FScouter

Well Miki101, it looks like the ball is in your court now to support the totals youve presented. Numbers right, wrong, or misinterpreted, Id have to say that any purported connection between Scouting and the sale of cow pies is really disgusting. Im really troubled that various Scouters feel the need to dispute a simple statement by our national organization.

Agreed. Boys that JOINED A TROOP is the number that must be used if one is looking to support or refute the percentage BSA has stated. Other numbers result in different percentages, which explains why we've heard everything from 2% to 40% with accusations that BSA is lying and untrustworthy. By the way Miki101, you could support the credibility of your numbers by quoting the source.

The annual report does not say how many boys joined. One cannot simply plug in some other number and report their calculation is wrong. Tenure, average, annual registration, full year, and less than a year doesn't enter into the very simple calculation (# of Eagles) / (# of boys that joined a troop") = 5%. Is there a statistician in the house?

Hey Ed Maybe you could explain why you have asked - twice - "What is a Sout? Are you trying to start something?

"5% is da number of Eagle Scouts awards earned this year divided by the total membership of Boy Scouting this year - " This thread is full of suppositions, "for instance" numbers, and personal opinions. Unless you can point to a reliable source, any opinion of how 5% is calculated is only an opinion. How meaningful or meaningless personal opinions may be is left to the judgment of the reader. Personally, I pay more mind to what BSA says that to personal opinions posted on the internet.

"Why does everyone always say that scouting is expensive?" Anytime the price of anything goes up a nickel, you will hear all kinds of bellyaching about how we can't afford it or its too much to pay or something else is cheaper, or somebody's wallet is being lined with my nickel. Scouting is no different. Witness the complaints already posted here. Remember awhile back when the annual fee went from $7 to $10? You'd have thought $3 was going to drive families into poverty so the evil professionals could drive Rolls Royces instead of Mercedes Benz. The squealing of stuck pigs was deafening. Scouting is heavily subsidized by corporate donations, and rich philanthopist donations. Sorry, but those rich guys that love Scouting are dying off, and the new "me" generation isn't so generous. I've often thought the annual $10 registration fee is just a formality. It ought to go to at least $50. Still a bargin.

There's no need to speculate on how BSA calculates the percentage. They tell us on their web site that "Not every boy who joins a Boy Scout troop earns the Eagle Scout rank; only about 5 percent of all Boy Scouts do so." Thus, the denominator they use is boys-that-join-a-troop. That is the pool. It's not how many joined this year, or the current enrollment, or any other number. It doesn't matter how many are in whatever rank, or how long it takes the average boy to earn Eagle. Take any 100 boys that join a troop. By the time they quit or age out, 5 will have earned the Eagle rank. Its really very simple.

If fewer boys join, I'd expect fewer Eagles in future years, but still a similar percentage. I can't remember the purpose in debating the validity of the published percentage? What are we trying to show?

There are no forbidden topics at an Eagle board of review. Ask whatever you want and judge the candidate from his responses or lack thereof.

Since no one has authoritatively stated the number of Boy Scouts leaving the program (or entering), any conclusion that BSA is untrustworthy or lying about the 5% figure is unfounded.

Brent, I think you're methodology is far, far more complicated than it needs to be. Consider the quote Oak posted from the BSA web site: "Not every boy who joins a Boy Scout troop earns the Eagle Scout rank; only about 5 percent of all Boy Scouts do so." Only two numbers are needed to compute the percentage - the number of boys who join, and the number that earn the Eagle rank. Think simple. Of all the boys that join a troop, how many earn the Eagle rank during their Scouting career? That's the 5% percentage BSA is quoting. The other 95% either quit or aged out without earning Eagle.

What were trying to measure with the Eagle percentage is the percent of boys that attained the Eagle rank during their tenure as Boy Scouts. Out of a group of Scouts, what percentage earn the Eagle rank? Look at all the boys that left Scouting. It doesnt matter whether they aged out or quit early. Now look at the rank they attained when they left. How many earned Eagle? The calculation is very simple; the number of Eagles that left Scouting divided by the total number of boys that left.

Maybe the kid ought to be crucified. Ed, you can drive the first spike.

I'd say the best preparation is to cover all the topics found in the Wolf, Bear, and Webelos handbooks. There is plenty of time to learn the Boy Scout topics when they become Boy Scouts. In fact, joining the Boy Scouts doesn't need any preparation at all. The Boy Scout program is fully self-contained; no prerequisites at all.

Im happy with the user interface. It seems intuitive enough. I visit several other boards including scoutingforums, discussit, meritbadge.com, and a yahoogroups forum. One of them has gone icon crazy which I find to be very annoying. I find the layout and ease of use with this board to be far better than any of the others. The big, big, big downside is the response time. Several of the software features have been turned off, apparently to avoid bogging down the system further.

"From my experience, you only see Unit Commissioners once or twice a year." With that kind of sarcasm, maybe he's afraid to visit your unit more often. Maybe your free food isn't very good?

The requirement is Be active in your troop and patrol for at least six months as a Life Scout. Focus more on how the boy is active in his troop and patrol and less on his personal life and how he completes merit badges. A boy is not exempt from being active because he has family commitments. An Eagle project is an endeavor the boy decides he will pursue, or not. Id encourage them both to pursue the Eagle rank. The project is not something anyone decides to allow or not allow based on any performance or lack thereof. The only requirement is that the boy must be a Life Scout.

How about the uniform-hater that takes every opportunity to poke at those who wear and respect the uniform and uniform method, and goes so far as to start a thread seemingly for the sole purpose of soliciting disparaging remarks.

Ed's question here seems to be "does a conviction trump all other considerations gathered from a boy's Scouting history and insight gathered from a board of review." I think its ridiculous to base a decision solely on one piece of evidence, ignoring all else. I like the idea of "doing the process", then makinga decision.

There is a useful feature that can be used to start a new topic based on the direction an existing topic is headed. Click on the spin-off new topic link at the bottom right-hand corner of any post. A member can use this to further a discussion that is so far removed from the Advancement Resources forum that those interested in advancement will be scratching their heads.

"...now is the wrong time for this boy to be an Eagle." That may be, or not. How would anyone know if no board of review was held? Surely one would not decide based on hearing no evidence?

My dad was a conscientious objector during WW2. Instead of the Army, he served with the U.S. Coast & Geodetic Survey, for double the Army enlistment time and for less pay too. Can I put a silver star on our troop flag? Maybe a bigger star too, since he served longer.

Seeing as how the board of review determines whether or not the Eagle rank is awarded, I fail to see the purpose in refusing to hold the review?? What was the purpose of having the boy appear as scheduled only to tell him to go home? Why didn't they just phone him and say "no BOR for you kid, tough luck"? If this kind of "review" is OK, maybe we could disense with the BOR for the good kid that everybody knows is Eagle material. Just greet him at the door and say "we don't need to bother with a BOR for you, we decided you're an Eagle, congratulations. Now go home."

There is no provision in BSA for stars on a unit flag other than the gold star for a serviceman/woman killed in service. While honoring military people is not a bad thing, blue stars is not a Scout thing. The troop flag is not a military flag.

I agree with the others in that a board of review should not be denied. Hold the BOR as normal, then either award the rank or deny. To say "NO" without even holding a review is wrong and has no basis for support.