FScouter

I think the SPL has enough to do without attending an adult meeting. The purpose of Scoutmaster attending the committee meeting is to report on the doings and needs of the troop. If the SPL is going to do that, maybe the SM can skip the meeting.

So, Ed, you tell us that Scouts cannot be required to help a fellow Scout with his Eagle project. Could you explain in different words what it is you are trying to communicate?

According to the official BSA Terms and Style Guide, "Advisor" is the top adult leader of a Venturing crew. "Advisor" is always capitalized. The term "adviser" is used when describing any counselor other than a Venturing Advisor. Example: "Order of the Arrow lodge adviser."

"We honestly are to the point of moving our charter..." Remember it is not your charter. The charter agreement is between the church and BSA. You're just the "hired help".

Our troop has a committee treasurer. She selects a chairman to handle the popcorn event. Whatever that chairman arranges is what the troop does. Sometimes we sit in front of a local business, sometimes we send a small group of boys to the monthly meetings of the Woman's Club, Knights of Columbus, etc. Always boys are encouraged to use whatever means they have to sell popcorn. Absent any plans developed through the unit committee, I'd say anything any parent arranged on an individual basis is fine. I wouldn't hold it against them that they happen to also have den leader or Cubmaster duties.

Our unit found that the more effort we put into building and maintaining a relationship with our CO, the better things were for everyone. There was a time when the CO membership resented "those Boy Scout people coming in and using our building, our electricity, and our stuff". They wanted to charge the troop rent like any other outside group. I'd suggest a few things: become a member of your CO, do a couple of service projects per year for them, help out at their events, activities, and fundraisers, appear before the CO board or committee periodically and give a breif report on the doings of the troop.

Lots of people don't like vests. Maybe just an official "BSA" pin one could attach to any kind of shirt. Of course wearing the pin would be "troop option".

Echoing Eamonn on the lickity-split idea. There are 101 things we adults could do to make troop operations simpler, faster, and more efficient. But efficiency in itself is not a Scouting objective, unless it means the boys have learned to operate efficiently. I remember as a young father when my son wanted to help pound nails in something I was building. He bent lots of nails, missed a lot, dinged up the wood, and was incredibly slow. The little guy was trying very hard with not a lot of success. I could have grabbed away the hammer and got the job done the right way in a tenth of the time. But what would he LEARN? Scouting is a time for boys to LEARN to do things ON THEIR OWN. Some famous guy said something like Never do anything a boy can do.

You didn't say what it is the committee chair wants to change. One of the responsibilities of the CC is to interpret BSA policies. If the SM and SPL are off on the wrong track, the CC should be helping them get back. I'd recommend both the SM and the committee read the Troop Committee Guidebook.

I'd transition it now. Acquiescing to committee control now won't make it easier to transition later. The rut just gets deeper.

"I do, however, think there should be some vetting process at the committee level to ensure that candidates that are interested are qualified..." No boy is qualified for the job. We're here to train them to be leaders, not screen them out. If a "bad" leader is elected, then that simply is more of a challenge for the Scoutmaster to train him. That is our job.

"... screen them through the committee". Does the committee really know the boys well enough to make this kind of selection?? Regardless, their job is to support the PLC and the Scoutmaster, not screen the boys to weed out the "bad" leaders.

Whether an item is necessary or not is in the eye of the beholder. In my mind, a long-sleeved shirt in cold weather is necessary. For others, a belt, socks, and pants are considered unnecessary. My objection is more to the comment that stretching the uniform budget is not easy. Any boy that wants to own a complete uniform with no compromises is welcome to come mow the grass.

"Sounds simple enough, but when money is an issue it isn't always that easy." Actually it is incredibly simple. Send the boy over to my house Saturdy morning and I'll hire him to mow my lawn. "A Scout earns his own way."

"In most of the world, appointing the SPL is 'real Scouting,' and 'solves actual problems.' " That's interesting about how Scouting is done in other parts of the world. In Boy Scouts of America, Scoutmasters help boys learn to make their own choices. We facilitate that by setting up troop elections and teaching boys how the process works in the real world.

The Commissioner Helps booklet #33618 gives a prospective commissioner a good idea of what the job is and how to do it.

How about wearing a long-sleeved uniform shirt. Hang up the short-sleeved shirt until summer.

Members of the chartered org is another source. Plus that helps strenthen the relationship.

Your attitude is showing.

If your unit commissioner is doing more than advising, to the detriment of your unit, have a conversation with the district commissioner and let him know your commissioner is interfering with the operation of the unit. If instead you have a committee member, the Cubmaster and committee chair need to demonstrate leadership themselves and set the expectations for the duties and responsibilities for the committee members. Refer to the Cub Scout Leader book for help.

A few tidbits from the national web site: http://www.scouting.org/nesa

A unit commissioner should be an impartial 3rd party whose job it is to advise, assist, and be a source of information. He should NOT be a leader of the units he serves. The son must be 21 years or older to serve as a committee member.

"2 deep leadership! ;-) " It was mentioned earlier in this thread that a den meeting was cancelled because the assistant was not available and no parent volunteered to stay. It is sad that the boys lose out because of a lack of leadership. Why not hold the meeting anyway using one leader? While I would agree that it is easier to hold a den meeting with an assistant, is it really so difficult to hold a meeting in a pinch without a parent or assistant to help??

"Every one of them did something to help. Easy things- sit in a chair for a meeting when my assistant had a family emergency." How is sitting in a chair helping?

The pack committee should be recruiting adult leaders. The CM has already got his hands full. EagleInKY has the best plan. Identify the individual you want for the position, then sell him on it. The Cub Scout Leader Book has a section on selecting and recruiting leaders. There is also a phamphlet "Selecting Cub Scout Leadership" #13-500 that is a how-guide. Also the Family Talent Survey Sheet #34362 helps you identify who has what skills, interests, and hobbies. Use it when you get a new boy application.