop. After all this, the one thing I can safely say is there really aren't any conventions or rules or anything else. It comes down to whatever it is you want to arrange between a pack and a troop. In your case, it looks to me like you have a perfect case of needing separate Arrow of Light and Crossover ceremonies. A compromise solution, as it were. Guy

Thanks, everyone, for the input -- We had a planning meeting last night, and I found out a little more from the chair. He wants to keep the competition a little more open-ended than I had been working on. I'm not sure exactly what that means yet, but I'll be working on a second draft this week and see what he thinks. So, this will be at a district camporee with a backpacking theme. There may be 12 to 16 patrols there, and we'll all probably be in the area about the size of a football field. Experience tends to be all over the map (for example, this kind of competition will be very new for my troop -- very much out of their comfort zone). One guy at the meeting suggested weighing kitchen utensils, such as pots, but I didn't want to go down that path. I wouldn't want to give an edge to a patrol or patrol member that can afford a titanium pot, for example, when everyone else is using a 2L stainless steel pot (or something like that). Similarly, I'd like to make sure that using commercial backpacking food doesn't score as highly as someone who uses some creativity. We may look at total cost of food (I'm still thinking that one through). I came up with several scoring categories, and added them to a flyer, with descriptions, but the Activity chair thought it was being too pedantic, I think. I had categories (and I was thinking something like scoring 10 to 20 points per category) like nutrition, food weight, ease of prep, hygiene/cleanup, leave no trace (how much packaging and waste left over), final food quality and creativity. I like the "patrol spirit" aspect that's been suggested, so I'll try and work that in, too. I'm planning on a pre-cook weigh-in (final weight divided by # of patrol members, to put everyone on an equal footing), and then a walk-around by judges to observe the "ease of prep", method, etc. aspect. I'd like to see a somewhat balanced trail dinner, nutritionally-speaking, so that a patrol that puts some thought into that might score a little higher. One thing I want to avoid -- a pet peeve of mine -- is to develop a detailed scoring method, but then keep it hidden from those competing. Wouldn't it be lousy, for example, to find out that "nutrition" is one scoring category when it isn't specified up front? While the activity chair wants the event to be more open-ended, I'd like to avoid keeping the scoring system hidden. Thanks again, everyone -- I really appreciate the input. Guy

I'll follow up in the other thread, but I spent part of the weekend working on the plan for the "trail dinner" competition, and then last night at a camporee planning session I was promptly told (more or less) "too complicated". I was looking to specify criteria for judging, and then also sort of summarizing that in a flyer to be handed out to patrols. I considered the top three categories to be finished food quality, weight of pre-cooked food, and creativity (this is how I planned to account for some people using commercial backpacking food and others doing something from scratch). This would be followed closely by ease of prep and ease of cleanup. I wanted to work some kind of "Leave No Trace" points in, maybe by weighing leftover trash, and maybe giving points for stove use, versus fire use. Maybe something like that. But the activity chairman sent me back to the drawing board, asking me to simplify the flyer, and the "specs" on the competition. He wanted more room for interpretation. I can understand his viewpoint, so I'm going to work on that this week. Thanks, everybody -- I really appreciate the attention that has been paid to this topic. Guy

My mind has been churning away today -- earlier this week, at a district committee meeting, the activities chair was talking about an upcoming camporee where the theme will be backpacking. He was asking for help with some competition ideas, and when he was asking about a backpacking cooking competition I told him it would be right up my alley for judging. So I've been churning away on some ideas. I want to establish some scoring parameters ahead of time...nutrition, weight, utensil simplicity, style of cooking, ease of cooking, quality (taste/flavor), etc. Whatever I can dream up. The idea would be easy scoring with 3 or so judges, and maybe use taste/flavor score as a tie-breaker (and, if needed, weight as a second tie-breaker). I'm thinking about asking for a recipe to be submitted prior to meal prep starting, and also asking them to bring their ingredients to be weighed in (so everyone has equal footing on a common scale). Weight, of course, would have to be a per-person thing. It takes more to feed 8 scouts than it does 5 scouts, for example. One place I'm stumped: some patrols may want to use freeze-dried backpacking food that is commonly available. But I wouldn't want to put that on the same footing as something that is scratch-made out of grocery store ingredients. Also -- I don't want to dictate scratch only. Maybe bonus points for grocery store style? I'm not sure. We haven't talked about awards yet, but the overall camporee might declare a winning patrol. I'd like to do something special for just the cooking competition. Two ideas I've come up with are giving the winner a copy of a cookbook, such as One-Pot Gourmet, or something like that. Or the other idea is to take a cheap mess kit lid and handle and spray paint it gold, label it, and call it something like the coveted "Golden Mess Kit Award", so it can be used again and again. Something goofy like that. I'd like the whole thing to be fun, not daunting. Anyone have any other ideas? Thanks, Guy

I have chronic misfiring neurons, but I think it went something like this: "Here's Buster Brown, he lives in your shoe, and here's his dog Spot, he lives in there too." Wasn't Spot a white dog with a circle around one eye, not unlike the Little Rascal's dog? Guy

I remember as far back as my brothers being Cub Scouts. None of them really stuck with Boy Scouts, maybe because we moved to a new town about the same time. Shortly after moving, I was old enough to join Cubs, so I did. In fact, one of my old denmates (his mom was our den mother) just contacted me online the other day, after not having heard from him in almost 30 years. Second year, my mom was our den mother. There was a kid in our den that, years later, murdered his parents. My mom sent me the newspaper clippings. I don't remember much about him past Jr High, when we were in the same shop class. He struggled with it, and the rest of school. Things didn't go right for him after that. Eventually, he turned to drugs and the murder of his parents happened after them delivering a dose of "tough love" and saying no to his demand for more money. It's a very sad story. Anyway, I moved on to a Scout troop when I turned 11. Things really couldn't have gone much better, I think. It was a ton of fun, and we were very active. Council summer camp, summer camp on our own, annual fall backpacking trips, caving trips every March, high adventure trips to Philmont, Maine and Ely, the '73 national jamboree. I'm hoping that my sons have as much fun as I did. Guy

This wasn't Bugling MB. I could probably do that in about 10 minutes (if I was a counselor) provided the Scout knew all the calls already. :-) I tried something new with the two new guys last night -- had I not done that, we probably could have been done in less than 20 minutes. I took the "adult association" part seriously. I asked them about their troops, their rank. Then we started in on music. I asked them what instruments they play, who they study with, their school bands, etc. After that, we started to go over the requirements. Since there are two requirements that involve options, we talked about the possibilities. They'd ask questions, basically trying to figure out how little they could do to pass (I'm only being slightly sarcastic here...one requirement, for example, says something like "catalog your, or your parent's, collection of 12 or more CDs, tapes, LPs, etc"...one of them starts going down the path of "my parents have lots of CDs, so is it okay if I just catalog Christmas CDs?"). After that, I focused on the one requirement about families of musical instruments. We went through them, discussing which ones belong in which categories, and how the "class" of instrument produces sound. It was more discussion than teaching, although I couldn't help myself at one point, and introduced the concept of the harmonic series to them. When I drew out a sine wave, they'd mentioned seeing it in some class at school already. Lots of MBs have core requirements that demonstrate a basic proficiency in the subject area. In this case, I wish Music MB had a little bit more of general music in it, such as discussions of the basic elements of music (melody, harmony, rhythm, etc.). I think there could be some "gravitas" added to the merit badge without making it unwieldy. As it stands, it's a pretty simple MB. Guy

About a year ago, I signed on as a Music MB counselor. Waited for the calls to start pouring in :-) One call came in September. Had a first meeting (about an hour), set a "plan of action" for the scout to work on, and he was to call me back when he's finished. That call came last week, and we finished in about a half hour (so, grand total of time was about an hour and a half). Two weeks ago, I got a call from a scout representing he and his buddy. They also want to work on it, and we met last night for the first time. We'll finish up again (in about a half hour) whenever they are ready. I told them "the only deadline is your 18th birthday". They seemed motivated to finish, so I expect I'll get a call back in about a week or two. If one already plays an instrument, it's a rather easy merit badge to do. So far, all three of these young charges have gravitated towards the easier requirements. That's okay with me -- I just wish they'd use the opportunity to expand their horizons a little. Last night, as we were talking about families of musical instruments, one of the scouts thought he was giving me a wise-guy answer when asked about wind instruments. He said "didgeridoo". But I turned it back on him -- I said, "did you know you can find examples on the internet on building your own didgeridoo? You could use that for requirement 4, 'make and learn how to play a traditional instrument.'" His eyes lit up a little, and I hope he goes for it. Guy

Just a side comment -- I've now participated in a few troop open houses and Webelos visits. I've spent my time seeking out parents to talk to them about the troop, offering to answer any questions they might have. A common refrain from me is "there's a fundamental difference between Cub Scouts and Boy Scouts" and I go on to explain that while Cub Scouts are centered around parent-child, Boy Scouts is more about personal growth. I explain that while there are several parents involved with the troop, not all parents are, and that it is okay. Either way is fine with us. Guy

Thanks everybody -- I really appreciate the input. Just last night, the CC sent out an email reminder about summer camp (early-bird sign-ups are due in a couple of days) and he asked me to forward the email to the "feeder pack" den leader. Within a half hour, the den leader had responded with the note that two out of the three were definitely interested. We're not sure if the third guy will crossover to our troop or not, but I would think it is likely, given that the entire rest of his den is. Maybe many councils do this, but ours seems to have extra consideration for Webelos who are crossing over. While our summer camp early-bird roster is due in a couple of days, any Webelos added on at a later date can still get early-bird pricing. The council knows that not every Webelos is ready to commit this early. So why penalize them with full-price summer camp? As long as we don't overflow the campsite we've booked, I don't think there's a problem. I may just talk to the den leader and the CM/CC...since they've finished AoL and all activity badges, it would be best to get them their Scout badges, and start work on Tenderfoot right away. By the way, one reason we were fairly successful with crossovers this year is because of a program we offered for the town's second year Webelos last fall. I called it "Outdoorsman Overnight" -- it was an overnight, with the troop, where they pretty much went through everything they needed for the Outdoorsman Activity Badge. Every Webelos that came with us on that overnight chose us as their new troop. It was awkward offering that last fall, with school starting up, fall sports and the Webelos Arrow of Light Weekend (at the local summer camp) all conflicting. So, we're repeating it this spring -- we have a good pile of 1st year Webelos in the feeder pack, so this next year's recruiting should be fairly successful too. Thanks again, everyone -- Guy

Hello all -- as background, I'm membership chair for a troop. Last year, my son was the only Webelos from town (out of 20 or so total Webelos) to join this particular troop, so I figured that the troop needed help with recruiting. Things went well this year -- I wrote a membership plan, the troop committee supported it, and we've slowly been implementing changes. Crossover season is now well under way, and we've done pretty well. Three crossed from a pack over this last Sunday, one of which was my younger son. Another pack, our "feeder pack", has 3 Webelos moving on this year, and we're likely to have at least two out of three cross over. The third is uncommitted at this point, but their den leader brought all of them to a troop meeting the night before last. The uncommitted one knows my younger son from school, and my son (unasked by me) sought him out and talked with him at the meeting. So far, so good. Here's the uncharted territory for me: while I was talking with the den leader, he mentioned that all three of them have run out of things to do. They've finished Arrow of Light and all activity badges (he now has them looking ahead and learning material from Tenderfoot, and that's fine too). But their pack's B&G Banquet is treated as an "end of year" awards banquet, and their Arrow of Light and Crossover ceremony is being held until then. They have it scheduled for the first Saturday in June! But I was stumped at that point. I told him that by all means, start bringing them to troop meetings and we'll figure out a way to bring them on outings. I was trying to articulate that maybe he should have them awarded Arrow of Light sooner, and we'd do the crossover sooner, but then that kind of works against the awards banquet idea. I don't want to cheat them out of a special time, especially as a last hurrah with their pack. (I've worked at developing the relationship with their pack, the "feeder pack", this year, and now that I know their leadership pretty well, I can make suggestions for next year -- I think the present CM/CC would respond to suggestions that would serve the interests of scouts better...next year is looking good already, because they have some 21 or 22 first-year Webelos right now) Does anyone have any comments or suggestions on how to handle these late crossovers? Thanks, Guy

Pretty much the same story with our troop -- annual calendar is planned in August and September, which is kind of based on the prior year, with placeholders. Then revisions happen along the way, as needed. An example: the troop had been participating in an annual fishing derby that opens a local pond, and the date doesn't get set until January or so. The district spring camporee falls a week or two later. This year, they ended up a week apart, and the troop decided to attend the spring camporee instead of the fishing derby (individuals can still participate, but there wouldn't be a troop overnight beforehand). There had also been talk of doing a "high adventure trip sometime this summer"...as the year progressed, that became a 5-day canoe trip in August. Details are being worked out in the next month or so. Guy

From the famous "Singing Flight Attendant" on SWA (she sang everything, including pre-flight instructions), circa 1997: "We Love You, You Love Us We're much faster than the bus, and we hope you've enjoyed our hospitality. Marry one of us, and you'll fly free!"

I don't have a ton of experience with this, but in the last two years, I've attended three large events. Two were council-run Webelos Arrow of Light weekends (so about half the participants were 10 years old). Saw pretty much the same behavior as you, minus the airlift. In one case, it was a kid that sliced his hand with his pocketknife. I know the kid and his dad (even though they were in a different pack than us) and I know the dad's attitude about "hands off" parenting. The part that disturbed me the most, though, were the Webelos that were allowed to run around after 10pm at night, screaming at the top of their lungs. I don't understand how parents and den leaders can be oblivious to that kind of thing. Guy

Zowie, I missed dropping "Xenia" yet again!

When I was a scout, growing up in SW Ohio, we made an annual trip to Carter Caves S.P. in Kentucky. It was one of the best-loved trips for the entire troop. We'd go every March, when the outdoors weather might be quite unpredictable. Inside a cave, things were always nice and cozy, and often muddy. Another highlight of that same trip -- we'd leave Friday afternoon, after school was out, arrive and set up camp in the S.P. We'd always have some kind of a special event -- one year, we had a Friday night campfire in a cave (I'm assuming that we had permission from the S.P.). Most other years, we'd go on a night hike, to see a natural bridge. Our SM took great pains to teach us how to hike, quietly, without flashlights. And he was right -- the whole experience was better that way. Anyway, Carter Caves S.P. was a lot of fun. There are all types of caves there, from fully-lit, and guided, to guided-wild, to unguided-wild, historical and otherwise. We'd also often go to a relatively challenging cave outside the park, on private property. Guy

Oh my, perhaps the novelty has worn off.

Our troop is still old-fashioned, but at least the council has taken a step forward. The council has an online calendar with events listed that link into an online payment system. It's pretty convenient. The only part I don't like about it is that it seems whoever is setting up events gets to decide whether the online transaction surcharge is built-in to the overall price, or added on after the fact. I'd much rather it be built-in to the price. Check it out at www.yccbsa.org (click on the menu in the upper right to get to the online calendary -- then choose to look at details for any event -- you'll see a connection to "DoubleKnot" which is the online payment system). Guy

Dudes, you missed Stosh taking it from Z to Y. But I'm disappointed I didn't get to use "X as in Xenia" (my hometown).

Safe to say some know how to "color within the lines" and some don't.

I'd like to agree with what was said earlier -- for a bunch of newbies, I think the best thing you can do is to spend the half hour (or less) and do the Fast Start training online. It is an easy introduction to how units should operate. For the Cub level, they have Fast Start tailored to CC, CM, Tiger Cub DL, Wolf and Bear DL, and Webelos DL. You can find the online training by going to scouting.org, and click on MyScouting. You can register now, and then later on when you get your ID card, you can enter in the membership number to get credit for your online training. After Fast Start, Youth Protection Training might take another 20 to 30 minutes. If things are going well, someone in another post listed an online source for New Leader Essentials (the national rollout of a replacement course is in the works). Spending $12 or so on the CM Handbook is a great idea. Time spent in that manual is time well spent. It has answers to almost everything you want to know. Guy

I asked a very similar question of my son's SM -- they were heading to summer camp just a couple of months after he joined. The SM said exactly the same thing: swimming and first aid are reasonable merit badges to work on during a first summer camp. But, my (then) Tenderfoot son had other plans. He says he had fun at camp, but he didn't really work on advancement other than a couple of craft lodge merit badges, and shooting once at the archery range (scoring well enough to get that one requirement marked off on Archery MB). He didn't really try during his swim test, so he was classified as a non-swimmer, and didn't go to instructional swim all week. He didn't go to the "first year" program to work on 2C/1C advancement. I'm happy he had fun this last year, but I'm going to suggest he come up with a plan for this year at camp. We'll see if he follows through Guy

It certainly isn't an official source, but here is one viewpoint: http://usscouts.org/mb/proposals.asp Guy

Way back in summer '71, as a Tenderfoot, my first merit badge was Reading. It helped that my mom was studying library science at a local university, and she hooked me up with a librarian that sort of mentored me through the process. But this brings up an interesting point to me -- reading and scholarship could be combined and would make sense, but also the breadth and depth of Reading could be changed to be more of a Library Science focus (if the field is specific enough for a graduate degree, Master of Library Science, it could warrant it's own merit badge). I had another thought yesterday -- I would be all for dropping (immediately, without question) any merit badge that could be done in a short time at a "merit badge college". In fact, I just heard a story from my DE that he earned Soil and Water Conservation in two hours at a national jamboree merit badge midway when he was a kid. That's the kind of thing I think should be clamped down upon. The idea of awarding a merit badge after a couple of hours of effort seems to me to be completely at odds with what a merit badge is all about. (confession time: not long ago, someone in our council put out a call for counselors for a "merit badge college" specifically for sciences/engineering/technical/arts merit badges -- I sent him email to volunteer, but when the time came to actually commit, I had second thoughts. Reading in this forum had a lot to do with that. I realized that I have no interest in being party to handing out merit badges with substandard effort, and many of the ones I counsel can't be done in just a few hours. The list of offered merit badges grew too, so that a scout could sign up for, and earn, many Eagle required merit badges too. The whole event started going a direction that I don't believe in.) Guy

http://meritbadge.org/wiki/index.php/Medicine