fred8033

SURPRISE: I've seen this occur before. Scoutmasters have lots to coordinate and are often not sure how to announce who's going to be on the ballot. Instead, the ballot can be a surprise to the scouts and they are surprised by who's on it. I've also seen scouts surprised by not being on it and the reasoning was the person who made the ballots didn't think they had enough qualifying nights. There was no chance for scouts to correct that. All the issues appear at the moment of the ballot. QUALIFYING: A good troop should have enough program to allow scouts to qualify for OA at the end of one year. A good troop will camp two nights a month and at least one week in the summer. Even if they take two months off, that's 25 to 31 nights of camping. I remember one year one of my sons had 34 nights of camping with the troop as we had two extended campouts that summer. FIRST YEAR: I assume the original poster meant scouts that were just finishing their first year or had just finished their first year.

No "gift". Accomplishments reflected on plaque or arrow.

We never charged for attending. B&G cost was covered by earlier in the year dues and fundraisers. B&G would be geared up or down depending on pack finances. I've seen the blue and gold cost the pack $1500 to $2000 for a really cool event. I've also seen it cost the pack $100 to $200 for a pot luck.

Divide what you are trying to do into categories to see if you have coverage. You could even look at the features of the above tools to create categories. Here are some common categories Communication ... Email, Texting, Calendar management ... Printable, subscribe-able, etc Document storage .. Forms, Pictures, Other Social media Advancement ... purchase orders, awards, rank Membership Finances ... Budget, dues, accounting This is what we use Scoutbook ... Default for all units ... Advancement, roster ... it's the official BSA data. Anything else is double work. Facebook ... Default for all units ... social media SOAR ... communication, email, document management Google documents / spreadsheets ... finances

My view is .... Personal growth ---> Introducing new experiences. Stretching comfort zones. Opening eyes to broader, more challenging experiences. Made up example --> Last year, we canoed for an afternoon on mild calm river water. This year we are taking a two day overnight river trip. Next year, we are spending a week canoeing the Lewis and Clark path. Our goal is two years from now to do a white water Colorado river experience. Leadership Development --> We structure the program for the scouts to experiment with leadership and for the adult scouters to back off into the shadows. I absolutely view those as equal to the other six. I guess comes from one's perspective.

Every year I repeatedly see GSUSA uniformed youth selling cookies at BSA activities and events. It has always seemed like one directional relationship.

Much harder for all scouts period. I'm always surprised by the major difference of difficulty of the eagle merit badges. Some are significant work. Some are almost automatic.

My gut feelings... Swimming over Hiking Swimming MB is 9 times easier than hiking. Absolutely true ... I'm surprised cycling isn't more popular than hiking. Cycling MB is fun and can be a great troop program. ... But there are many back-packing troops. Env Sci MB over Sustainability Env Sci MB is not exciting, but a "sustainability" MB sounds duller than dull. I can't believe a scout would ever choose it. Troops have a history of pushing Env Science MB. Sustainability MB is newer. Emergency prep over Lifesaving I'm always surprised Lifesaving is not chosen more. If you have Swimming MB, Lifesaving MB is just a little bit more ... aka easiest path And Lifesaving MB is useful ... aka something to boast about And Lifesaving MB is in the water ... aka fun. And Emergency Prep MB can be very dull ... aka painful And Emergency Prep MB has parts that are just out of date / old / not useful.

I agree. But open the communication channel and find a way to manage the scouts and their commitment. IMHO, the original poster's situation is like popcorn in reverse. Buying popcorn is really a donation with popcorn as a thank you. In this case, the church is is donating $1000 to the unit, but they want 250 hours of free labor in exchange. At that point, you can't call it a donation or gift.

Events need to stay fresh. A fun once a year event done monthly can quickly become a drag with burnt out volunteers and burnt out scouts. Then mix in when the monthly burger night overlaps with summer camp or school break or a district camporee or ... IMHO, it's hard enough to run a healthy troop. I fear someone may have seen the scouts as free labor and thought "hey we give them $1000 per year". They don't realize it costs about $10,000 to $35,000 per year to run a strong healthy size troop and the troop has it's own program to run also. Plus, if $1000 per year breaks down to $85 per month --> then factor in two adults plus a strong mix of scouts so that it's scout led. How many hours? Assuming a three hour commitment (setup, cook, cleanup) for 7 people (two adults plus five scouts), then you are at 21 hours of labor with a $4 per hour return. ... not to mention shopping, etc... It quickly turns the good will donation of $1000 into a less than minimum wage job. I'd argue the scout unit should do it once a year to say thank you to the charter org. It's a good-will connection. Monthly though is a job that pays bad and will quickly wear out your scouts.

This issue is less about the scout and his leaders and more about our country and the strong political divide. Then, add in the online news in-your-face approach. I like the comment earlier about not making a battle of this. IMHO, things like this should be treated just like many other situations in scouting. It's an opportunity to interact with the scout. An opportunity to create a reflection and a lesson. A good scout leader should be able to turn this into a friendly, positive, constructive conversation.

I fully agree. If she gets to automatically count her unregistered time as official time, then we need to go back and retroactively see who else to credit? All venturers? All siblings that showed up at cub scout and boy scout events? IMHO, at earliest, she can earn eagle in 14 to 17 months. But she needs to do the positions and complete the requirements while registered as a scout in a troop. Anything else is just wrong. On a personal note, I did not mind her wearing the scout uniform if she is now registered as a scout. That's fine. Wearing it at a very political event is questionable, but let's leave that as celebrating a huge achievement and a big change. Fine. BUT at best, she should be wearing the scout rank patch. Wearing the life patch was wrong. Period. It's a proud thing to advocate for change. It's right to celebrate when you succeed. A similar case is that I'd also be greatly disappointed in a scout wearing an Eagle rank patch before his EBOR. I fear her troop has misled her. She should not be wearing the patch or have been pretending to go through advancement in her troop. Now, the troop could pencil whip her through rank and just let time pass. But, I'd hope she honestly does the work, earns the rank just like all the new scouts that are newly joining. Give her Silver Beaver. IMHO, she's earned it. Even as a kid I think you could justify her earning it. But not eagle until she completes the requirements as written while being a scout

You are right and I understand your reasoning. It's just sad troops can't have an inventory from which they can recognize quickly.

This is my preferred method. Give them the cloth patch immediately after BOR. Give them the paper card and parent pin at the COH. I'd extend this to merit badges too. A troop that I was involved in had a large cache of MB cloth patches too. IMHO, it's sad that a registered scoutmaster or advancement chair can't build up a stockpile of cloth awards without circumventing BSA purchasing methods. Maybe, BSA should have a rule that a troop can buy some amount in advance. For example, each year able to buy a quantity (25% of their troop population) in any merit badge before receiving the advancement report. It would require tracking a running quantity of MBs, but that's very possible these days.

A registered MB counselor needs to sign them off. The goal is to have the scout pursue and drive his own advancement. I fully believe this is how it is to be done. With that said, sometimes MB counselors will coordinate with the troop and say something like ... If the scout shows you this, sign it off. I've had that before where the MBC works with the scout and the scout has one or two things left. Then, the MBC lets me know that if the scout shows XXX, then sign off the badge. Overall, we're trying to broaden the scout's experiences and we want the scout to have a good experience. As such, sometimes flexibility is taken. But the idea is a registered MBC is the signer of the badge.

I like your approach. So often we create rules that ... if we enforce, we upset the people and they quit ... or if we don't enforce we're not fair to others. I like your current approach because it reflects natural consequences. For example, size. Here is the size we can do. If it's beyond that, it won't fit on the track.

Dead on right. Give them space. Listen to what they really want to do. Then, let them do it. It might mean they want a patrol based ski weekend. Fine. It might mean they want a trip out west. Great. Often, they want to do something that sounds cool to their friends and that they can brag about. I'm not one for fixed or mixed age patrols. IMHO, the key thing is that a patrol is a group of friends that want to do things together. Our success with older scouts is to keep them active doing things they really want to do. And it usually means adventures and fellowship.

Your write-up is more succinct, but I doubt it would be received well. I fear it would further burn bridges.

You never have to lie or mis-represent, but neither do you need to explain things in detail. The best separations are short and gracious. AND, even more so if you are upset with each other. If you feel the need to share, do it face-to-face. Use it as a chance to heal and to re-build a connection with the other person. But if your intention is to not heal and re-connect, then just don't do it.

You are absolutely correct. That is a concern with many of the COs that we currently have. They are not involved though BSA pretends they have strong control and oversight. My comment is for this specific situation. The original poster has a hard situation. Though the original poster should be slightly concerned about the CO situation, it's really not really a direct cause. It's a complexity and a resource he won't have to leverage. But the original poster's CO situation is fairly common and I'd bet many units in his district / council are in a similar situation.

The CO issue is not really surprising or at fault. And, it's far from unique. Most COs operate at arms length. Some COs equate to nothing more than the parents in the troop. It's rare to have an active, involved CO. I say this as I don't think there is anything unique for scout parents to notice or for the district/council to be concerned about. Is it ideal? Absolutely not. Is it unusual or immediately concerning? No.

I'm not at all against ScoutBook. I used BSA online advancement for years, and ScoutBook is a good replacement. I'm glad adult leaders can use ScoutBook to directly enter into BSA's official records. I'm glad parents to can see reports from it. I use the Individual Advancement Report all the time. I am against my son using it as a regular tool for his advancement. I want his experience to be a face-to-face, social interaction. Learning how to interact and accomplish goals when dealing with people and their quirks. ScoutBook has turned out fine for adult leaders and parents. I question it's use with the scouts though. With them, I'd strongly encourage the book and paper and a pencil and a pen.

I fear using the analogy of managers and subordinates in scouts. I fear trying to create the perfect troop or perfect scout hierarchy. Of course, help them work in small groups with their PL as their representative. Help their SPL representative the whole troop. We need to coach leaders to focus on the fun. Get the scouts outside. Encourage activities and camping and adventures. Within that context, scout leaders have plenty of opportunities to set examples and coach our scouts.

I tend to avoid commenting on political channels like this. But I have always taken sad view of arguments pitting class against class. I can't criticize the wealthy trying to become more wealthy. If it is a valid argument, then we should criticize everyone who quits a good job to take another job that pays more or has a title boost. We should criticize everyone who tries to develop a career or climb the corporate ladder. Anyone manager level or above must obviously be of dubious character. A man has a right to earn money. It doesn't matter if they are poor, middle class or wealthy. Obviously, we want things to be fair. But a man has a right to make deals. IMHO, if his company holds leases and mining rights ... with due oversight and safety ... we either need to grant the mining or purchase the leases as we have taken away his right to use the land under the terms and purposes the leases were originally granted. I'm not sure what is fair economic exchange, but I'm sure it's in the high millions or billions.

I recently chatted with a new scoutmaster. He talked about all his 2019 summer camp plans, how he'd coordinate everything, campfire songs to sing, skits to teach the scouts, etc. I felt he was planning to insert himself significantly into the scout's experience. My coaching to him was that his plans were nice and sounded fun, but may not be the right venue. I usurped Galadriel's quote from Lord Of The Rings and suggested he remember that our job is to diminish and let the scouts come into their own. It's their camp, their experiences, etc. We are to support, enable and protect, but our job is to mainly sit in the shadows, have a nice coffee and play cards. I think this is the hardest job for adult leader's to learn. Our main job is to diminish.