EagleInKY

We use them. We look at two types of fundraisers. One type is a group effort. Examples may include a car wash or setting up a food booth at a local festival. The proceeds for this go into the general fund and are used to purchase, replace or repair equipment. The second type are fundraisers that require individual effort. Popcorn sales, candy sales, donut sales, etc. all fall into this category. For the most part, these are sales-oriented efforts. Our philosophy is that 100% of the profit goes into the scouts account. This way, you don't run into the problems of the wealthier scouts subsidizing the less wealthy. If a scout needs to earn some money for summer camp, then this is a way to ease the burden on his family. If a scout doesn't want to sell popcorn, no big deal. He just won't reap any benefits from those that do. I think this works well and teaches the boys some responsibility. Parents in well-off families can still help teach their sons responsibility by requiring them to bear part of the burden of their fees.

Online ordering is coming. Should roll out this summer. Advancement materials will still have to be purchased at your local scout shop. All other national items (scout stuff catalog) will be available. Local councils will have some options regarding selling additional items. I don't know all the details. The site will be branded for each council, and they will get a percentage of the sales.

I don't like the Badge Magic "glue" stuff that they've carried for years. If you remove a patch, good luck getting that stuff off. And, I've had problems with patches peeling up as well. They've got a new thing that I'm trying out. It's the badge magic double-stick stuff. You cut out a pattern to match the patch and iron it on. So far, it works pretty well. The council strip has come up on the edges while hanging on a hanger. I'll probably go back and stitch up the sides a little to hold that one on. I do not know what will happen if I have to remove a patch. It may suffer from the same problem as the glue.

Some obvious mistakes - 1) No float plan. It sounds like the wife knew the basics, but what if she hadn't been available? A float plan contains information about where you are going, what craft you are taking, etc. 2) Weather! Warnings are made for a purpose. Now, I've been caught out on several campouts when tornado warnings came up. Unfortunately, they are quite commonplace around here in the late spring. But to avoid a coast guard warning to paddlers is inexcuable. 3) Buddy boats! The buddy system isn't only for individuals. Every craft should have a buddy craft. They should always keep in touch with each other. I too am amazed at how flippant they sound. Some of their comments bother me - perhaps it was just the reporter - We waited on them, but they never caught up,, and I wish things had turned out differently. ... This has really shaken me up. Its going to be a long time before I get over this". DUH! How long will it be until the parents of those two boys get over it??? And the comments about rap music and Jerry Garcia... I just don't get it.

Unc - While I agree with you, I also believe the adult needs to have some influence in on the decision. These Eagle Mills can look great to a Webelos. They don't understand boy-leadership or the methods of scouting. Hopefully, the adults are more likely to catch this and can coach the boys into making a better choice.

I'm amazed when I see people making mistakes like this. I admit, like you, have gotten caught in between the rock a hard place from time to time. One time SWMBO volunteered me to stop and pick up a scout on a night when my son wasn't going to be there. I coached her on never doing that again. I don't mind picking them up if my son is with me, but I don't want to be alone with them. I've seen a scouter take a homesick boy back to the campsite at summer camp. I called him on it, and he didn't see the big deal. I've been left alone at a troop meeting before. While not against YPT, I still don't like it. I've always been able to get someone to come back. E- What would I do? Not sure. I'm sure you're afraid this guy's going to think you have it in for him. I think the campmaster committee is a good approach. They should not allow a group to use the facility if there are not two adults present. That could nip it in the bud, at least for outings on scout property.

"Every Troop program is limited by the fears of adults." What a truly profound statement that is. I'm dealing with a situation right now that is pretty well summed up by that. A boy didn't get elected or selected to a POR that he wanted. The parents are quite angry and are blaming me (even though I don't do the electing or the selecting). Their son is a little backward and shy, and they don't let him jump in and try, fail and learn. The cycle we have all gone through to get where we are today. Whenever they see failure coming, they always jump in to rescue him. The poor lad is never going to learn how to deal with adversity at this rate. But I digress. Our last SPL did something that I thought was pretty brave. He asked for feedback, publically, from the troop. He wanted to know what he could do better. Two good things happened. One, the boys gave him some very honest and critical feedback. And two, everything they said tied back to the basic leadership skills we talk about in JLT (communication, decision making, sharing leadership). The reason I tell this is that if he had of asked me if he should do that, I would have recommended against it. Not sure why, other than that's not the way I would have approached it. But, in the end, he learned some valuable insights regarding his own abilities. And I learned a lot about humility and the importance of letting these guys run the program.

Chap - It won't be caught. Have a wrong date on a MB or rank advancement, they'll catch it. Have a signature in the wrong place, they'll catch it. Don't turn in all the paperwork, they'll catch it. Have a friend's mom sit on the Eagle BOR, they'll have no way of knowing. In our district, the DAC chairs almost all Eagle BORs. He tries to get at least one or two "detached" scouters. These would be people from other units, often Scoutmasters or Eagles. He tries to get one person from the community. And, the scout's troop usually offers a member. This is supposed to be someone that is not real close to the scout, but it gives them a "familiar" face in the room. I don't know if that's really the reason, but I kinda think it has something to do with it. Plus, if there's any issues from the BOR, someone associated with the troop can help explain what happened.

Holdem hasn't come up yet. But we have had guys want to play black jack. We don't let them bet with anything. They basically can keep score (# hands won). That's a little more complicated with holdem because of the multiple rounds of betting. I love playing it myself, but I cringe at the idea of scouts playing it. I guess there's a double-standard there.

Canadian - eh? We tried to trick you with that whole zip code thing. Since you're smart enough to get past that, I guess we'll let you in. Welcome to the campfire.

I understand your concern. Give it time and see if it works out. I had one of these free spirits, and he didn't work out real well. He didn't believe in following the rules and especially didn't like following the leaders of the patrol and troop. After numerous problems, he ended up dropping out. But give him a chance and see what happens.

We give each boy in the troop a 6 foot piece of rope. We present it to them at our first campout. We're going to do some type of presentation this year where all the existing scouts start with their ropes tied together in a circle. They'll then open it up, and have the new scouts join the circle by tying the ropes together.

Only problem is that I've seen some SMs who were more interested in getting quantity into the course instead of quality.

We used several of these: http://users.aol.com/randywoo/pine/awards.htm

Manassas, I don't know whether there is any litmus test for it. You probably will be able to sense it. Some are blatently obvious. They're proud of the fact. And, since it sounds appealing to Cub Scout parents, they do a good job of recruiting up from packs. There are exceptions to each one of these, so I expect some rebuttal. - VA's Eagle Plaque (plack???) could be a sign. But it could also just be an indicator of a very good program that has a high retention rate. - Large troops around here are often Eagle Mills. But again, it could also be a sign of a strong program. - If you visit a troop meeting and you ask what they're doing tonight and they answer "down here they're doing Mammal Study, down that hall you will find Cit in the Community and over there is Environmental Science".... you have probably found an Eagle Mill. However, many good troops occasionally offer some MB work time in troop meetings. So that's not a gaurantee either. Ask them if this is typical. - If it appears to be very adult-run, it's possibly an Eagle Mill. - If they key on advancement, quote Eagle statistics and similar info, then they may be an Eagle Mill. Good question. I'll thin about it some more.

Welcome. Glad to have another Eagle on the board. Pull up a log and enjoy the conversation.

When I was CM, we gave each boy a Boy Scout handbook. To make it special, I and the Den Leader wrote a personal note to them and signed it.

Here's a few that come to mind... 1) Bears love bit-o-honey bars, especially when you leave them in your backpack instead of the bear bag! 2) When the wind rips your hat off your head on top of Mt Baldy, it will fly forever before it hits the ground. (It was kind of sad watching my faithful cap disappear in the distant sky.) 3) There's nothing more relaxing than sitting on the porch of a staff cabin, sipping hot cocoa on a rainy day. 4) The girls all look prettier in the back country. (This was back in the day when there were very few girls in the back country!) 5) And, another one for the old-timers. That Textrox Trots stuff ain't a legend (as my dad found out).

I had the same question as EagleWB. This sounds like a troop-level practice BOR. Cookie - Did you sign anything at the end of it recommending the young man be awarded the Eagle Rank? If not, chances are this was a practice drill (albeit badly organized).

Great question badger. I'm answering off the cuff, so I might think of some other items later. 1) Maturity. I don't care if he's the most popular or really plays well with others. I want him to be a mature leader for the troop. I guess the best way to say it is "set the example". By asking this question, I'm assuming you're a pretty mature young man. 2) Decision making ability. We teach lots of methods of solving problems and making decisions. But I see a lot of SPLs that can't make a decision after evaluating the options. They usually know what they should do. It's having the confidence to execute it. 3) Communication, communication, communication. Written, verbal, you name it. It's all important. Listening is just as important as telling. In this age of e-mails, our guys have developed lazy habits of communicating that they need to "unlearn". 4) Delegating/sharing responsibility. A good leader doesn't try to do it all. I like to see a SPL that tries to work as a team. 5) Teacher. The SPL should be a mentor/teacher to the guys in the troop. He won't know everything (that's what the SM is for!!!). But I would hope he can answer most of the basic scout skills questions from a young scout.

Barry - Great post. I remember attending JLT back when I was a scout. I believe I was 15. It felt about the right age for me. I was not the oldest, but old enough that I was pushed into the leader role quite often. It was an eye-opening experience and one that I'll never forget. The next year I was invited to come back on staff. I remember one of the young scouts in the patrol I worked with. He was the youngest in camp. The SM had to petition the council to allow him to come. He was very immature. He had never camped without his dad, and had only gone on one long-term camp in his life. He survived, and probably was stronger because of it. But I really think he should have waited another year.

Wow. Lots of questions. I'll attempt to answer. Most of these can be answered by looking up the Boy Scout advancement requirements. I've included your questions, my answers in italics. Is a Boy Scout required to stay at a certain rank for any set amount of time? (Tenderfoot for ? months, 1st class for ? months?, etc) No. What is the minimum number of years and months a Boy Scout has to participate as a Boy Scout before he can earn the rank of Eagle? Check the requirements. You'd have to do the math. There are minimum times between 1st Class and Star, Star and Life, Life and Eagle. Remember, it's not a race. What levels of leadership, and how long in leadership roles, is a Boy Scout required to serve at any level to qualify towards earning his Eagle? Check the requirements. I don't have it memorized. What is the required (or recommended) number of, and qualifications for those adults serving on any particular Eagle Board of review? Eagle BOR participants are usually selected by the district advancement chairman. Each council/district may have their own guidelines What is the difference in those serving on Merit Badge Board of Review compared to Eagle Board of Review? No such thing as a MB BOR. There are BORs for each rank. The BORs for Tenderfoot through Life are ran and coordinated by the troop advancement chair. The members of these BORs are members of the Troop Committee. Is it ok for a Cub Scout or Boy Scout to wear a bolo tie instead of the neckerchief and slide, if so, is there times the bolo is not appropriate? (I assume any time the uniform is worn, either the bolo tie or neckerchief is required uniform attire?) Is the bolo tie just for Scout Leaders? I'm pretty sure that neckwear is a troop decision. Who has the final say on when a Boy Scout is ready to submit for the Eagle rank... Scoutmaster, parent, or other person? Not the parent. Scoutmaster has to sign off on the last requirement before sending the paperwork in. The District Advancement Chair has a review step before setting up the BOR. Once earned, can the Eagle rank, or any other Boy Scout rank be taken back from a Scout due to inappropriate actions, or any other form of discipline? Nope.

Here are some links from the past: http://www.scouter.com/forums/viewThread.asp?threadID=61814 http://www.scouter.com/forums/viewThread.asp?threadID=55514

OneHour. I believe it depends upon the size of your troop more than anything else. We currently use a method similar to what you describe. But we're a small troop (12 boys, 2 patrols). One patrol does the cooking and cleanup at each meal. The other patrol has fire & water duty during that time. Sometimes we alternate meals, sometimes by the day. It's up to the PLC. I think you nailed the pros and cons. I would love for us to be really good at patrol cooking, I think it's the truest form of scout camping. We plan to move toward patrol cooking as we get larger. We'll be up to 20+ boys soon. We're going to start dabbling with that this year. A middle ground that I've seen work in some troops is where you have a common menu, but each patrol prepares and cooks their own portions. This makes preparation and shopping a little easier.(This message has been edited by EagleInKY)

Gotta love the media. I don't think it's as much anti-scouting in this case as it is just the shock value. One headline I saw said something to the effect of "Cub Scout Leader Arrested for Mass Murders". Almost made it sound like he killed a bunch of Cubbies at Day Camp. I've also seen headlines describing him as a church leader and a person "involved in the community". And, what is a "Cub Scout Troop" anyway?