FScouter

Maybe its time for me to get a new book. My copy of the eleventh edition (first printing) includes the word "most". The point is though that it does NOT say the Scout badge is automatically conferred by virtue of earning AOL. If that were the case it might as well be presented by the den leader. I think it is important for the Scoutmaster to go down the checklist with the boy and do a brief Scoutmaster conference, AFTER he joins the troop. This gets the boy acquainted with how the rank requirements are set up in the Handbook. The joining section starts with the requirements list, immediately followed with the pages that explain exactly how to fulfill each requirement. The joining requirements on page 4 are very basic and easy. When I go over this with a boy, he sees how easy it is to complete requirements and earn a badge. We then flip over to page 32 and look over the list of Tenderfoot requirements, and he is off and running.

Look up "merit badges" and "excess insignia" in the index.

"When I took the course I was told that there would soon be a box to check on the Tour permit asking what person on the Pack Camping trip was Baloo trained ... Fast forward three years and there's NO box to check." It's on the current revision "D" of the tour permit. http://www.scouting.org/forms/34426.pdf Previous revisions are obsolete.

"Uniform" is one of the eight methods of Boy Scouting. "Outdoor" is another one of the eight methods. I think its hardly fair to describe uniform as "nit-picking the rule book". Both methods are "for the boys".

Oak Tree - "... nevertheless, the Arrow of Light does automatically confer the Scout badge, at least according to my son's Boy Scout Handbook." That is not correct. The Handbook does NOT say AOL automatically confers the Scout badge. It does say MOST of the requirements have been met, and it says the Scoutmaster must approve. Boys that have earned the AOL should no problem earning the Scout badge since they have already learned the requirements. It takes about about two minutes to go down the list (on page 4 of the Handbook) and check them off. But if a boy can't recite the Pledge of Allegiance or tie a square knot, I refer him to pages 5-11 and tell him we'll go over it at the next meeting.

My opinion is, if all or a majority wear the same identical clothing, ... it constitutes an activity uniform, and Scouts should salute." "Identical clothing" does not a uniform make. The uniform is defined in the Boy Scout Handbook and the Insignia Guide.

"This 'policy' was instituted to end the utter chaos the Unit was in. The ASM,Troop Committee Chair and 2 Troop Committee members wanted to work on MB's exclusively." That does sound like chaos all right. But if your problem was using meeting time to work on merit badges instead of skills instruction, the solution is not to prevent boys from earning merit badges. The solution is to follow the BSA program and remove merit badges from meetings. Boys will advance if meetings are planned utilizing skills instruction. The Scoutmaster Handbook has a good discussion on meeting plans. Boys that want to work on merit badges can do so outside of meetings. A troop policy of saying "NO" to a boy is counter productive. The best troop policy is to follow the BSA program, because it works best.

What is a "skill award"? Is that something from the old days?

Why do you suppose BSA has not written into the Handbook "You may NOT work on merit badges until you have earned the rank of ____"?

"Our Troop, where I am ASM does not allow Scouts under the Rank of Second Class to earn Eagle Required MB's except for Swimming." Does that mean a Tenderfoot is not permitted to work on Citizenship in the Community? Why has your troop made such a rule?

No one posting in this thread has advocated rushing boys to Eagle by 13 or 14. The question posed at the top of the thread was whether it is appropriate for a Scoutmaster to restrict advancement so that Eagle cannot be obtained until age 16. "In my [limited 15 years] experience most 13-14 year old eagles fall into two catagories. Paper eagles and eagles from eagle mills." The Scoutmaster would would be largely responsible for that outcome. Imposing artificial advancement restrictions on all boys in the troop will not fix an Eagle mill or paper Eagles. "They are then finished with the program ... So where do they go? They are done and you will probably lost them." That may be true if you believe that the only reason boys stay in a troop is for advancement. Why do some boys remain at one rank for years, participating in activities but not advancing? There must be something about Scouting they like, but it isn't advancement. If an Eagle scout quits before aging out, the SM and the unit have not done enough to keep the program challenging enough to retain him. I don't believe advancement restrictions are going to keep boys in a dull program.

A committee member would meet the requirment also. Or a registered member from another troop.

Echoing what acco40 said, the brown Scout badge (not a rank) is not earned as a Cub. The boy must earn it after he joins the troop. "I did those requirements for my AOL" doesn't work. But if he learned them for his AOL, it shouldn't take him more than 2 minutes to earn the Scout badge.

A good time to start is any time he wants to, after he joins the troop. A good one to start with is any one that interests him.

The registered adult, or non-registered parent rule is written in the Guide to Safe Scouting. I misspoke when I said "any other adult".

The male leader uniform inspection sheet does not say "tuck in your shirt" either. None of them make that direction, though the illustrations all show the shirt tucked in. Maybe that is assumed, kinda like wearing the cap with the bill forward. In our troop, we adult leaders model the uniform in the manner we want the boys to wear it, with the shirt tucked in. Even the fat assistant SM tucks it in. But if the catalog shows the blouse untucked, I wouldn't argue.

Tucked in. See the inspection sheet: http://www.scouting.org/forms/34281.pdf

"1st class in 12 months. Do not push this upon a 11 year old!" I'd agree the 1st Class goal should not be forced on a boy. Still, the SM ought to ensure that the opportunities are available such that the goal can be achieved. And certainly should not intentionally restrict advancement.

Your reading of the part of the Guide to Safe Scouting that talks about leadership requirements for trips and outings is correct. There is no prohibition about married couples. Not sure how anyone could read otherwise.

meamemg - you're right. One adult must be registered. The other can be registered, OR an unregistered parent of a participating Scout. One of them must be 21 or older. A random adult does not meet the requirement.

Did you ever see a UPS delivery man wearing the official brown UPS shirt, with blue jeans?

Regarding 2-deep leadership and cell phones: consider a normal campout at one site. Would it be appropriate to hold a campout with one leader on site communicating by cell phone with another leader back home? This is no different. If you were to consider this a patrol outing, then no adult at all would be permitted. If it helps, the 4th adult need not be a registered adult. It could be any mom or dad or any other adult.

"Or shpuld the bar be raised so that while every scout has the chance to clear it those that do are of a higher caliber of scouts?" I don't believe any adult should be moving the bar, either up or down. The bar has been set and its position is defined in the Scout Handbook and other publications. There are lots of ways adult leaders can help boys be of a high caliber that don't involve adding additional requirements. Restricting advancement does not create high caliber.

"But American values are the same nationwide. Discrimination against homosexuals and atheists aren't among them. " Too bad. Scouting embodies all the "American values" except the value of homosexuality and the value of atheism. I guess America can't have everything in one package. Oh well.

Tell him your interested in the advancement part of Scouting and could he please direct you to some BSA publications that talk about how fast a boy should advance, and at what age and maturity level the Eagle rank is appropriate. Of course there is nothing that supports his idea, and everything to support the at-your-own-pace plan. Then you can point out what you learned. What can he say?