Eagledad

😎 Ah, I again find myself the student. Barry

Tiresome? Most folks who have no experience with nor connection to the armed forces don't even know they are military terms for the uniform. They just think they scouting terms. You and I rarely disagree, if ever at all before, but with all that has happened to the program in the last 30 years, I feel this is much ado about nothing. In fact, since it is a common term used in scouting, I would rather keep it just so we have something that links today's program to past tradition. Barry

National also says the uniform is not required, yet the Scout Handbook states how and when to wear the uniform properly (or it did when I was SM). Talk about contradictions. I don't believe using different names for uniform is corrupting the program. These names have been around since at least the 60s. Now, if someone was to say using Class B to describe a uniform is the cause of the fall of Patrol Method, my ears would perk up. But there needs a convincing argument. And donuts, good arguments and donuts would have some sway. Barry

Yep, replace this situation with just about any situation confronting the Patrols and the advice is the same. "provide subtle guidance". Never! Integrity of a patrol method program is based on each patrol functioning as a team, even if only one scout in each patrol shows up to a troop activity. I admit such a situation would be challenging, but Patrol Spirit and can only flourish in the fertile ground of pride for being a member of a patrol. Personally I think a troop of scouts with only one member representing each patrol would be fun challenge because nobody does it. Have them figure it out. The members of High adventure crews often do their own cooking and tenting. How can they cook, sleep and do the activities as a patrol when only one member of each shows up? Might require some subtle guidance. Honestly, I envy the SM willing to give it a try. Exciting! Barry

I have never seen scouts with more than a two year difference want to tent with each other. Most usually have at least one friend close to same age. That being said, we have four-man tents, so odd number ages aren't usually a problem because that usually solves the odd man out situation. Keep in mind that the outdoors at night can be quite intimidating (scary) at night for scouts new to camping. Which is why I encourage troops to not let a new scouts tent by themselves. We learned to coach the PLs on showing new scouts the paths to the latrines (bathrooms) and to put a light near the entrance. We have found urine stains on tents more than once. Barry

In my youth, there was a life guard attended spring fed swimming hole at summer camp where skinning dipping allowed. I guess this word "creepy" came from adults because I've never heard anything like it from scouts taking group showers. I also don't remember hearing anything like it when adults showered with scouts back in the day, but times are different. Hey, what about trans scouts and adult leaders? Still, I find it ironic that the only adult leaders I've seen get in trouble at scout camps are women leaders (moms) walking into the youth showers to check on their scouts. There is not doubt in my mind they were just following their motherly instinct of checking on her chicks, but they learned quickly the seriousness of the rules. When one of our female leaders heard about the scandal, she wondered how they would have felt about a dad checking in on a girl scout troop. Of course those words are closer to home now. I would not be surprised that the required facility changes for girls will push a few camps to be sold. These things are very expensive and some councils can't afford it. Barry

Maybe family scouting is the only way for the program to survive. Strangely, parents may grow more from scouting than their kids when looking at the "Free Range Kids" approach. Of course some will have to get past their uniform hangup first. Barry

Be stubborn about your goals and flexible about your methods.

For Pete’s sake, folks simply must remember to eat their Wheaties each morning. Barry

Originally the approval by Council was to insure that scouts weren't stepping on toes with politics, or something similar. As with anything else, when we create rules for guidance, some monitors of the rules use it to leverage an advantage. The Councils are very stressed from lack of funding, so they are probably looking in dark corners to make up for it. Barry

We will see, but there were some predictions that membership would be affected by the membership policy changes of recent years. Large membership changes usually show at about five years because Pack membership is too dynamic to follow. At least from outside National membership data. Overall BSA Membership trends are easier to see five years after a policy change because the scouts who start out as Tigers reached the troop age. Troop membership trends is more stable because scouts who stay in the troop after the first year tend to stay at least three years, which makes trend changes easier to see . If what your seeing is indicative of a trend, the Troops are going to see fewer crossovers and the unit membership rolls will show a measurable drop. National is hoping the new girl policy will balance the trend. Barry

Isn't it funny how we adults think we are the safety net on challenging activities like back county treks. If scouts are trained to at least First Class level skills, is the average adult better? I reflect on two different instances our crews got lost. One, I knew where we were and what correction we needed. The other, we were all lost. What is the role of the adult in each situation? Is there a point when the adult needs to pull out the "Adult Card"? On a side note: that solo stuff looks pretty cool. Barry

Are you going to the Fishing Camp on your trek? The picture of the river reminded me of that very spot. Barry

Its isn't quite the same. But yes, done correctly, it can still accomplish a lot of growth. However, we averaged 4 High Adventure Crews a year and my experience is the adults find letting the scouts have that level of independence "EXTREMELY challenging", they fail more often than not. In fact, our scouts come back frustrated because they weren't even allowed the independence they are accustomed with at troop monthly campouts (where the SM can guard the scouts from the adults). Barry

Yes, but I think the post by Richardb "you would be leaving kids without Two Deep Leadership, a core part of Scouting's Barriers to Abuse" represents why the culture won't allow her to be embraced. I understand why the BSA has new YP policies, but I wonder if they see the irony. Barry

When I was a scout, the scouts in our troop who attended the OA Ordeal weekend came back a different more mature person. The requirements of that Ordeal are considered hazing today. It seems today's culture feels that growth gained from enduring the strain of designed purposeful circumstances is not considered healthy. Barry

Is there more to the story, why the focus on that Scout? Oh, one of our best SPLs was the quiet scout. My younger son was very shy and considered a bit of a hero on a trek that went badly. I personally like standing in the shadows and modeled it as a SM. Barry

I've noticed protesters don't seem to mind the fumes, and I've never heard an environment activist complain on CNN. Barry

Add not to wear fixed blade knives on the belt while traveling because they have been known to puncture seats.

I always found this to be the most interesting question by the EBOR because the answer typically shows how the scout feels about his culture, and often shows me that I (the scoutmaster) didn't know him as well as I thought I knew him. As was said, there is no right or wrong answer, but usually enlightening. At least for me. Barry

I wonder if BP envisioned BORs in the process. BORs used to be done by scouts, which is a variation of the COH that you are talking about. I been promoting "boy run" BORs since I've been an adult leader just for the reason you gave "Surely this would demonstrate a truly boy-led troop". In fact, we started including one older scout on our BOR. I'm not sure where the present style of COHs were brought into the program, but they were the same in my troop during the 60s and 70s. Barry

I'm a little different, I think a BOR member should consider misquoting the Oath or Law as a red flag of the SMs program. After all they repeat it several times a month. But, this is a difficult example because I agree with fred that scouts often misquote, and completely forget, such things under stress. I do believe most experienced unit leaders can tell the difference between stress or incomplete scouting experience. I would pass this scout, and then meet with the SM. Consistent Scout performance is indicative of the program and if the BOR observes a consistent flaw, the SM is responsible. If the BOR feels the scout is personally responsible for flaws in the review, but meets all the requirements, then they can explain their concern to the scout and then sigh him off. And then meet with the SM later on. I had several such talks with BOR while I was SM. Sometimes the adults need to have a meeting of the minds for a common understanding. Barry

Yes exactly. ILST is a great starting place for inexperienced troops. But, training should only be used where participants need information to grow in performance. A troop is free to change the syllabus so that it applies to real deficiencies of performance. This was the first guideline I preached to District trainers when I was the Council Junior Leadership Training Chairman. New troops need to use standardized training syllabuses because all their scouts are starting from the same place of knowledge, experience and maturity. But, as those scouts practice the lessons of the basic courses and grow in maturity and experience, their actions become the main teacher for scouts with less experience and maturity (younger scouts). By focusing on continued growth of the older scouts, the younger scouts will learn the same skills without as much of the training. We eventually reduced training to just a few hours a year for basically "need to know" information specific to each Position of Responsibility (POS). If we found the patrols lacking in a general skill, we would create a lesson activity for that skill. And see that as a red flag of something lacking in our program. But, that kind of program requires experience and understanding of the skills scouts need to work toward growth. So, units need to start slow with actitities like ILST, but understand that growth requires change to keep up with the maturity of the scouts. A troop shouldn't need to repeat all of last years syllabus, something should be taken out, and something added for the expectation of raising the bar for maturity. Barry

There have been some good discussions of ILST lately, I'm not sure the best way to find those discussions (mods?). They are pretty good, but with a lot of content, so starting the discussion over is difficult. I'll just say (repeat in short) that I think ILST is a good way to start team development for a new program, but looses it's effectiveness quickly because the syllabus content does not mature with the troops program growth. Youth this age don't enjoy training, especially when they have seen it before. They learn best by watching their older scout role models repeating the lessons learned. If you feel ILST is needed to improve the program, then why didn't the older scouts learn it last year? A habit is developed in practice, not training. I'm not saying don't do it, use it if you can see value in it. But, don't just do it because it's there to do or something to keep scouts busy. Instead, work your program for continued growth in the troop and patrol activities. Barry

Seems lately that I'm attracted to quotes that are more specifically directed toward how scouters (Scoutmasters) use Patrol Method. "We are what we repeatedly do. Excellence, then, is not an act, but a habit." Aristotle Barry