EagleInKY

I don't own a pair yet (I purchased a look-alike about a year before these came out). But my son and many of our scouts and scouters have purchased them. Most of the boys really like them and see them as a big improvement over the old pants. The shorts are too short by their standards, but I don't know how Scouting will ever be able to keep pace with trends in that area. Hopefully you can find a pair that fits your particular tastes in looseness & length. With that said, I think the biggest fault of them is the lack of sizing options. I have a "vertically impaired" ASM that can't find a pair that fits right. A few others have mentioned that as well. Perhaps more sizing options (with various fits and shorts lengths???) would make them even more appealing. Our troop wears the full uniform, so our guys are happy with the improvement... now if we can get a better shirt.

The reason I like the "Scouting Activity" part is that it encourages participation at the troop/patrol level. My goodness, an active scout should camp close to 20 days/nights a year! Why is it so hard to require them to do that as a scouting activity? It saves the counselor from having to try and figure out what camping was like with Uncle Billy or the boy's grandpa and whether he really completed the requirement.

I like the clarification, and it matches how I felt it was meant to be.

I know exactly where you are, but I never knew that bit of trivia about Burnside. Best of luck to you!

Ditto the "As many as you can get". We have 5 for 23 scouts Looking at 3 more coming in soon. With people being so busy today, I've found we need to have this many just for coverage at activities and meetings. Sometimes there may be only one of the six of us available for an activity.

I think there are state rules that govern this, as well as overall best practices. Around here in Kentucky, it's 30 minutes. The only challenge we have at our camp is that we are fairly close to Fort Knox, so it's difficult sometimes to tell the difference between artillery and thunder. The artillery goes on almost every day and sounds like a distant rumble of thunder. But if you see lightning, it's an immediate evac from the lake and they have to stay our 30 minutes after the last strike. I've spent some time in the desert southwest, where you can see lightning a hundred miles away. I'm sure their guidelines for closing a swimming area would be quite different than ours.

"In fact he'd seen and heard so much about Vision he was becoming hearing impaired!! " LOL - That's a good one E-man. Sounds like something my son would say. I sometimes talk about our troop's vision with the PLC, and try to reinforce it in their planning. My lad (who gets it) gets frustrated with me at times. I explain to him that I have to repeat it for the guys who "just ain't gettin' it". Maybe that's what the BSA is hoping??? Maybe if they say it over and over, some of these folks who are inventin' their own local version of the BSA will get it. I doubt if it will change, but I guess I understand why they do it.

Welcome to the roundtable! We look forward to getting to know you better.

Nice one from a wise ol' Owl!!!

Thanks for chiming in Barry. I was scratching my head at FScouter's response. Why did they not mention that they were members of 4-H a few years ago. Well, maybe because the 4-H didn't teach them anything about survival skills, or first aid, or dehydration, or how to find your way when you are lost, or.. or,...or,... Now, don't get me wrong. I like what the 4-H does. My wife worked for them for several years. But there's nothing in the 4-H programs I've seen that would remotely prepare them for this. Seems like FScouter has drank the coolaid too.

Welcome to our virtual roundtable! We look forward to getting to know you.

Welcome Bob. Glad to have you around the campfire. I'll take a listen to your podcast.

Congrats. It's a great feeling to get that accomplished, isn't it? As for the presentation, it might be hard at a Pack Meeting. I did mine at a Court of Honor and most of the boys were bored. The parents were impressed, but the boys lost interest - the ceremony (although short), was long for their attention spans. I'd suggest doing it at a Pack Committee meeting - if you have a good turnout and they are relatively formal. Or, perhaps some sort of parents meeting. I used to be an Antelope! SR-606(This message has been edited by EagleInKY)

John - You are correct about National. I was only stating the fact that it's not official until the paperwork comes back. A few years ago, before it has become somewhat automated, I understand that there were some kicked back for data mistakes (although those are supposed to be caught before the BOR). Anymore, I think it's pretty much a rubber stamp to make sure all the i's are dotted and t's are crossed.

GWD - The Eagle board doesn't approve the project. In fact, they don't approve the rank advancement either (unlike all the other ranks). They provide the district's approval to the application. At the end of the BOR, the scout is an Eagle Candidate, who still must be approved by national. As for the blood drive questions, blood drives are allowed, but are generally considered weak project ideas. Consequently, some districts and councils won't approve them, unless there is something "above and beyond" that the scout is planning on doing along with it. Your district advancement chairman does have to approve the ELSP, so you must follow their requirements. If the scout can't convince them that the project is worthy, then he'll have to come up with something else.

I believe the issue here is with the word "fail" and not the concept. I, too, agree with Beavah & OGE. A scout may be told that he's not ready to advance. That's not the same as saying he "failed". In our 4 years as a troop, I guess we've done close to 100 BORs. I believe one (or maybe two) were not passed. The one I remember was a scout going up for his Tenderfoot BOR and totally froze up. He couldn't have told them his name if they asked. They worked with him for a while and finally asked him to relax and come back next week. He did, and passed.

My personal opinion - they're amateurish and don't add any value. Typically the ring gets "broken" because of sites going down. There's not much in the way of validation either, so you can get a variety of websites that might not be what you want in your ring. Just my $0.02.

krippe - Good luck, we're headed down there next month. Around Charleston there are several historic tours, both via carriage or walking. There are a few old homes you can visit. It might bore the boys to do more than one, though. Go down to Battery Park and let them see how the Civil War started. Around Asheville, NC there is some good hiking. There's several that have some great panoramic views. Google "Asheville NC Hiking" and see what you get. Between Asheville and Pigeon Forge there's the Great Smoky Mountain Railroad. It takes you out to Fontana Lake. There's some good whitewater in the area too. You can combine those trips. Lots of good hiking around Pigeon Forge (Smoky Mountains). I like Chimney Tops for an easy hike. Great view at the top. For some history, there's Cade's Cove. You can bike there as well.

I'm pretty sure it happened in the late 80s. I know we did it when I was a youth (70s-80s).

Yeah, OGE. But would you have access to Instant Replay to resolve disputes?

Welcome MD... glad to have some new faces on the forum. It's kind of quiet right now, but will likely fire back up after the new year gets going.

"A carin' adult should "infer" the purpose for the requirement and how it connects to the aims of the CO and BSA, eh? Then interpret/adapt to do what's right. The goal is service to the boy and da Aim, yah?" Acco/Beav - I agree with both of you. There's a big difference in helping make the program work given the needs and abilities of the group compared to some of the real "modifications" to the program that we sometimes hear about here.

I think this troop is making this way more complicated than it should. We encourage the boys to show any improvement. In some cases, it's going from not being able to "budge" to getting half way up. Others it's been getting them to be able to "hang" with a chinup longer. I've never believed this requirement requires you to go from "zero to one" or "four to five". But to show improvement. That can be measured many ways. Eleven year olds often don't have the physical development yet to accomplish chinups. So we have to work with them in whatever way possible. On the other hand, with any diligent work, almost any boy should be able to see improvement in all areas.

I believe that you should try to accomplish your ticket items based on the merit of the item. I don't like the idea of getting others to cooperate with you just so you can complete your ticket. One of the challenges, as I see it, is to get others to align with your vision. It's a great test of leadership and teambuilding. Afterward, if you want to share that you did it for your ticket, that's fine. I, personally, did not do that. A few people know one or two of my items. But, for the most part, they were between my Troop Guide and me.

Welcome to the campfire!