EagleInKY

Just curious. How many would you say were just wearing the shirt?

Actually, I think OGE an Anarchist are in agreement here. IF the BOR has already taken place, then the ranks have been earned and you cannot stop them. If that is not the case, then you have to address it for the next rank. Either way, now is a great time to step in and stop the bleeding.

If your definition of uniform is Acco's, I agree that zero is the correct guess. If your definition is a Cub Scout Shirt, maybe a neckerchief, maybe a hat. Then I would guess around 1/3.

What Hops is trying to say is, there is a very straightforward document that we refer to here quite often. It's the Guide to Safe Scouting (aka "G2SS"). If you reference it, you'll find where paintball, lazer tag and other "simulated shooting" sports are prohibited. Here's the link to make it easy on you: http://www.scouting.org/pubs/gss/index.html

John D - Let me first echo the big "Thanks" that's been offered to you. Scouting in Qatar probably requires you to work creatively in a number of ways. I think you're on the right track in offering BORs more often. While the Eagle BOR is a big deal, the ones leading up to it do not need to be that formal. In our troop, we try to "raise the bar" at each level. Tenderfoot and 2nd Class BORs are pretty simple. The Committee Members are very patient and understanding as the boys are often very nervous. As they get to 1st Class and Star, they carry a little more formality to it. We've talked about bringing in someone from the outside for a Life BOR, but our young troop doesn't have anyone to that level yet. The thinking was that it would be good for them to see a new face on the board, since their next one will likely be in front of a several people they've never seen before.

Sounds like you've got some unsupportive parents, or maybe they're just "too busy". Either way, I'd give them a call or catch them after a troop meeting, and say "hey, you know Johnny is ready to his Scout Badge, but he has to the pamphlet exercises, can you get them done this week". They'll probably offer excuses. If their excuse is that they're too busy, then I would tell them that it only takes a few minutes. They could even do it in the car on the way to and from Scout meetings. It could be that they are uncomfortable with the subject. If so, tell them that you were too, but you managed through it. And, in the end, their son will be safer for them doing it.

I agree that these positions can be used by lazy boys to get POR without doing much work. I try my best as SM to make sure they do fulfill some of the responsibilities of the job. For example, The Historian needs to keep the scrapbook up to date and bring it to COHs. If he doesn't he's not doing the most basic part of his job. I've found, however, that I'm quite busy working with the SPL and the new scouts and I seldom have the chance to work directly with these guys. Therefore, it seems like the best way to make it work is how it described in the manuals. The ASPL should take responsibility for making sure the guys in these positions are doing their job. I've found that if you have a very driven and organized ASPL, chances are, they will get a lot of their work done. It certainly is not on the same level as the work the SPL has to do, but that's not the point.

Our district hasn't offered it in years. I ended up buying it for our troop to do it ourselves. It's the Troop Committee Training Kit (Item #B33643, $19.95). It's about a 3 hour program. It includes a sylabus and is pretty easy to follow.

And that's exactly the attitude that has turned off about 1/2 of Americans. The past week, folks in Hollywood and the media have referred to "us" as: - Walmart Voters (I guess there's something wrong with shopping at Walmart). - United States of Jesus (I'm pretty sure they meant this as a slam). - Dumb - Idiots And that's just a few I remember.

Foto - It was a once-in-a-lifetime opportunity. I had a neighbor who was co-owner of a steakhouse. He was having a banner year. I asked if he could give us a good deal on some meat and chicken. He said he could do better. 80 Prime Ribs and 40 BBQ Chicen Breasts. It was something to behold. I still remember our DE enjoying his Prime Rib and laughing about how he was afraid he was going to get another Fried Chicken dinner. I guess he had been to several B&Gs and that was all that was ever served.(This message has been edited by EagleInKY)

We have a BOR in November and June How come? You can have a BOR at any time. Many troops do schedule them at a specific time, but it's usually once a month, not once every six months. With this schedule, how do you achieve FC/FY? Sorry, I know this is taking it a little off subject, but you should rethink this practice. No, correction, you should eliminate this practice.

We always invite our DE to our B&G. I think we've had two attend over the past 7 years. One, however, happened to attend the year we had Prime Rib donated by a local steakhouse. He talked about it for years! The troop often invites our DE to our COHs or other events. He's shown up at a couple of COHs. Of course, one was to do FOS. He says he's going to go camping with us sometime. I told him he was welcome any time.

Bob - You mentioned that the G2SS was updated this month. Is there any reference to what was changed? A pet-peeve of mine is when someone updates a manual and doesn't tell you what changed. Was it "cosmetic" changes or were their some policy changes? Inquiring minds want to know...

Barry - at the church Youth Christmas Play ... she greeted us by saying "So your son pulled a really jackass move this weekend". To coin the phrase of our SPL, "Two words, Un-believable". I would never dream of saying anything like that to anyone in the troop. If a boy made a mistake, I may mention it to the parents, but I'd never do it in that way.

I agree with Bob. I've taken both, and do not see any real difference between the two. In fact, I prefer the online, because I can go back to refer to it. I refresh myself on it about every six months, just to make sure I don't forget things.

The other aspect to this that bothers me is trying to shield him from the behind-the-scenes politics. Scouting, like any other group comprised of people, has it's share of pettiness, grumbling and disagreements. Most scouts come and go from meetings and activities without ever knowing what all goes on. Come to think of it, so do many of the parents. Living at home with the SM, he hears a lot more of this than I'd like him to. But I guess that just goes with the territory. Come to think of it, I was exposed to a lot of it when I was a boy scout (my dad was the SM).

Bottom line is whether or not he completed the requirements, not what kind of message it sends. As already mentioned, I see two requirements that you need to consider: 1) Did he adequately serve in the POR for the specified amount of time required for the rank? 2) Does he show Scout Spirit by living by the Oath and Law in his everyday life? If the answer to both is "yes", then you go ahead with it. Note, he could have adequately served the POR for the required amount of time and only be dropping the ball as of late. If he met the requirement, then you have no option but to sign him off for that. Then you have to ponder question #2. You may also decide that he met these requirements by the "skin of this teeth". If so, you and the BOR should inform him of the need to "step it up" in order to fulfill the requirements for the next rank.

I wrestle with the same thing. Scouting is such a big part of our lives, it's difficult to "turn it off". To complicate it, my son is a little bit of a perfectionist and very much a goal-oriented type. He's always trying to come up with ways to make the troop better. Therefore, he's always wanting to talk ideas. While great, there are times where I really want to think about something else, and this causes frustration on his part.

Congrats Foto. I'm just working on Ticket Item #1. It's only been a month simce WB. Well done!

This is an area that I am constantly trying to do better in. I agree that most heartburn between the SM and new parent's are caused by the new parent's not understanding the Boy Scout program. After all, it's much different from Cub Scouting. I like eisely's idea, and may consider it as an option. Barry's approach is similar to mine, but I think he has a better process. Here's what we do: 1) We prepared a "Parent's Handbook". I don't like calling it a policy manual. I don't believe in them. It explains the Methods of Scouting and how we try to implement them. We first give this to them on their first visit or at the Webelos Open House. 2) We have a parent's orientation session right about the time they cross over. 3) We ask every family to "volunteer" one adult to serve on the troop committee for the first year. This gets them involved and helps them learn what is going on. Next year, I think I'm going to add two things. First, I'm going to try to get Fast Start, NLE and YP training for everyone. It can't hurt for them to better understand the program. Second, I'm going to try to have some type of parent's re-orientation or roundtable after they've been in a couple of months.

I like Beaver's suggestion. Even if he doesn't want the help, and never changes his mind about allowing scouts to use the land, he may, at least, have his opinion changed about Boy Scouts.

We do the same thing as CubsRG48. We do AOL at the B&G banquet and crossover in March. I also agree with Bob's point, that not all have to do it at the same time. However, we do one super-nice, fancy presentation at those times. We re-discuss this every year, and we always end up doing it the same way. The primary reasons are: 1) It keeps the B&G ceremony from getting too L-O-N-G. 2) It allows the boys to get recognized twice for two distinctive things - earning the AOL and making the decision to go on to Boy Scouting. 3) It gives the Webelos a few weeks "cushion" between the two programs. We encourage the den leader to throw a party and have a good time between these two events.

PR takes place at multiple levels. To be effective, all forms of media need to be employed. I know that locally, we've had some good recruiting campaigns using local "celebrities" during round-up time. Also, publicizing activities such as Scouting for Food build a lot of public goodwill. At a unit level, appointing someone to be publicity chairman is a great idea. Whenever a significant event happens, try to get it in the local paper. Even in many cities, there are local papers within the different areas. We live in a small rural area outside of Louisville, and we have our own local paper. They are always willing to run stories about our troop. I just send them an e-mail with a photo attachment and they run with it. A good idea - Our district provides media contacts for all the local newspaper, TV and radio stations as part of the program preview packet in the summer.

If you PM me your e-mail address, I'll be happy to send you our troop's start-up costs and some other items. We started last year.

Most packs that I'm aware of use a "program year" similar to yours. Although, they usually start in conjunction with the school year. They are either from 8/1 to 7/31 or 9/1 to 8/31. Council and district planning kickoff is usually around the first of August, so it's hard to start them sooner than that. I've found that our troops (and others I've spoken to), do a program year pretty much in conjunction with rechartering. That way their budgets and everything are all in synch. We're planning 2005 as we speak. We'll schedule out through summer in pretty good detail, and the fall will be a little vague. Then, when the council and district comes out with information around the first of August, we'll firm up our plans for the balance of the year.