Engineer61

Eamonn wrote: "At the meeting it came to light that this Scout had made sexual advances to the son of the CC. A lad four or five years younger than him." 17 - (4 or 5) = 12 or 13 = sexual abuse (even if only advances) Why wasn't the Police contacted at this point? Herein lies the problem...the unwillingness to make the tough call to the legal authorities to let THEM sort out the problem. As long as this is the case (with BSA or any other large youth organization) then this problem will continue.

"We were following exactly the national recommendations of the Boy Scouts of America and its board who set up the rules," said A. Buford Hill Jr., a former Orange County Scouting executive, in a recent interview. "You do not want to broadcast to the entire population that these things happen. You take care of it quietly and make sure it never happens again." I guess that sums it up. I sounds just like the Catholic Church. I guess I'm not sleeping one weekend a month for the next 5 years.

Another one? Beginning to see why my wife is trying to get me involved in Scouts... Exactly how are we parents supposed to sleep at night when our Scouts are off on camping trips, Philmont or Jambo, when we know there are pedophiles in the mix. Find'em and report'em ... please.

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Having gone down (and still on) the messy divorce road, I'd say do nothing. Imagine seeing or talking to your child(ren) only 7 out of every 14 days. The last thing you want to do as a parent is give up 2 of them. If you insist on talking to the parents, expect a very, very short and terse reply. If these parents are in the middle of full blown custody battle, activities that take time away from parents can be viewed as a negative on the parent that encourages the engagement ... been there done that... "On his/her weekends with Johnny, he/she doesn't even spend time with him, instead he/she ships him off to Scouts." Scouting is not necessarily viewed by the legal system/custody evaluators/etc as an automatic positive. Also, don't underestimate the fact that the child himself misses his daily contact with his parents and does not want to give that time up for Scouts. 2 cents spent. (This message has been edited by Engineer61)

"If volunteer hours are required, are they then volunteer hours? " No. They may be "Community Service" hours, as required by many offenders in our justice system, but they are not volunteer hours. In my state, in order to pass a State required course to graduate from High School, you must perform Community Service hours...a complete pain in the backside to deal with. By doing so, the State siphons off about 9000 hours of Community Service from my school per school year. Multiply that by all the schools in the state...big number.(This message has been edited by Engineer61)

Seems like the EBoR's being described are a good life lesson. One should never EXPECT to receive the respect or courtesy that one extends...especially in the workplace where there is open competition (sometimes underhanded) for perks/advancement or even keeping your job. As for the uniform issue ... the Scout makes the uniform ... not the other way around. Meaning if a uniform is required to make you a good Scout ... then you aren't one. What you wear does not make or define you...although others may think you are a snobbish bore if you are constantly over dressing.(This message has been edited by Engineer61)

Campground did post a notice, the morning after they had used the well....when the test results arrived. Don't know the context of the well, but since Scout called it "open" I'm guessing it was not a hand pump/cap variety. I agree that contamination is rare in true ground water wells...sealed caps, no back flow, no local contamination possibilities....grew up on well water ... never a problem (except hardness and iron). Sigh... just another bump in the road.

So, the Troop went camping last weekend at two sites... Due to limited water resources at site #2, the SM decided to conserve their packed water by using water from an open well source at site #1. They did not treat the water, no one had any equipment/chemicals to do so. And they didn't boil it. The next day the U.S. Park Ranger informs everyone that the source was tested the day before and has E. Coli. Wife and I just look at each other and ask why we put up with this. So far just mild/moderate diarrhea but this will be doctor day if it does not stop. I'm sure I've missed some important point in all this ... what should a troop carry with them for water treatment?(This message has been edited by Engineer61)

Not really... The kids are outside, away from normal life. Not every "adventure" has to be rocks and sticks only...does it?

Hi BP, The fact is, BSA, like everything is in a different time, different place, different world. And no matter what we might want ... we can't go back. It's depressing to some to have to accept that ... but that's just the deal. I'd much prefer to design chips the way I did when I started out 25 years ago ... a lot more fun and a bigger challenge ... but that's not going to happen. Somewhere along the line, BSA, like everything else got "contaminated" by the Post WWII New World. Faster, more "efficient" and results oriented ... aka, the Eagle quest. Who changed that? I dunno, but I doubt that it *started* at National. Somewhere, somehow, someone decided to make a big deal out of being Eagle. I think it started when Eagles decided to ask if you were an Eagle on job applications, or college applications, or anything for that matter. Like I've mentioned before... when I was a kid, outside of the 4th of July parade I never saw a Scout ... it was totally secret from the mainstream ... not anymore.

As far as I know, none of the "original Scouts" have survived. Sorry...I just couldn't help it...

Seems to be between 1.5 and 2 hours. Usually there are BOR's going on along the side as well.(This message has been edited by Engineer61)

"Explain how the world is our bathroom ... " I guess that pretty well sums up human mentality.... After reading more of this thread ... I'm starting to feel quite content in my non-camping ways..... long walks and high-fiber ... I'll take a pass on that. LOL

Have to admit that I never really thought about that aspect of camping before ... But since I don't like camping in general, it was never an issue. It will be something to keep an eye on with my Scout... ADD gives you some odd behaviors.

Make sure you use a clean rock! LOL

I'm pretty confident that without Parents pushing kids into Scouts, there would be no Scouting by the boys. Too much else to do.

"Acceptable? In whose sight? I try to live my life as God would want me to...and I always fall short. Who among you is qualified to judge? " Don't you mean ... "I try to live my life as (I believe) God would want me to...and I always fall short." That's the rub ... we don't know what God wants...and all we know of Him is what we read in books written by Man. Not really a definitive reference. Reminds me of a joke on God and religions...for another time perhaps.

He should be sitting out the hiking and biking (and canoeing) until cleared for the specific activity by his Dr. (NOT A "you can walk on it at school"). Growth plate fractures are not your typical broken bone...a kid on my baseball team fractured his wrist growth plate...he was in a cast for months to make sure it healed in alignment.(This message has been edited by Engineer61)

Perhaps we should ponder more than the obvious when we consider acceptable lifestyles for BSA leaders and members ... so how about a poll. Which of these "lifestyles" are acceptable for BSA? 1) Heterosexuality 2) Homosexuality 3) Bisexuality 4) Monogamous marriages 5) Polygamous marriages (multiple spouses) 6) Non-monogamous marriages (aka "Open" Marriage) Just askin!

Anybody but Romney ... I'd even take Obama II or Pelosi.

If it's tagged...we give it back, if not, they'll ping the Troop a couple of times at the meetings, then dispose of it.

Having been involved on the receiving end of several hazing incidents in my youth. I can say that I have never allowed by kids to be involved in them in any way. Is singing for the return of an item hazing? Maybe. It depends on how the kid interprets it...not how the SM interprets it.

The K-8 school district here defines: Hazing/Initiation Any activities that can be considered any type of initiation of another student The penalty for which can be Long-Term Suspension The High School is a bit more defined: Hazing means any intentional, knowing or reckless act committed by a student, whether individually or in concert with other persons, against another student, and in which both of the following apply: (A) The act was committed in connection with an initiation into, an affiliation with or the maintenance of membership in any organization that is affiliated with the District. (B) The act contributes to a substantial risk of potential physical injury, mental harm or degradation or causes physical injury, mental harm or personal degradation. Hazing does not include either of the following: (A) Customary athletic events, contests or competitions that are sponsored by an educational institution. (B) Any activity or conduct that furthers the goals of a legitimate educational curriculum, a legitimate extracurricular program or a legitimate military training program. It is not a defense to a violation of this policy if the hazing victim consented to or acquiesced in the hazing activity.

"We are looking to build character, not to box it in." I beg to differ. Character, both good and bad are "built". As such, we should make sure that we "box" the good character into the youth, leaving the bad character traits out. BSA does not have the corner on this ability...it largely settles with the parent.