GernBlansten

If Duty To God is such a cornerstone to the BSA programs, why do they abandon it for LFL? Please don't tell me its to bend to the will of the people. Say it ain't so!

Had the good senator plead NOT guilty, then I could see the argument for entrapment or misunderstood intentions. But since he plead GUILTY to a lesser charge, it means he agrees with the lesser charge and accepts his responsibility in committing it. He had a month to weigh his options. He may have been guilty of the original charge too, but his acceptance of the lesser charge is enough to stop debate. He did it, he said he did in his plea. There's nothing to debate. He made a career decision. He now needs to reap what he sowed.

Unless you plead guilty to it.

I don't think we need a test-out option to IOLS. It provides valuable training to the fenced in suburbanite and a good refresher for us outdoorsman. But it does not qualify you to take other peoples children into the wilderness.

Colorado has become the land of franchise restaurants. I guess the only thing native here in the high country is Elk Jerky. Pretty good and always plentiful around camp.

I agree ed. And a staff member who covers up molestation should get what?

What Brad Allen did was wrong, very wrong. In an organization that prides itself on honor and integrity, Brad Allen should not have a job. Keeping him tarnishes the whole.

Ed, I have higher standards for BSA than I do other organizations.

If BSA gave my unit a full time paid employee, I think it would be best to have that employee be administrative. We would task him/her with record keeping, scheduling, reservations, permit filing, advancement tracking, membership bookkeeping, communications, newsletter editing. I'd leave program, recruitment, outings, and all the fun stuff to us volunteers. Wow, how's that for wishful thinking!

Ed, Do you think an organized letter writing campaign to national by concerned volunteers is in order? Do you think that might get nationals attention that this type of shenanigans is unacceptable?

I believe it is a Council based requirement. Ours requires a letter by the scout declaring their religious duty. Its part of the Eagle packet application submitted to council and without it, its rejected. The letter from religious leader can be substituted by the scouts parents.

Last year I was on a Krakauer bend. Read all his books. Under The Banner of Heaven was the darkest. Into the Wild was probably the best. This year, I've only read one book so far, The Climb.

The image of boy scouts is that we do exciting, high risk activities with the boys. The reality is we don't train our leadership to that expectation. We train them on how to run meetings, do merit badges, fill out tour permits, organize camping trips, run a fundraiser. To think that once you get BSA "trained" you are qualified to do anything remotely adventurous is silly. Perhaps BSA should work on altering their image that they don't camp farther than they can see the cars, stay in cell phone range for EMS support, don't do things that can get them in trouble. Then the training required will dovetail with the image presented.

Back during the Carter Administration, when I was an active climber, when men climbed on rocks and not inside warehouses, we didn't count the # of rappels, or days out, but we did make a note of falls. A rope that took a long screamer or several short peals was usually relegated to top roping, rappelling and hauling. We would save the fresh ropes for lead climbing, use the questionable ropes for static loading. We inspected the ropes every time you uncoiled it. If there were any flaws in the mantle or hard spots(boogers) in the kern, that rope became retired. So we would have three classes of ropes. Lead, support and retired. We climbed every weekend and a lead rope was lucky to survive one season. Support ropes could last several seasons. The retired ones were usually cut up and tossed in the back of the garage to be used for lashings, kids swings, and general household uses. I'm still digging out some of these ropes for use with the scouts. Typically, we did multi-pitch climbs with 3 climbers and take two ropes. One for leading, one support rope between the middle and the follower. At the summit, we would tie the lead and follow rope together for the rappel if necessary. If we were just out top-roping, we'd grab one of the support ropes out of the bag. Was this risky? Perhaps, but we all survived. I think any properly inspected rope will meet safety standards for the type of climbing we are allowed to do in BSA. I've never heard of a rope failure of a properly inspected rope while rappelling or top-roping, save for an outside source like a razor sharp edge. The loads just aren't there. We can't lead climb per G2SS, we cannot put ourselves in a situation where the shock loading of the rope will be much more than our own body weight.

Neat stove OGE. With proper setup, I can see it fitting with LNT. It is also carbon neutral. At least from the definition of carbon neutral in the latest BackPacker mag.

Peaceful Valley is the Denver Area Council camp in central Colorado. Ben Delatour is the Longs Peaks Council Camp in northern Colorado. Both are about the same size (large) and have a very similar program. Pikes Peak Council has Camp Alexander and Pueblo Area has Spanish Peaks Camp. Those two camps are much smaller with smaller programs. All but PV are located in the mountains. PV is in the Black Forest southeast of Denver. DAC also runs a high adventure camp, Tahosa, for older scouts.

We mostly do two nighter weekend campouts. Meet at the church at 5PM with a sack dinner. Get to the camp by 7, sometimes setting up after dark (thats what headlamps are for). Scouts need to pack during the week before the campout so they can just get home from school, change into their uniform and grab their pack. Stop by Subway on the way to the meeting place. This weekend is the exception. Same drill for Friday night, but we don't have a campsite Saturday night, so after our climb, we will head home Saturday afternoon.

Let me first say that I love dogs. My dogs, my neighbor's dogs, even stranger's dogs. Even a few strange dogs. I've had dogs since I was a kid, and will probably be buried with a dog. We had the same situation this spring. Family campout with the troop, and one family brought their dog. It wasn't an issue for me until another family showed up with their dog and the two dogs didn't agree with the situation. It just added another dimension that ME as a scout leader of other peoples children don't need to deal with. We issued a directive that no family dogs on campouts anymore. We need to control as many variables as we can and that is one that doesn't need to be dealt with.

The scouts do not earn their rank at the COH, they earn it after the BOR. The COH is where the rank is recognized. Its just a ceremony.

To meetings, parlor shirt and switchbacks. No BSA socks. No scarf. No hat. COHs and OA events I might throw on my OA sash. I don't ornament my parlor shirt with patches. Really bugs me to see some adult Christmas trees. Campouts, I wear the parlor shirt while traveling but switch to a practical shirt at camp. Usually something like a polypro shirt with a stencil from Northern Tiers or Philmont but always BSA themed. Switchbacks stay on until they get too dirty for me which is pretty hard to achieve. Before the switchbacks, never would have worn BSA pants. Because I never owned a pair of the originals. Culture in my unit was nobody wore the BSA pants until the switchbacks came out. Now about 50% wear them.

What a wonderful fundraiser for our scouts. I hope this fellow isn't a fake. We are pooling all our scout accounts together to send to him. I've already picked out the tents and cooksets we are gonna buy with the proceeds.

Why was that person screaming at you? :-) Never been on a sailboat have you? The person in charge indicates the urgency of the task by the volume of his voice. Very effective.

Well OGE, my daddy always said, Arguing religion is like wrestling with a pig, at the end you are both filthy and exhausted and you get the distinct feeling that the pig enjoyed the experience.

From the logic of some here, I'd say everyday without religion in school is Athiests Day!

In thirty plus years of really depending on knots (offshore yacht racing and rock climbing) I've found the need for only a handful of knots. Bowline, sheetbend, figure eight and clove hitch. The rest are fun and pass the time on midnight watch, but you can really get most accomplished with the basics. Now who can do a one handed bowline in a driving rain on a heaving deck with someone screaming at you? At night. Still a favorite request from the scouts at campfires.