fred8033

So, depending on the last few years growth rate, budgeting $2.5m from the endowment "might" be a good plan. Might not too. All about sustainability and growth to keep it existing long term.

Different people are look for different things in a troop. I like the idea that the scoutmaster is comfortable staying at camp as the scouts go thru rotations. The idea is the scouts have their experience. They should NOT be followed around by adults. That's cub scouts. ... But, that's my opinion. Also, if they don't earn the advancement or win the camporee, that's fine. That was THEIR choice. Flip side is bad behavior in scouts is hard to change. Cussing. Swearing. Bad attitude. Bad behavior. ... Sometimes that only changes over time. Sometimes it only changes with a new set of scouts. AND, avoiding the older scouts teaching too many bad habits. Perhaps the example you had with first aid. Dragging the scout by the leg for first aid. IMHO, that reflects a scout that does not want to be there. That happens. Often, it's the committed volunteers who's kid does not want to be there. There is a magical mix in scouting. When it works, it's great. When it doesn't, it is frustrating. One point ... don't drag out decisions or try to force change. If you don't like how the SM is doing it, are you ready to find another SM? Or another unit? Our kids are only young for a short time. The time in scouts is even shorter.

SOAR was great. I would have loved to have SOAR and ScoutBook married. SOAR for unit coordination. ScoutBook for advancement.

I used quicken. Next guy used excel. Next guy used .... We let the volunteer decide as long as he kept the numbers.

Easy to get close when you pull $2.5m from an endowment. Another way to read ... The council plans to be short $2.5m this year. Perhaps the question is ... how much do you plan the endowment to grow this year? How much did it grow last year? Year before?

Recognize that the decision is not Troopmaster or Troopwebhost. The decision is what in addition to scoutbook. You will be using scoutbook in some form. It is BSA's official tool. We stopped using Troopmaster after decades of use and we did not miss it. Sometimes, troopmaster promotes tracking data that is really the scout's to track and own. After scoutbook started and SOAR began to back off, we just used a monitored Facebook group and a Google calendar in addition to ScoutBook.

It was a one-stop source for unit setup. <name>@<city><unit number>.mytroop.us. Really nice. It did not do advancement, but that was not the focus. It was communication and representation. Great tool.

I loved SOAR. Great web site. Great newsletter. Great calendar. I really miss it. Great roster. Pictures, etc.

We each have our complaints. I've seen some 15 year old camp staff do a more meaningful job then some of the long-time, experienced scouters.

Perhaps the real answer is like much in scouting; the whole merit badge program needs rethinking. So much of the MB program is subverted by troops doing the MBs within the troop and having any warm body register as a MBC. Perhaps the real answer is the scout should find resources that are experts, but then the MBC is a district advancement person who could confirm the scout did their work. It's not really a "go find a counselor". Instead, it's a scout shows up at roundtable and presents that he completed the MB content ... or presents at summer camp MB office .. or ... Then, we could stop talking about units gaming the system to avoid fees by registering adults as MBCs ... which I've done too.

This started years ago. Our pack started registering fewer leaders because of cost. It just got too expensive to use scout raised funds to register each and every adult that helped in any manor. As such, we registered the direct contact leaders and the rest were often minimal. So, the original post ... "leader" ... what is meant by a leader? An adult talking with the scouts is not automatically a leader. Teaching MB content is not necessarily being a MBC (registered role). If the person is signing off on merit badges, he must be registered. I'd ask ... Is this an on-going role? is the adult building connections with the scouts? If the adult is interacting with the scouts on an on-going basis, they must be registered. It's not just about BSA requirements. It's about protecting the scouts.

I'd take odds in Vegas against that, but then again ... What does "wrap up" mean ? All legal challenges closed ? First checks sent out ? Checks outside the $3500 quick settlement sent ? Complete wrap-up feels like it is years and years out. I'm thinking 10 years plus before the trust is fully distributed. Maybe next year for some checks.

This is a common pattern in scouting. The next volunteer does not step up until the current person leaves. It happens all the time at all levels in scouting. Set your date. Communicate it. Move on. At some point, the current parents need to step up and fill the void.

One other reply ... And yes, many comments here are useful. I love standing upright in my tent. I love space to organize. I like cabin tents. I don't mind a heavy tent as most of our camping is easy car camping. I have other tents for river or hiking or when weight is an issue. COST - Scouts break stuff and may break your stuff too. Weird stuff happens. Someone runs and trips and falls into your tent. Someone sprays something and damages, etc. Campfire embers blow in the wind and melt a hole. Something gets set on your tent bag and it gets damaged. ... My rule of thumb is to NOT bring anything precious to me on scout campouts. ... The REI Wonderland X is $1000+ dollars. The Wonderland 4 is $500. The wonderland 6 is $600. ... For me, that is far more than I'd want to bring on a scout camp out.

Have your scouts already started the MB? They can use the existing requirements. Not the new ones. 20 miles, yeah that's a long hike even on a flat level paved trail. On a natural path with gravel, dirt, mud, ups and downs, that's 10 plus hours.

Nice. Pricey, but nice. ... I don't have one, but looks nice.

@5thGenTexan ... Use the explicit words in the requirements. Unless it says "not used elsewhere" or "separate from" or "since earning" ..., then it's allowed.

We had a table with sign-up sheets. A committee member would manage the sheets, permission forms and payments. Often the patrol leader would help.

From what I've seen lately, camporee non-denominational services have devolved into extremely wishy washy and borderline offensive to those with a faith. Our unit ended up making the scouts aware and encouraging those who's family practiced that faith. BUT, it was always the scout's choice if they went or not. Half went. Half stayed in camp. "can be uncomfortable at times" ... Reminds me of high school pep rallies for the sports teams. I was not on a sports team and not really a sports fan. Sitting thru those events were painful, annoying and offensive.

That is absolutely wrong. Specific plans. Itemized material counts. Board sizes. Number of screws. etc, etc. That's just wrong. There is a balance. Perhaps a foot bridge needs a rough drawing to demonstrate understanding of what needs to be done and install enough confidence in the reviewers that the bridge will be good and safe. Detailed drawings and precise estimates of wood, screws is absolutely NOT required. In fact, I believe it is expressly stated that we can't expect that out of the scout in the proposal. IMHO, this indicates volunteers that need to move on.

Thank you and your other volunteers. I greatly appreciate it. I remember 2010 when I was livid and loud at a district meeting because the district advancement team had bounced our scout's project proposal a 4th time because it did not have a map and directions to the local hospital. 4th review and then asking for a map to the hospital. The project was to rebuild an ushers closet at the church (tear it down to the walls, clean, paint, new shelving, organize, etc). Then, they lost the workbook. The real issue is the reviewers didn't think the project was big enough. They wanted to get more effort out of the scout. So, they put that effort in the proposal review. Procedures and policies exist because of problems in the past. The Eagle project process was very inconsistent across units, districts and councils. The GTA and ESP workbook are HUGE IMPROVEMENTS. They will never be perfect because people are different with different opinions and goals. I absolutely love the direction GTA and the workbook went. Would I like changes? Sure. But it's drastically better. Another huge improvement was the bi-monthly publishing of the advancement news. Great guidance.

I'd ditch all the merit badge workbooks. I have contempt for them. The Eagle project workbook though is different. The proposal is very much a contract between all the parties. The rest helps create evidence. The reason I like the workbook is because of what was going on before 2011 when the workbook was created. Councils / districts were requiring large proposal submittals that were effectively large three ring binders of detailed project plans. Way, way, way beyond what was needed. KEY POINT - The Eagle project workbook exists not to force the scout down a path. The Eagle project workbook exists to protect the scout from the scouting adult volunteers (unit, district, council).

Wow. I guess I should have expected some councils don't require a thick packet submitted. Our council collects all paperwork expected for the EBOR. That includes all sections of the project workbook, references, statements of ambition and purpose, etc.

Normal. Beneficiary usually never sees the "plan". If the beneficiary wants to see more, that should be in the proposal. Now, the proposal might result in "we want to be involved in ... " That's the scout's right, but it's also the EBOR's right to then grill the scout to get the planning details. I've told scouts to fill out the plan to create evidence of planning. That's part of the rank requirement: develop, plan and lead. Without it in the workbook, the EBOR at first-glance sees no planning. That will be motivation to dig in to confirm the scout's planning. That's the EBOR's job. Really good ideas get cemented as rules until someone pushes back. The Council Advancement Committees are almost all volunteers. That volunteer enthusiasm can result in drift from the published written rules. EBOR has the right to confirm requirements were met; including evidence of planning. The EBOR can't require it in the workbook, but the EBOR has the right to question the scout on the planning. I'd tell the scout to choose. Does the scout want to fill out the planning section to reduce red flags for the EBOR? Will the scout be ready to defend the planning in the EBOR? It's not really an either-or. It's about how to give the scout the best Eagle rank experience. IMHO, let the scout pick the battle. It's a real choice. The scout has to live with the choice.

I think that is the right answer. We are all so personally invested in scouting that we forget we are only volunteers. If the situation sours, move on. We only get one life. Enjoy it.