Eagledad

When I was a SM, my goal for all the scouts was to develop moral and ethical decision makers. The more a often a scout makes a decision, the more likely they will grow into an ethical moral decision maker. Done properly, the MB process is almost entirely the practice of making decisions. The MB process only looses integrity when the adults make some of the decisions for the scouts. Barry

Is that like asking if more than 1 camp outs a month are a waste of time and money?

I understand what your saying, but it's different strokes for different folks really. Most scouts I've met who earned more than 35 badges were more along the lines of self motivated. The best way to describe these scouts is something along the lines of nerdy, lacking for better words. Like some students that don't have to study to make "A"s in school, some scouts find earning MB badges easy and fulfilling. Not saying that some scouts don't fit in your description, but I don't want a discussion of ideas based on a small select group. Barry

This discussion went the direction that MB Colleges are a bad thing, and I know I was in front of that band wagon. But, truth is, I don't care how a MB is presented so long as the counselor follows the BSA guiidelines that Tahawk posted. " It all begins with a Scout’s initial interest and effort in a merit badge subject", "Earning merit badges should be Scout initiated, Scout researched, and Scout learned." I'm not so rigid in my opinion of the scouting program that I believe Barry's way is the only way. I just believe there should be some caveats to keep the creativity within BSA reason. There are as many creative approaches for making Merit Badges interesting and educational as there creative minds that want scouts to grow from the experience. Where I struggle is the selfishness of skipping the "effort" and the "Scout initiated" part of program. While on the district committee, I found that most unit leaders in our district skipped those many of those guidelines in their MB program. Not by choice, but by ignorance of how the unit was supposed to present the MB part of the program. How does that Happen? How does a unit get so far off track of the BSA guidelines in their program that the award turns into the goal instead of growth from the experience? The answer is simple, the units don't get proper training and support of the BSA advancement part of the program from the models of District and council. When units only observe the presentation of advancement as a ladder toward recognition without "effort" and "scout initiated", they model that same motivation. Why not, if that is how District or council view advancement, it must be correct. Right! How often have you heard or read from District and Council that the reason for their provided program or activity is " youth accepting responsibility, demonstrating self-reliance, and caring for themselves and others; when they learn to weave Scouting ideals into their lives; and when we can see they will be positive contributors to our American society."? I can't recall ever hearing that in courses and activities. Well, except in courses I led. As I said, I don't care how Merit badges are presented so long as the counselors and providers are using the BSA advancement and MB counseling guidelines. Adults may struggle to understand how the advancement guidelines work toward a scout developing the habits of self-reliance, caring for others, and using Scouting ideals in their lives, but they only need to follow the simple guidelines to be a BSA model to let the program work its magic. Then the adults (units) are not led astray by the short-cutted and misdirected programs and instead model their own program with the same guidelines. Barry

Ive noticed it’s the same crowd who use name calling as their argument in some of the discussions on the forum. I hope they are young because they are certainly immature. Next thing we’ll be hearing “familyphob” being thrown around. Barry

More money in family camping.

I'm not sure what means; nobody from other units came asked us our JTE score, nor did I ever ask theirs. I'm not taking sides here, just posting my observations. But, are proposing a JTE Camporee? Nobody cheats at camporees. OK, there was those new girls troops. Barry

What does the director of field service do with the calls, and what does PA call abuse? Barry

43 points to help little ol ladies doesn't seem like enough. The rest is ok I guess. Will consider each item as the discussion continues. Barry

Maybe more than that. Your time as a coach, youth teacher, counselor, and school volunteer as well. You could loose your job and get asked to leave other organizations. Seems nobody really knows how far this can go. So to suggest that scouting is the only risk appears naive. Even you suggest you will report to National at the drop of the hat, I can't imagine volunteering around 3 or 4 Buggies. My time as a volunteer just a few years ago was far simpler. I'm not sure the risk is worth it with the new policies. And lets not get tunnel vision on the types of actions that could be considered harmful. We asked a lot of adults to stay clear of scout activities as a result of something they said or did. We had one lawyer surprise us with a visit because their clients son didn't like the cussing from one of the adults. None of those actions were sexual in nature. Can you imagine an adult just having a bad day and letting go of a few four letter words. And it could just be something considered politically incorrect, like smoking in view of the scouts. Scouting is way to hard. after reading Buggies posts, I would insist leaders give clear written warning of how they will handle adults actions that are viewed unsafe. Training isn't enough warning if all reports are going to National. Barry

When adults are confronted with decisions without information, they think methodically. So, a methodical checklist should be the very minimum of information they can rely on. Most units used the "Tour Permit" as a checklist. What of the checklist did they have? Also, I've said many times that the best way to drive broad habits of policy in all the units is through training. If the items of the checklist are taught and supported in training as actions of a quality unit, the units will likely reference it. At least to some degree. And, when a unit is struggling, the first check of the program would be the checklist. So, "go succeed" is not a request, it's an integrated part of the process. Barry

My experience with the JTE is that while it can be a good checklist to evaluate the program, it also encourages fudging to reach a passing grade. The challenge is using JTE as educational without ranking the program on a pass/fail scale. The Tour Permit (that isn't used anymore) was a good checklist for guiding units without ranking (judge) the unit. It simply gave a minimal list for traveling and perform scouting activities safely. I have watched unit leaders spend hours trying to justify passing on FTEs. Barry

Im retired from scouts, so I haven’t had the training. What happens to the adult who is reported? Is there a chance to defend against the accusation? Barry

There are two types of Venturing units: units where the adults are sponsors, and units where the adults are adventurers. Sponsors have passion for the theme and tend to stay around for years. Adventure adults are in it to continue troop adventure and usually drop out in 3 years. If I really wanted to measure current changes on the Venture program, I would look at units at least 10 years old. If those units are dropping out, the BSA has a real problem. Barry

Indeed. Religion, especially Christianity, is being so demonized as hate that even an open discussion of understanding how it positively helps youth resist porn might not be tolerated. Barry

Just so volunteers know exactly what they are getting into, to whom is the violation reported and does it go on some permanent record? Barry

Wow, that is a very interesting article. I have a question, However, in the last paragraph, the author states we can do ""We do our children a great disservice when we send them negative messages about their emerging sexuality. Instead, we need to guide them into healthy patterns of sexual behavior that will serve them for the rest of their lives." What are the negative messages? Healthy patterns of sexual behavior? If religious youth are less likely to indulge in porn, what are their patterns? Seems like the article created more questions than information given. Barry

The difference between construct and pride is the difference between an intellectual direction and defensive posturing. Even in construct, idealism requires minimum instruction. Barry

Can random philosophy save the ego! 🤔 Barry

Wished I thought of the bar location. Barry

Well, maybe,but a Visionary is one who sees the big picture and understands where the little pieces fit to make the big picture reach the goal. I do understand the 10 great leaders theory and can’t disagree, but one good visionary can get most volunteers of mediocre abilities to be productive because they match their skills with specific program needs. I witnessed a visionary place a volunteer with basically no skills in a position that matched what little she had to offer. She earned the Silver Beaver for her noble effort in improving the district program. If just following the program and leadership structure was all it took to get units at the top of their game, most units would be there. But, the average volunteer can’t get their arms around the program today because it has grown to complicated. The real crime here is as you say, those special people are just waiting to be asked. That is why I said find that one adult for the troop of 4 scouts, and that person will make it a great troop again. Just needs to be asked. Barry

Good post. Idealistic, but this should be the visionary model of every council. The higher the visionary in the organization, the broader the success of the organization. I posted a few times lately that the quality of units are directly related to the quality of the district leaders. And of course the quality of the council is directly related. But not always. I have experienced strong district leaders who leverage their power over weak paid council representatives. So, nothing is guaranteed. As I have said before, the best councils and districts are the ones that express vivid visions that units can understand and follow, and recruit the right leaders in positions to match the required skills to develop the units. I think this is where Churkhardt is going. The situation at the district level can be a paradox; leadership without vision don't typically recruit skilled leaders. And if they don't respect vision, they aren't likely to replace themselves with visionary substitutes. There are many successful councils like Cburkhardt's out there, but they are lucky because there aren't that many visionaries like Cburkhardt in high positions. Barry

Ask the organizer (might not be the Scout shop) because it depends on them. They usually have a plan for delivering the gift and many don't want it wrapped so they can verify the gift. Barry

I kind of agree with Jameson, there may be more to the story. I don't agree that 5 scouts can't have a good outdoor program, they just need to find the right adult. If I were 2 hours closer, I might even look into it. I've hunted in that part of the state and Coweta sits in the middle of some of Oklahoma's most beautiful country and lakes (Green County). And it's only a few minutes from city. Ideal really. The DE, or even the SE, need to start searching for that one adult. The program that the adults gets going will bring in the scouts. Barry

That is how it is typically done in functioning troops, but I remember when we started our troop, expert resources were thin. Starting with the procedure that you want to continue with the for years down the road is the right way to go. But, if you have a tent expert on the Committee, certainly consider all your resources while developing procedure for a scout run program. I hope I'm not saying something that breaks the Scoutmaster image, but I didn't know everything when I was scoutmaster. There, I said it. No earthquakes yet. Delegate and watch. Barry