Fugitive

Lightning does strike twice! Your scenario is very, very similar to mine, an unbelievable mess. Our problem related to alot of people with bad behavior and a poorly written Advancement Committee Policies and Procedure manual. I just completed a 12 page critique of the ACP&P identifying the issues and suggested changes. National has it, now let's see if they care enough to make the necessary changes. Many people have contributed and 100's of hours spent. I hope the effort does not go to waste. If you want a copy of the paper private message me your email address and I will send it to you. Thanks, Fugitive

Wow! I'm not sure I wanted to know that. My questions are relavant to real life cenarios sorry to say. I wish I could share all of the details but this format not the right place. If we were'nt hiding our identities behind the web it would be easier to have an open discussion. In fact the Trolls would not have access to the discussion to stir things up by digging out dirt. I swep the dirt out of my tent after the last thread. I don't like the way that went. I am not a skilled blogger. I am willing to learn. Thanks Lisabob glad to see you back. I'm done with this thread. I appreciate the positive comments, time and contributions of those with constructive comments. Thanks, Fugitive

John, You are right on each of the policy issues you point out. However, you did not contribute anything that helps me answer the last question that I posted. Everything that the bloggers have pointed out has helped and as a result I have noted several small suggestions that I just ran by our District Advancment rep. She agreed, we are making progress. The positive aspects of you comments are good, I just wish you would use your positive side of you brain all of the time. Please help me with the last post. Ambiguity creats loopholes that will be exploited by attorney types and technocrats. What is a Troll? Thanks, Fugitive(This message has been edited by Fugitive)

OldGreyEagle, Wisdom came with the OldGrey part. Try this: WiseOldGreyEagle, maybe that is too long! You are right, at that point I was only addressing that side of the options. Blogging in short hand. By the way I have a 2008 version of the book. But I don't see what to do when a Scout turns 18, gets a 6 month extension to complete the requirements, turns everything in on the last day. Does he now need another National extension to receive a board of review? Or is the last day of the extension just like the last day that he is 17 and he now has 3 months to complete a EBOR. I have never seen a National extension letter, what do they say? Thanks, Fugitive(This message has been edited by Fugitive)

The Scout gets a no vote, gets a list of actions needed to meet the requirements over a period of time and comes before another board at the same level for another vote. I get it! Next a Scout turns 18, gets a 6 month extension turns everything in on the last day and has 3 months to complete a EBOR, or does he now need another extension from National, since the first 6 month extension has passed? I have never seen an extension, what do they say? What do you think? Thanks, Fugitive (This message has been edited by Fugitive)

John, As I stated I did what you all suggested and started from step 1, first calling our District Advancement Chair and our Brand new Commissioner. I personally met with the District Chair and am still waiting for my second attempt to reach the Commissioner to be returned, from my previous experience I will be waiting a long time. Our District member is working on an Eagle Policy for our Council and welcomes my help. I am preparing to make a presentation to a fair number of our Council and District Advancement Committee Members with the idea that they will work with me to advance improvements to National Committee. Once we accomplish that we can finalize the Council policy. In away we were all involved in what could be described as a "Stress Test" of the Eagle Board of Review process and can use what we learned to benefit us all. You can be part of the solution or part of the problem. Positive input is welcome. I still don't know what a Troll is, send me a PM so I know if I should be insulted or happy. I listened, I learned and I did what you said. I really would like to focus on Advancement Policy. Positive input will keep me moving in the right direction. Thanks, Fugitive

OK: John that helped and I think ScoutNut posted what you would be looking for tonight. I overlooked the section that ScoutNut posted, but this reinforces the point that when the ACP&P refers to extensions and other topics they do not consolidate everything in one spot or refer to the other locations necessary for a complete understanding. I am learning. Hey Guys, would you please let me know in a PM what a "Troll" is, I want to know if it fits. Please do not post in public I want to keep positive and on point the other does not help anyone. What I am is a Unit Committee Chair who wants to do things wright and as you can tell I'm on a steep learning curve. The positive comments that I have received are helping! In a week or two I might not sound this stupid. Thanks, Fugitive

OldGreyEagle you bring up something that makes me curious. The ACP&P describe extensions as if the purpose is for completing the board of review. However, it does not describe the purpose as to complete requirements. I have heard that extensions are hard to get. What do all of you think about the purpose of extensions? Since it's a National award can they do what they want? Thanks, Fugitive

Jet526 and OldGreyEagle, good job! This is bringing it together for me. So after 18 the ACP&P provides 2 avenues for the Eagle since he cannot participate as a Scout. 1) Extension. 2) Appeal. New question? If a Scout receives a 6 month extension from National and turns everything into the council on the last day. I would assume from what I read in the ACP&P that he would have 3 months to do a board of review and an additional 3 months with an extension from the council? Is this correct? Thanks, Fugitive (This message has been edited by Fugitive)

Yes I have. I followed some good advice from Lisabob and have made great progress with the Council by going back to step 1 and starting over. I still have questions relating to policy interpretation and getting advice from Scouters outside the Council is very helpful. It is amazing how different people look at things! Thanks, Fugitive

OK, If I understand the process when the Scout gets a no vote, gets a list of actions needed to meet the requirements over a period of time and comes before the original board for another vote. Got it! Try this, the scout turns 18 while waiting for the EBOR and gets a no vote, which is frequently the case, at 18 he can't participat as a scout and may not be able to complete the actions/requirements. What do we do? Is his only option an Appeal? Thanks, Fugitive Lisabob what do you think?(This message has been edited by Fugitive)

John, I'm on this site because I need some expert advice from Scouters willing to help others. I am not here to pick a fight with others. I started the thread, so I think that gives me the opportunity to pose the questions, I invite you to provide me with a better understanding of the questions I asked. As my understanding grows I will probably pose additional questions and might even end up in a different place than I started. This is the case in my last thread. If you have a problem with me or my questions please feel free to help others, that way it wont waste you time or mine. Thanks, Fugitive(This message has been edited by Fugitive)(This message has been edited by Fugitive)

The ACP&P states the following: "A discussion should be held with him as to how he may meet the requirements within a given period." Does this follow with a new Board of Review or Appeal Board of Review the book does not say? What do you do if the Scout is out of time (18) New application? Updated application? New Scoutmaster Conference? Requirements are materially different than character related issues. A requirement, i.e., time in position, merit badge etc. should this be referred to a new board of review at the same level at some future date. Character issues i.e., Oath, Law and Scout Spirit, should these be referred to the appeal process. Should the board of review members make this decision by majority vote prior to the scout returning to the room? How would this be dealt with as per the ACP&P? Thanks, Fugitive