GKlose

In "The Complete Walker", didn't Colin Fletcher talk about backpacking in the buff?

Time and time again, you'll hear the expression "organized chaos" to describe a regular troop meeting. Under close observation you should probably see things being accomplished, with youth leadership taking care of things. Adults, ideally, might be sitting around observing, one-on-one conferencing (such as SM conferences), or taking care of committee business. The important thing, though, is that it isn't Cubs. It shouldn't be like Den Leaders and Cubmasters organizing, running things and entertaining youth. For example, our troop recently hosted an overnight for a group of Webelos. At one point, I noticed that we had a few scouts off with small groups of Webelos, the SM was talking to a couple of older scouts, and a few other scouts were off doing their own thing, and about six or eight Webelos dads were sitting at a picnic table observing what was going on. As membership chair of the troop, I'm kind of like their liaison, so I sat with them a bit and told them that while it looked like "organized chaos" it was actually running quite well. From the noise going on, you could tell everyone was busy and having fun. Anyway -- I'd suggest that you observe a bit more with the new filter that Boy Scouts is not Cub Scouts. If it still bothers you, talk to the SM or the CC and find out if you're missing something. Guy

I could see the possibility that a donation could be adjusted upwards if it is indeed tax deductible. Guy

I've been a district membership chair (on a subcommittee of 1, more or less) for the last year. I've spent the last year trying to figure out what I'm supposed to be doing. Along the way, I've been talking to just about everyone I meet, asking them for their ideas of what they want from the district membership committee, and what we should be doing. It's been an interesting year. I could probably write several pages on what I've discovered over the last year, and in fact I plan on writing a strategic membership plan Any Day Now (we're always focused on the tactics, without a clear-cut strategic plan). One of the questions I asked our DE is this: are we concerned about onesies? Meaning, of course, are we trying to make sure we reach all possible new cubs, retain every single scout, make sure every Webelos Scout crosses over? His answer was yes, we want to make sure nobody drops through the cracks. He added that sometimes the difference of meeting membership goals (and I fully understand what that means to him) can come down to just a single boy or two. This last spring, I (for the first time in the district, I think) did a survey with every CS Pack in the district to track Webelos eligible to cross over. It wasn't that difficult to get the information, but it did take some persistence in email. I didn't have to resort to calling unit leaders, for which I am thankful. Interesting results, I think -- pretty close to 100% of Webelos crossed over. Only a small handful (I recall, less than 5 in the district) are dropping out. The dropout number was much higher from Webelos I to Webelos II. My DE has mentioned that he would like to do a "Save Our Scouts" initiative, which involves contacting Webelos and young Boy Scouts that didn't reregister to invite them to rejoin. I've asked him for a list of names, I don't have it yet. I can't see myself calling a bunch of people, but I can see offering a "recruiting list" to interested units. Guy

"Yes, but five 12 year olds would have a heck of a time carrying a 300lbs all muscle linebacker 5 miles out after he broke his leg." Interesting point, it is. I recently did a Wilderness First Aid course taught by SOLO, and one of the teachers is an active member of (as I recall) Androscoggin Rescue in the White Mountains. Anyone who has been up that way knows that weather is severe, accidents are common (see recent thread on the lost Eagle Scout), and one is never all that far from a road, distance-wise. But evacuations can, and do, take several hours. Anyway, this teacher/rescuer talked about the many evacuations he's been a part of, and I recall him saying that normal evacuations take a minimum of 20 adult rescuers, because they switch off that frequently. He also gave us a typical time these things take, and although I don't recall the exact number (it is in a notebook at home), it was something like a mile per hour. So, a thirty minute evacuation rule would typically mean less than a half mile from a trailhead. Give or take, more or less. Guy

We cycled through 3 packs along the way -- it's a long story, so I won't repeat it here. But I will offer some hindsight. The first pack was tiny, and was a "one-man show." We probably had 12 to 15 Cubs, as I recall, and pack meetings were like (as CalicoPenn put it) a "super-den" meeting. We'd plan them so that multiple achievements happened, cutting across den boundaries. The CM/CC decided he'd had enough. He only gave us about a week before he announced that he would be moving to a new pack, and at least half of the families followed. The first time I met our DE (and a UC that I didn't know existed) was at an "emergency parents meeting" where two other dads and I showed up. There was nothing but pressure from the DE and UC to keep the pack alive. No help or advice, just a guilt trip being laid upon our feet. It didn't happen, and the pack folded. We moved on to the other pack, and were unhappy there. So we moved to another pack, and finished up our final three years there. We were fairly unhappy there too. The bottom line is that the original, small pack, was our most comfortable fit, and I regret that it folded so quickly and that we couldn't save it. But I've noticed most of the packs in town are "one-man shows" and I've come to realize that is exactly the wrong way to run a pack. The healthy, vibrant packs have a strong committee with distributed leadership. Perhaps we, as adult leaders, concentrate on building the program so much that we lose sight of the idea that building a strong committee is a critical job. One final note: that original pack, the small one, was a feeder pack for a small scout troop. The oldest one in town, dating back to the 1920s. That troop is probably folding this year. The SM blames the fact that he lost the feeder pack. Guy

I'm not sure of the arrangement, but a town near where I live (Boxford, MA) has a municipal park called "Boy Scout Park": http://maps.google.com/maps?hl=en&um=1&ie=UTF-8&q=scout+park+boxford&fb=1&split=1&gl=us&view=text&latlng=11567810982033389553 With a little bit of digging, I'm sure you could find out more about their arrangement. Guy(This message has been edited by GKlose)

Our council had their first UoS a little over a year ago (a DE brought in the idea), and the second one was the last January. I attended both, and enjoyed both. All sessions that I attended, except for one, were interesting and useful. The one that wasn't was a case of apresenter cancelling at the last second, the replacement was overloaded and didn't teach it, and the guy who did showed up 15 minutes late and winged it. It was a waste of an hour. But other than that, everything was great and I'm looking forward to the next one (and I plan on volunteering to teach a session). A CD: I think that is an interesting idea. Especially if the basic program is the same, year after year, it would be interesting to gather a series of course notes, along with resources. Many documents are available online now (Troop Program Features, for example) and those could be included too (as long as there is no issue with copyright and distribution). guy

I recently took advantage of the BOGO offer at scoutstuff.org. Mix & match is available, so I ordered a cotton uniform shirt and pants. They arrived yesterday, and I noticed that labels on both said "Made in U.S.A.". So, here's the opportunity. Reduced prices, even. The only difference, I guess, is that you have to use an iron. :-) Because of the reduced price, I also bought an activity shirt (made in Hong Kong). Looks like a nicely designed shirt. As I think others have mentioned, it's too bad the Centennial shirt isn't more like it. Guy

As a district membership chair, I've been keenly aware of what the packs in our district have been doing for recruiting. Yes, the primary source of recruiting has been to try and get new Tigers in every fall. But flyers (for pack open houses, or "sign-up nights") go out to every boy in an elementary school. Parents and Cubs are encouraged to bring friends and siblings. Two initiatives we've tried this last year: "It's Not Too Late To Join" -- a second round of flyers going out to schools in the Oct/Nov timeframe. Pretty much fell flat with the packs in our district. Most felt like they had recruited enough already, or were already too full. One of those packs only had 24 Cubs total, which I found rather frustrating. Spring recruitment - Kindergartners are eligible to join (as Tiger Cubs) as of June 1. They can then participate in a pack's summer program. So far this has fallen flat in our district because most packs "suspend operations" over the summer. Which I think is tragic. Summer is the best time of year around here to be outdoors and doing something, and the majority of the packs don't do anything between June 1 and late September. So our district is trying to assist units on several fronts. One is encouraging them to have some kind of summer program. The other is to get the details of fall round-up taken care of before school starts (after Labor Day). Most packs have been waiting until school starts before they even start planning their roundup, so September becomes "sign-up night" time, and the first full pack meeting is in October. Guy

One of my friends, who used to be a guide at the Maine National High Advenure Area, used to wear LL Bean "canoe shoes" all summer long. They wear out, but for a week or two, they should be fine.

Has everyone caught on to the "buy one, get one" sale on scoutstuff.org (and presumably at Scout shops)? Pre-centennial uniform parts being cleared out. It wasn't clear to me, at first, that mix & match is allowed, but when I placed an order for pants and a shirt, the shirt popped up as free (once I plugged in the coupon code at checkout). guy

I'm about ready to buy a tent and have found this thread to be really helpful: http://www.scouter.com/forums/viewThread.asp?threadID=231994 It seems difficult to beat the Alps Mountaineering "Scout direct" pricing, and it looks like pretty much everyone who has tried them is happy with the quality. Guy

I was a huge fan of the HBO Series "The Wire", and it was the opening sequence of the first show that roped me in. On the site of a homicide, a homicide detective is sitting down on a set of row house steps with a witness. The detective is talking to the witness about the deceased's "street" name: Snot Boogie. The discussion culminates with a line from the detective that goes something like "you've got allergies or some stuff like that, and you're in desperate need of a tissue and can't find one, so all of a sudden you're pegged with a name like 'Snot Boogie'?". Guy

I finished 1st Class right before skill awards were introduced. But I remember one of our senior scouts coming back from Schiff sporting a new beret, talk of a revised program and about the introduction of skill awards. Years later, when I figured out that skill awards had been axed, but that the Cub Scout Academics and Sports program reintroduced belt loops, I figured someone at national was enamored of the idea of using them for instant recognition. Guy

I live in the northeast, and the Boston Globe runs stories like this every spring. Sometimes other seasons too. Some of those stories have unhappy endings. I also used to belong to the AMC (Applachian Mountain Club) and subscribed to their quarterly journal, Appalachia. Every issue would have some story about an incident, and then the journal editors would analyze the incident and make recommendations how things could have been done differently. I always found that a fairly interesting look at what happens in my near north. Today's Globe story made a couple of points - one was that this was an Eagle Scout and (according to his mother) had much experience at solo hiking. The story also quoted an official in the White Mountains that the young man had been prepared, with food and tools with which to build a fire. The part I find interesting is this story has a different setup than most other incidents we see up there. Often the ones that are lost are the ones that aren't prepared, don't have proper clothing and extra food, and aren't skilled at what to do if things go wrong. They routinely ignore warning signs about severe weather (such signs are at the base of every trail that leads up to Mt. Washington), and these stories are typically accompanied with some kind of severe weather incident or change. I can give a minor example from personal experience -- there is a trail that runs from the Pinkham Notch visitor center to the Hermit Lake shelter, which is close to the base of Tcukerman's Ravine on Mount Washington. Every spring, hundreds of people climb this trail to either ski or to watch others ski. I was at Pinkham Notch last Memorial Day weekend, with someone else from our Cub Scout pack. We decided to do a day hike up to the shelter. It started out warm and mild at the start, maybe mid-50s, and dropped in temperature as we climbed. About halfway up, we started getting slushy parts on the trail, to full snow (trampled of course) covering the trail. By the time we reached the shelter, along with dozens of other people, we were all wearing additional layers. The temperature was probably in the low 40s, and it was windy up there. But full sun, so it was rather pleasant. Just not t-shirt pleasant. At the shelter, there was a guy wearing (I think) a ski patrol jacket, stopping everyone going farther up (to the base of the ravine, to ski, or to watch). He stopped me, even though I was just walking 100 yds down the trail to refill water bottles. His purpose was to figure out everyone's intentions and to see if they are prepared to go farther up. I don't know if he had the power to stop anyone from continuing. So, we finished lunch at the shelter, refilled bottles and headed back down. On the way down, we're watching dozens more people heading up, some with tank tops and sneakers on, carrying nothing more than a water bottle (no food, no layers, etc). Guy

In my opinion, I think CA_Scouter has a good point. Especially if you go back to his original argument. Even given the latitude the district advancement committee has via the Advancement Committee policies document, in this particular case CA_Scouter mentioned that the Eagle application was rejected twice. Not a statement like "incomplete application" but "rejected." He said the DAC will not accept an application without letters. Council says a minimum of 3. Four were provided, from SM/parent, two personal friends (military officer; high-tech company executive) and his pastor. Application rejected a second time because of "wrong" letters: SM/parent letter counted as parent letter, and letter from troop leader is required; a letter from a teacher is required. Given all that, we're not even sure that with the council-added requirement of a minimum of 3 letters required, what 3 are required? We know that troop leader and school teacher letters are required (the basis of the second rejection). Which one is the third? The pastor? The parent? An independent source (which, outside of the pastor, seems to be the most useful of all, in terms of identifying living up to the principles of the Scout Oath and Law in everyday life). All in all, I can't say I'm surprised, though. I recently heard (at a district committee meeting), someone say "I'm glad I didn't have to do my own Eagle project in my son's troop -- you should see what they have to go through." Everyone always seems to have a rationale for it too, such as "well, we have really high standards for our Eagles" (as if what is already printed in black and white isn't a high-enough standard). Guy

I don't have any thoughts one way or the other, but I can relate a personal experience. My oldest son crossed over a year ago...first meeting, he had a SM conference where the SM encouraged him to read his handbook and get to work on Tenderfoot requirements. He also described the advancement process the troop uses (PL signs front section of book, SPL/ASM signs back half of book, etc). The SM called me over to make sure that we went over the personal safety booklet. My son then worked on a few 2C requirements at summer camp, and finished them shortly afterwards, for an October Court of Honor. Now it's 6 months later (a year total), and he's finishing up 1C requirements, mostly because a "high adventure" trip the troop is doing this summer is open to 1C and above. So he's kind of on the "first class in a year" plan, and the SM really hasn't driven it, other than at the first SM conference. A new batch of crossovers started two weeks ago, first meeting, the SM pulled them aside for their first conference. The cycle repeats... Guy

For me, BSEE '83, MS '85. But I don't particularly consider myself geeky. If you met me, I think you'd think more "doofy." Guy

It's definitely geekier that you even know they are pseudocode (and not real code). Then again, I'd be guilty as charged too. Guy

How about a "for instance" -- Say you have a new scout just coming into the troop, and he goes off to summer camp with the troop this summer. First day of camp, he's faced with a swim test. If he passes and is labeled "swimmer" hasn't he met parts of both 2nd Class and 1st Class swimming (other than the "other stuff", of course, such as safe swim defense, simple rescues, etc)? Through suggestions here in this forum, I've caught on to the idea that several rank requirements are "graduated". For example, first aid requirements begin with "how do you treat a minor cut?" as a Cub Scout, all the way up to First Aid Merit Badge being required for Eagle. Similar treatment for swimming skills, camping skills, cooking skills, map/compass/orienteering skills. It's pretty comprehensive, it seems. Anyway, so graduated requirements -- I can envision several scenarios where one scout becomes proficient with a certain depth that encompasses T-2-1. Of course, if he is signed off "early and often", then simultaneously completing requirements may not figure so much into it. Guy

About a year ago, I registered with a troop committee about the same time that I agreed to join the district committee as membership chair. There's been no training, and I've spent pretty much the last year trying to figure out things as I go along. It started with me asking as many questions I could think of -- to the Key3. They've been patient and helpful. As a troop membership chair, I did something that made sense to me, but seems to have surprised others: I wrote a membership plan. It started with a bunch of random thoughts about what could we do better (such as reconnecting with the community, the CO and the "feeder pack") and as I wrote them down, it made sense to fit them in an outline a certain way. The DE, all along, has been coaching me about the tactics of district membership. We talk about goals -- for the council, for "quality district" and for the DE himself -- at every district committee meeting. But nobody has every linked those goals and the tactics with a strategic plan. Turns out the council has a strategic plan. The council membership chair has a (sort of) strategic memo. But nothing at the district level. So that's my next step. I'm not sure, yet, what this strategic plan is going to say, but my goal is to have it done by fall. One thing I've found out in the last year is that the district committee was weak to non-existent for well over a year. Most units in the district seem to ignore the district committee. I started the year with having my email pretty much ignored by units, to having almost a 100% response (without nagging) on a recent email about Webelos transition issues. Mostly, I feel like that by the time I really learn how to do the job I'll be ready to move on to something else. (which is fine with me -- if my "legacy" is to leave the next district membership chair with my strategic plan, so that he or she can develop their own framework, then that's fine by me -- it's more than what I had to start with). I recently met with the DE and an assistant SE for the council, where we specifically talked about "what do you need from us." I asked if we could arrange a "workshop" for district membership chairs. Just to share ideas. I'd like to know what has worked and what hasn't worked. At the moment, there is nobody in the council facilitating that sort of information sharing. To me, it makes plain good sense. Guy

Neil -- there's a lot more detail in the "guidance" thread.

I still haven't figured out how a young scout can get to Eagle (via T-2-1 and Camping MB) without camping outdoors. Am I missing something? :-) Guy

Our council holds it in the spring, too, and it has worked out well (I've gone with both of my sons, last year and the year before). The only problem has been that the council has been unclear on Webelos 1 and 2, or Bear and Webelos 1. Since your council is being much more clear about it, I don't think you'll be as confused as I was. (one of my sons went as a Webelos 1, and ready to start on his second Webelos season; my younger son went just after he finished earning the Bear badge, but due to his age, he was compressing the Webelos badge and Arrow of Light into one season -- he recently crossed over to a Scout troop) My only recommendation is that now your son is starting on Webelos, be inclined to give him more space. Webelos is the start of a transition from a parent-child program (Cubs) to a boy-led program (Boy Scouts). Guy