FScouter

Since the cloth square knot patch is a representation of the medal that was earned, it would seem strange if the medal itself would not available. Though, at least one award, the District Award of Merit, has no medal.

Phone manners can really be atrocious. "Who is this?", indeed! How about receiving a call from someone and being told "Wait a minute I have another call coming in." How rude! Call me back when you have time for me.

SaintCad has a good perspective on this. Teaching the wearer of the uniform can be done without being confrontational. There is no protocol, just be nice. We all have a responsibility to wear the uniform correctly. It's really not our uniform anyway; it's the BSA uniform. As members of BSA, we do have a responsibility to help ensure the uniform is worn correctly and if that involves teaching a member of another unit, so be it. There is a few lines somewhere in the literature to that effect, and if someone really wants to know where that is, I'd be happy to take the time to look it up.

The uniform inspection sheet for female adult leaders is correct. A temp patch may be worn above the right pocket. Interestingly, a male leader may wear only the Jamboree patch above the right pocket. Any registered adult may wear the uniform from day one, earned temp patches included. There is no 90 day restriction. Asking that person to point out in the book where that is written usually ends the discussion. Either you learn something you didn't know, or the other person learns another myth is debunked.

The patrol menu is decided amongst the members of the patrol. Encourage the boy to make his preferences known. Perhaps the rest of the patrol may agree to add something to the menu that he likes and he'll see that speaking up gets results and that he doesn't need his mommy to look out for him.

The medal can be obtained through the Scout Shop. They may even have it in stock, if not they can order it. The cost is about $7.

Take 5 people. It really is not becoming of Scouters to publicly express your anger at each other. The tolerance threshold is somewhat higher in the Issues and Politics forums, but were still Scouts and Scouters and we ought to think a little before poking a stick in the eye of a fellow forum member. Consider the discussion closed as of now. FScouter moderator team member

I'll have to read up again on the responsibilities of the assistant patrol leader, but filling in during the absence of the PL seems like that is part of the job. If the assistant is not qualified and another boy is better qualified, well, that the way Scouting works. Boys don't always make the best choices. But even if the PL selected the "wrong" assistant, I'd still question how adult intervention is going to support the patrol method. Maybe extra support from the SPL, SM and assistants would help this assistant PL shine during his 6 days of glory.

We could get in a big discussion about whether methods and procedures are requirements or not. Sometimes I think we spend too much time analyzing and reading between the lines of lots of publications to figure out what to do. We make this way too complicated. Rather than analyzing the question to death, try looking at this in the way a boy looks at it. He flips to page 187 of his handbook, Earning a Merit Badge. Paraphrasing, When you have decided on a merit badge you would like to earn, follow these steps: Obtain from your Scoutmaster a signed blue card and the name of a counselor. Set up and attend your first appointment. The counselor will explain the requirements and help you plan ways to fulfill them. Next, complete the requirements. Asking a boy to meet with you first is hardly adding to the requirements. Its written right in the boys Handbook. The Boy Scout Handbook must be the primary reference as to how Scouting works. All the other publications, committees, advancement chairs, councils, and national org support the Handbook. There is nothing in BSA that trumps what the boy is told in his Handbook. So, where on page 187 is the boy told that he may complete the merit badge requirements first, then approach a counselor for sign off?

I point out uniform anomalies when I see them. The usual response is thanks, or maybe a bit of embarrassment. No one ever got huffy and made rude comments about police and told me to mind my own business. Maybe such indignation is just a phenomenon of an internet forum. I suppose if someone wants to knowingly walk around with the barn door open, that's their prerogative.

If the requirement is tell, or explain, or discuss with your counselor, it is pretty much impossible to do that if the boy doesnt know what he is trying to tell, explain or discuss. Thats not adding to the requirements, rather it is doing the requirement.

As has been pointed out, a good chunk of Tenderfoot, 2nd Class, and 1st Class requirements must be done outdoors in a camping setting. These camping tasks are being done on every campout and there is no reason why they cannot be done by boys that have not yet earned the rank. One of the primary responsibilities of a patrol leader is to help the patrol members complete rank requirements. From Lisas description, the boys either have not been given the responsibility, or the adult leaders seem to be OK with the boys failing to deliver what theyre responsible for. If the older boys do the cooking 9 out of 10 times, they are not figuring it out, they are failing. How many campouts are the skilled outdoorsman adults willing to sit by and watch the older boys fail to figure it out? If a boy must wait until summer camp to learn first class skills, that reflects on the failure of the troop to provide opportunities in the troop and patrol setting. A adult Scouter with lots of outdoor skills isnt much good to the troop if the boys arent learning anything. And failure to advance is a good indicator that they arent learning anything.

As quoted by SR540beaver from the Guide to Safe Scouting: "Overnight camping by Tiger, Wolf, and Bear Cub Scout dens as dens is not approved and certificates of liability insurance will not be provided by the Boy Scouts of America." One could define a "den" as being composed of the boy members, the Den Leader, and the assistant Den Leader. That group clearly is not permitted to camp. Does adding dads in addition to the den make it "family camping"? Maybe. If mom, dad, brother, and sisters come too, as well as other pack members outside of the bear den, then clearly it would be family camping and not den camping. So I guess what you have to do is ask yourself Are we planning camping for the family, or is our Bear den going camping and we need a loophole?

Ed, with all due respect, you are wrong. Where, or with whom the camping must take place is NOT a requirement of the merit badge. If it was, the MB booklet would so state. A merit badge counselor has no authority or discretion to restrict camping nights to suit his personal agenda.

"Me sharing a tent with another female adult leaders is immoral and un-ethical. Why?" Then you're wife is OK with you sleeping with a female Scout leader, as is the husband of that female leader? Then maybe you're OK with your wife sleeping with another man? Demonstrating that kind of behavior to young Boy Scouts or Girl Scouts is not the kind of modeling I would tolerate for my kid.

A den of Bears is not permitted to camp as a den at any time in any council, any season.

"And since there is no specification, it's up to the counselor whether they will accept camping outside the Troop." The specification is crystal clear. It is up to the counselor to accept the camping nights as specifed in the merit badge booklet; not to impose a more restrictive counselor requirement.

Its safe to assume that the Scouts are going to find out about his addictions. Parents too. Ill bet some of them are going to wonder why the troop recruited an adult leader with a recent drug addiction problem. Drug addiction is not really a great example to set for Boy Scouts. This man (boy) made some horrible choices, bypassed the Scout Oath, and demonstrated some character unbecoming of a Scout. It hardly seems fit to put him up as an adult leader setting the example for young boys. The other adults obviously dont trust him, given they wont let Scouts in a car with him. Maybe after he has been clean and sober for 4 or 5 years and has re-earned his trustworthiness, but not now.

The moral values of the leaders of our youth absolutely is our business. The bigger issue I see, beyond whether they share a tent on a campout or not, is the fact that they demonstrate their lack of commitment to each other; that the commitment of marriage seems to be of no value to them. Two people co-habitating with no strings (shacking up) does not demonstrate the kind of good morals and values I want for my son. Performing sex with a person of the opposite sex is a very big action, with very big responsibilities. I do not want my son to think that behavior like that without solid commitment (marriage) is an acceptable behavior. Adults lacking in moral values are not the kind of adults I want setting examples for my son. BSA or GSUSA leaders ought to hold themselves to a higher standard than found in shack up relationships. Id seriously question whether these two have the moral standards that adult leaders setting the example for our youth ought to have. And I congratulate the man who had the moral guts to pull his daughter from the campout.

Lest anyone misunderstand, the purpose of the Safe Swim Defense training is NOT to create an aquatics superman that can perform water rescues under any conditions. The purpose is to teach an adult leader how to minimize risk so that water rescues will not be needed. The SSD-trained adult knows what is required to conduct a safe swim activity, accepts the responsibility to ensure the safety of the swimmers, and is prepared to handle an emergency should one arise. Safe Swim Defense is not rocket science. If the 8 points are followed, accidents will be minimized and kids will be safe. If the 8 points cannot be met, the SSD-trained adult is trained to understand that the swimming activity cannot be conducted safely and will stop it or not allow it to start. An 87 year old grandma can plan and supervise a swimming activity that follows the SSD plan. That doesnt mean she must be the one to carry out a 100 lifeline to a drowning boy. But she must ensure that there is someone there that can do it if necessary.

The Sam Houston council seems to have as decent a web site as any. But any info about national policies found on a local site is 2nd hand at best. And any info about local council policies may or may not have anything to do with any other council, which is the case here. Interesting that in the middle of the page about volunteer insurance is a discussion about filing a tour permit. That just perpetuates the myth that a tour permit is somehow necessary if insurance is to be in force. Also note that the link goes to an old version of the tour permit. Whether insurance is primary or secondary shouldnt matter much to the insured. Which policy pays is something to be worked out between parties that wrote the policies. The important aspect is that the volunteer is covered by one or both of them.

"... what else do Troop Leaders think are essentials for Cubs crossing over to Boy Scouts?" I think the best thing they can do as Cub Scouts is to be Cub Scouts. The time and place to learn Boy Scout skills is when they become Boy Scouts. As a Scoutmaster, I'm always happy to see Webelos cross over with the Arrow of Light award. Fulfilling those requirements is all the preparation they really need. And they really don't even need that. We happily sign up totally green boys with no Scouting background and no skills at all.

The BALOO training syllabus is designed for use by the course director and training staff. It is not really a manual for the Cub leader in charge of a pack overnighter. It is a manual for the staff to use in presenting a quality training event. The first 20 pages for example deal with the logistics of setting up the training event. Reading the syllabus is in no stretch a substitute for participating in the training. The syllabus includes 39 pages of handouts for participants, to be supplemented by additional handouts the training staff feels would be appropriate. If you didnt get the handouts, ask the course director to make you copies of appendices A through Z.

The objective is NOT to stop bad language. The objective is to instill in the boy values such that he will make his own free choice, without coercion or threat of penalty, to not use vulgar language. Teaching values is not easy. Its easy to smack a kid upside the head or charge a penalty with a cup, or force a performance of the little teapot song, but none of that will teach values.

Does the cup method really achieve the real objective? What does the boy do in a situation when there is no cup? What goes through the boys mind: I want to avoid paying a quarter, or I want to keep a clean mouth and not offend others?