EagleInKY

Just a little pet peave - One Webelos, two Webelos, they are all Webelos. The "S" in Webelos is not to make it plural, it's for "Scouts".

I know that my particular faith in Christianity did not have its own service at Jambos until the 80's. It was only because no one ever organized an effort to do it. Now we have a support system in place and are always present. I'm sure that a muslim group could do the same.

Target some recruiting at specific ages. One year we really wanted to beef up the Bears & Webelos 1s, so we went to the school's open house on the night that 3rd and 4th graders were there. I was surprised how many parents said "yeah, we thought about this a few years ago, but were so busy with _______, maybe we will try it now". We probably got 3 or 4 per age group that year. Make sure you are doing activities that keep these older cubs interested. Plan a campout, go on hikes or other field trips. I've seen some Bear dens that acted more like Tigers. Remember, they are a little older and offer will have the "been there, done that" attitude already.

I agree that the shoes should fit the activity. Often I wear sneakers to troop meetings, especially in the summer when I'm wearing my scout shorts. If I'm going to a district meeting, I'm more likely to wear casual or dress shoes. Funny you mentioned open-toe shoes with scout socks. I had a boy wear just that at our troop meeting this week. Gotta admit it looked a little odd, but he seemed to like it.

Semper dude, we're just trying to keep you honest! :-) PNWscouter - I don't know if there is an "official" answer, but hopefully someone on here will know. I know there are some waterfront staffers in the forum. I will say this, I have witnessed what you described. Some boys freak out over swimming in a lake. Something about not being able to see bottom I guess. Or maybe it's knowing there's fish in there. Not sure. As for me, I sometimes struggle swimming in a lake. I have allergies and asthma, and sometimes the lake water tears them up. Therefore, I avoid the lake at Summer Camp. Unless you hear otherwise, I would treat it as a judgement call. What activities are you planning that they would be excluded from? Is it a canoeing trip down a peaceful river, then I wouldn't worry about it. Is it Class VI whitewater, then maybe you have something to think about.

"The committee members all have the distinct impression that the boy would not be in scouting if his mother were not forcing him. " If every scout that met this description at one time or another were removed from scouts, we'd have some pretty small units. The fact is, there will always be scouts who have parents that "force" them to stay. In this case, the mom probably realizes that scouting is the best thing in the world for him to boost self confidence, learn new skills and make friends. I don't know anything about this disorder, but scouting is flexible enough to meet the needs of any young man. Check into the Scouting for Youth with Disabilities handouts. Do some searching on the web. You'll find lots of good information. Then go back to the committee and educate them. It may be possible to get mom to back down, once you understand the condition more. Perhaps another scouter can pick up the role so it doesn't seem so much of "mom doing the work". Or, maybe some older scouts can help him along the way as well. This could be a great life-lesson for them. As for the teasing, that has got to stop. Start with your PLC and filter the message out to the troop. I remember as a scout having a stern lecture from the SM (my dad) about picking on an undersized scout. He yanked all of the older guys to the side and laid down the law. We set the example, and before long, others followed. Best of luck. You're doing a great thing.

Seattle - Not only that, but can you imagine how thin Semper must be to level off and swim in 6" of water and not touch bottom. He must be very buoyant!

In our district, other than (1) LDS units and (2) new units, I don't see COs involved in leader selection at all. For den leaders, committee members, assistant unit leaders, it's a "rubber stamp". It's like Radar and Colonel Blake, "here sign these". For unit leader positions, the CO likes to know who it is, but they don't do the selecting. Our pack committee (I'm CC) recently selected a new cubmaster. I saw Joe (COR) around town one day. "Joe, I think we've got a new Cubmaster lined up. It's going to be Charles. You remember him?". Joe replies, "yes, I know him, he'll do a good job.". Me, "I'll get the papers to you to sign here soon. Thanks."

I believe Bob said it best " The role of the PLC members is to represent the wants and needs of their patrols, and to plan and take responsibility for the various troop meeting elements and troop activities. " This is your main job, to be the voice of your patrol members. Think of it like Congress, (or like Congress is supposed to be :-)). Representing the needs of their constiuents. Our PLC has all the responsibilities listed, plus probably some more. My buddy Barry made a great point (albeit with a few mis-spelled words:-)). As your program grows and matures, so will the ability of the PLC to take on more responsibility. I find that the only limitations to the PLCs responsibility is (1) their confidence to take on the task (which we as adults must help boost), and (2) the fear of us adults in giving them control. As for participating in Committee meetings. I try to include the SPL in the meeting to present the upcoming calendar and talk about anything on the long-range plan that needs committee buy-in or input. (Our committee meeting takes place the same time as patrol meetings, so sometimes he's busy assisting with that.) He also comes to the meeting following the annual and mid-year planning sessions to present the plans to the committee.

Of course, you have to have permission from the person who controls the property. In our case, the principal would have to grant you permission to conduct a fundraising project on school property.

One big difference between the boy scouts and the other organizations you mentioned is that there is a much greater set of opportunities for pedaphiles and others to commit their acts. For example, in 4-H, my wife's clubs were always within the constructs of a classroom. There just wasn't any opportunity for abuse. The only opportunity would have come at summer camp, which about 1% attended. As for Little League, I've coached several sports teams. We come together for a year, we practice and play games, and then move on to the next year. There's not near the emotional connection that you build over a long-term relationship as in scouting. Plus, all of our activities were normally witnessed by a number of well-meaning, if not over-bearing, parents.

I don't have a comment on the "franchise" concept yet, but I'll comment on Semper's point of planting units. I think it's the right concept, but I believe egos get in the way too much. For example, about 7-8 years ago, we were the only pack associated with an overcrowded school (not sponsored by them, just the only pack that recruited from it). The pack was struggling with 20-25 boys due to leadership. The school district set up a new school, and took about 1/3 of the students away. The district came in and established a new pack. Some of our leaders went nuts, saying they were diluting a struggling program. Well, you know what happened? New leadership took over the pack, and - even with a smaller school population - the pack has multipled three-fold. Now they are planning a new school that will take close to 1/2 of the students away. (Yes, the school is overcrowded again). Again, the district is wanting to establish a new pack, if they can find a sponsor. Some of our leaders are crying foul. But we're up to 60 boys. What's the harm in getting smaller and "retrenching". I'm sure, with good leadership, the pack can rebuild to current numbers. IMHO, too many leaders are trying to build their mega-packs and mega-troops and not focusing on the interest of the whole.

GB - We do pretty much the same thing. Our "dress uniform" includes the neckerchief. Except sometimes when we travel or if it's really hot we nix it.

Just adding to the thoughts... the SM can play a big role in setting goals out for the kids. Our guys had a tendancy to "think small" in their annual planning. Of course, being a new troop of young scouts, who could blame them. I challenged them to come up with one item for the year that (1) most of the boys had never done, (2) was affordable, and (3) was exciting. They came up with whitewater, and it was a great trip. Another goal I gave them was to "shake up" the program from the previous year. Think of new places to go, or go back and visit a place they haven't been to in a few years. I didn't give them a hard & fast number, but you could encourage them to change up at least 1/2 of the outings. Just a couple of more cents worth. I hope it helps.

The first two don't surprise me at all. These are the first two we encourage new scouts to work on. Why? Because they are the basis for so many other things. The others surprise me a little, but I'm not surprised that the top 5 all come off of the Eagle list. Odds are they are always going to be at the top of the list.

Thanks for sharing a great story. I think this could be a great scoutmaster's minute when you are using a First Aid theme.

Well,since you said please... In some ways, I was quite impressed with your post. Definitely a go-getter who wants to see his troop succeed. On the other hand, I detected a certain amount of arrogance in some of your comments (calling your old SPL a young egomaniac who led you to do stupid things, for example). But, I'll write this off to youthful exuberance for now. The key to building a successful plan is to find out what the boys like to do. What activities/campouts have been successful in the past. What have they heard of other troops doing that sounds cool? What would they like to do, but have never had the chance to do before? We do this by conducting a survey. The boys rank each activity on a scale of 1-5 in response to two questions "did you enjoy it?" and "would you want to do it again?". We then survey other interests like backpacking, whitewater, climbing/repelling, horse riding, biking, canoeing, etc. Get the ideas from the boys, and build the program around what they want to do. Make sure it's seen as "their plan" not "your plan". Whether you are an SPL or the SM, you have to avoid personal ownership of the plan. It needs to belong to the boys. To do this, of course, you need heavy involvement from your PLC. Best of luck!

Welcome to the forum. Is scouting a good idea? You betcha! Is scouting for everyone? Unfortunately, no. But neither is soccer, baseball or the academic team. But it sounds like your son will be a perfect fit. I hope he gets much out of it, and gives back even more in the future!

I believe the uniform police would say: "yes, yes, and yes". Although I have heard arguments against wearing patches earned as a youth, I don't think they are valid.

GernBlansten - It's hard to place blame on the other leaders since the report says that this occured at his home. This would have been outside of the normal troop setting. YPT and the associated guidelines work well within the troop program as long as all of the leaders enforce them. But a predator is going to find a way around them, at any cost. I've often stated that YPT was more about protecting the innocent from false accusations than anything else. It's hard to accuse someone falsly if they've never been left alone with them.

Our pack and troop have a strong relationship. Several of the active leaders from each group have boys in both programs. At least six are registered leaders in both groups. Here are some of the ways we work together: - Troop provides Den Chief for 2nd yr Webelos (plan to extend this to younger ages over time, we're still getting started). - Pack family campouts - several scouts who are family members help put on events. - Pack Roundup - Several scouts and leaders come help coordinate, crowd control (for the kids), etc. - Webelos overnighters - The troop invites Webelos to camp out with them during some campouts in the Fall. - Scouting for Food - We do this together. - Scout Sunday - both units invited to our CO's services. - Pinewood Derby - Troop provides most of the labor. - B&G - Several Boy Scouts will be there in support. Sometimes we do a color guard. - Crossover - SM, SPL, TG, and several scouts will be in attendance and actively participate in the crossover. - Summer Activities - Pack has a pool party, the troop is invited as guests. Pack has a rocket derby, some scouts come to help run it or participate. So, as you see, we do lots of things to help each other out and build a relationship. It's worked pretty well.

Yeah, I'm not sure where this guy is cruising to, but I'll stay out of his way. My ride has been pretty thrilling. Of 9 boys who started this troop 2 years ago, eight are still involved in scouts. Of the 15 we had on the roster a year later, 15 are still in scouts. We've lost three to transfers and one newly crossed over scout who never quite got the hang of the program. And just about every troop in this area can tell the same story. I realize that there are some problems in areas, and nation-wide numbers are down. But overall, the program is as strong as ever.

Semper nailed it pretty good (man that guy's good). I would start with your SPL. Explain to him the need to add variety so boys won't lose interest. On that note, have you lost very many scouts? If so, do you know why? It could be that you're losing scouts because other troops offer a more exciting program. If it's the work that scares them, start with some pre-packaged ideas. Around here there is a place that does cave camping. Everything is done for you. In WV, Ace Whitewater provides a whole mess of turn-key activities. They'll even feed you if you want. Several state parks have programs where your guys can do some advancement work. How about a low-ropes course? This is what we did with our guys. When they got a taste of adventure, they started going nuts for the stuff.

It's good you use the term "strong, boy-led". There are a number of troops out there that are very "boy-led", but they aren't very strong. I've been to a couple of them. One plays games for 80% of the meeting every week and has very little instruction or patrol time. Another one is utter chaos. The leaders don't step in (which is usually a good sign), but it's obvious that they don't provide much leadership/mentoring/coaching either. Our troop is evolving into a strong, boy-led troop. When we started, we were very much adult-led. But with all new scouts, it took a while for the boys to realize their role. (Some of them still don't). But a good boy-led troop will still follow a plan, be well-run, and lots of fun for the guys. One thing we do when Webelos visit is take the parents into another room for a while. Most of the adults will come as well. We use this as time to get to know them and let them ask questions. At first, they're under the impression that there are adults over there leading the meeting. It's not until we explain boy-leadership to them and then take them back into the troop meeting that they see what we mean. I think it's very powerful for a new parent to witness a truly well-run, boy-led meeting.

4-H has "school clubs", where they partner with teachers to augment their education - usually in the area of values/ethics. Every kid in the class is registered as a 4-H member, whether they want to be or not. And, yes, they get UW funding to support the program. How do I know this? My wife used to run the program and I helped her write the UW funding proposal.