Eagledad

I used to visited a friend in the mornings a few years ago to enjoy a cup of coffee with him. I was impressed with his talking microwave and would take the opportunity to warm up my coffee just to hear it talk. My friend always looked at me strangely when I responded to the talking microwave's "HI", with my "And A Good Morning To You". One morning his wife walked in the kitchen and placed her muffin in the microwave. She made a selection on the heating choices and then pushed start. The microwave responded with "MEDIUM". I felt pretty stupid. But it's a good story during breakfasts on camp outs. I never used those inflatable sleeping pads, but they were always a long topic of discussion with the adults who did use them in how to get them comfortable. Barry

I KNEW IT! National is terrible at controlling the weather. We need to put the Girl Scouts in charge. My wife says if she were in charge, we would just have beautiful 75 degree sunny days. Barry

Yes, I've known this for many years. But one has to wonder what kind of education or experience National looks for in hiring their employees because the way they run the program doesn't fit any business model I've seen. Oh, they use polls and data to justify some of their actions, but the actions seem to be driven more by a management goal than the data. For example, First Class in the First Year was justified by data that showed scouts in the more successful troops earning their first class in one year. Well, ok, but what defines a successful troop and what criteria is common among those troops. My observations over the years are that the BSA looses more scouts in the first 6 months of a troop program than any other time in the BSA program. The issue for those scouts is the giant leap from an adult led culture to a self reliance culture. If they are scared of the dark, how in the world is the 12 year old patrol leader supposed to protect them? My data showed that a scout who stays with the troop after summer camp usually stays for at least 3 years. In my mind, a troop that keeps 70% of their new scouts for a year have a very organized program with a communication system between the scouts, their parents, and the troop youth and adult leadership. It took our troop four years to make that work. Rank development had NOTHING to do keeping our first year scouts interested, but that was Nationals approach to the problem. But as I have said for many many years, if National seriously wanted to significantly improve membership numbers, they need to scale the Pack program to the 1960's model.They don't seem to realize that a burned out cub adult who quits scouting usually takes their kids with them and doesn't come back later. Troops typically get about 30% of families that started out as Tigers or Bears. What if that 30% could get pushed to 50, 60 or 70 percent? That has to happen at the cub level. And that doesn't fix the first troop drop out rate, but that is a different problem that requires more complex solutions. If a simple engineer can see these things from just looking at membership data and observing unit programs, why can't National? Who are they? Barry

I was referring to National. And looking back, I wasn't being very scout like speaking of their intelligence. I should have said that based from past observations, they don't typical have that kind of vision. There, I feel better. Barry

I personally don't think they are that smart. But,........, no no I tried to give them some credit. I really don't think they are that smart. Well, to be open and fair, you and I have been on the opposite side of the "Aadvancement" method since you joined this forum last year to brag about how your girls were better scouts than the boys because you drilled them on advancement skills. We both have a track record on this forum of our styles of scoutmastering. I also know we adults are hard to change, so this post isn't really pointed at you as much as it is for new scout leaders who haven't been set in their ways yet. Flexibility is OK I guess. But most of us old-timers (I know you think of yourself as an old-timer too) have experienced the difference between the youth scouts ambition for scouting and the adult scouters ambition for scouting. And the first red flag for unbalanced flexibility by the adults is "Advancement". Makes sense when you think about it, the ambition of adults by their nature is self centered. It's a primal instinctive drive for self survival. However, the primal instinct of youth on the other hand is playing games with the herd. Playing games is how youth learn the skills they will use as adults to survive. The herd mentality is natures way of protecting the individual youth until they mature enough to protect themselves. Add that Advancement is easy for adults because they only have to read a list of requirements to set their scouting program forward into motion. Camping, even before the Covid is harder and more complex for new adult leaders. Pushing a scout to learn a knot is a lot easier than organizing youth to plan a campout. But, we have to remember that Advancement is only one of Eight Methods. Are you dividing your balance and flexibility into Eight parts. Let's think, how can we get the scouts to practice Patrol Method while shuttered at home? All that is to say, adults need to think like a youth playing games with their herd. Use your flexibility and balance to get the scouts to learn skills by games at home to prepare them for real life while camping. Give them task that will prepare them for the next campout. Give them a theme and some fun skills to practice like planning menus and cooking or ......... Not to get signed off at home, but to prepare them for having fun on the campout, and then getting signed off. Shift the adult drive of using the Stature as motivation and instead use games to prepare them for their out doors adventure in the woods. You think yourself creative, so create ways for the youth scouts to do scouting at home in all the Eight Methods. Not for the sake of gaining some advantage for rank, but for the sake of getting excited about being a Scout. Leave the sign offs for the campouts with the patrol. Frankly, developing exercises for scouts to practice all Eight methods at home might be the best leadership development an adult could do for their career in scouting. Barry

I'm just not seeing it. Oh, I can understand an adult thinking wearing a badge is the coolest thing ever, but were you a scout as a youth? Given a choice of going to school or going to play soccer, what would more likely keep the a youth invested? So, let's see, Requirment 1b. Spend at least one night on a patrol or troop campout. Sleep in a tent you have helped pitch. Do we really want to sigh off on 1b without the scout doing it? How about, picking up a troop tent and dropping it off at the scout's house so he/she can practice setting it up. It doesn't get the sign off, but it does get them invested. And it's fun. Who knows, maybe several scouts can have a tent pitching race with a phone start. Barry

I like the part where he says polishing requires a little friction in teen dynamics. I experienced the same thing with high adventure crews. In fact, I believe one week on the trail is equal to 6 months of troop camping for getting through the storming stage of team development. The four stages are Forming, Storming, Norming and Performing. But, what a great life experience. I'm sure those youths parents will see a changed person. Barry

Yes, I know. This is not the first time my reverence for skills comes in conflict with those who have a demand for advancement. I'm not sure where the balance is determined, but I am sure that is dependent on the different Scoutmasters. Waiting? Waiting for what? A badge? If you were to suggest ways for scouts to learn and practice skills for the purpose of fun, your noble suggestion might have more following. I might at least read with interest. But, accelerating advancement for the sake of advancement is not a principled motivation in scouting. I could easily see the patrol videoing (Zooming?) together for learning how to build a fire, and then practicing what they learned in their fireplace or back yard barbecue with an observing consenting adult. But, that shouldn't credited to signing off a requirement, just practice for the next patrol adventure. How to keep the passion of the scouting flame lit it more about fun than knocking off a few requirements. Barry

It's another example of inept organization management. Barry

Very cool story and I think comes under the subject of scouting somewhere. "As the virus put more and more parts of the world under lockdowns and grounded airliners, it became clear that the plan to sail the students to the final port of call in Cuba and fly them home from there would need adjusting. Meijer and his staff held a meeting to plot a course out of the metaphorical storm and “decided the very best way of getting home was sailing,” he said. “With our hands at the helm.”" https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/the_americas/coronavirus-forces-dutch-students-into-long-voyage-home/2020/04/13/b862c576-7d76-11ea-84c2-0792d8591911_story.html Barry

I agree. First Class is not just a rank, it is a declaration of level of skills to safely camp in the woods without assistance. Can a person develop that level of skills without practicing those skills while camping as a patrol? Surely, there is hope that life will get back to normal and the patrol will again camp together. If not, then scouting needs to start over and redefine first class skills. I'm not even sure virtual fits in the scouting program. Barry

The feet will be wet (damp) most of the day. But good socks (or no socks at all I guess) make wet feet comfortable because they get air to the skin. I can't imagine no socks, but I can see if the boots are well broken-in with bare feet, that might work. Interesting. Barry

Most of our crews get the jungle boots, but the really cheap cheap can fall apart in a weeks time. Which reminds me, DUCT TAPE. Just consider that your boots will be wet 100% of the trip. So, either look for shoes that you don't mind trashing at the end of the trip, or a decent pair of boots/shoes that are designed not to hold any water like river/fishing/adventure hiking, and so on. I tried the cheap route my first couple of trips with jungle boots, then I spent money on a good pair of river shoes that I still wear around 15 years later. Really the key to being comfortable in Northern Teir is a good pair of non-cotton hiking socks over thin liners. Take three pairs to prevent the blisters. One pair for wearing that day, one pair to dry out during the night and the 3rd pair as a back up in case of rain. My personal favorite is smartwool hiking socks and thin ski liner socks. There are other good brands. You will spend more time in the canoe than portaging, but if you don't get the right socks, your feet will feel miserable from being wet the whole time. The combination of liners and non-cotton wool types socks repeal the water away from your skin. On the other side, many of the portages are simi-rough terrain carrying heavy gear, so the hiking socks combined with liners also prevent blisters. Barry

I didn't know we were breaking from Badon Powell's scouts. But then, the BSA program does many things different, like electing the Patrol Leader instead of the SM appointing one for as long as the SM desired. While I was a scout, to do anything less raising the scout sign (half salute) where the upper arm is parallel to the ground and the lower arm is strait up was being out of uniform. As a scoutmaster, I occasionally reminded scouts not to be lazy and always position their the Scout Sign properly. I wanted their action to be as automatic to them for the rest of their lives as it is for me. As for the scout left hand shake, I think that just faded away as a result of being un-natural and clumsy. Although we did perform the left hand hand shake while I was a scout, it was always awkward with a giggle generally following. It wasn't practiced at all by the time I was an adult leader. Google Norman Rockwell Scouts and you will find paintings of BSA Scouts saluting and half saluting in the same tradition scouts are taught today. Of course, if some folks here get their way and change the uniform to t-shirts like the GSUSA, I guess the sign can drop to reflect the new BSA. Barry

Strangely, I find NOT touching my face more challenging than I would have thought. A doctor said on TV the other day that if a mask does nothing else, it keeps you from touching your face. Barry

I've been thinking about your situation, qwazse. My oldest son once ask if my life was easier with all the kids out of the house. I said, while a young man I always thought the stress of worrying about my kids would fade as they ventured into their adult lives. But, I found that as he and his siblings grew older, their problems were more significant and my anxiousness more abundant. Grand-parenting requires big shoulders. Peace and Healing for your family, Amen. Barry

Well there you go, a family activity. These are the ideas that needs to spread. Barry

This is a great idea. There was an expert yesterday explaining that humans are social by nature and that we can't stand long periods of time without socializing. He felt our government would have to do something to satisfy that biological need. But, I agree with yknot that humans have gone thousands of years without starving for group socializing because they satisfied that need through family. And I think something valuable will came from this thing for our culture because I watched numbers of families going for walks and riding bikes together all this weekend. I haven't seen that in years. As a religious person, I have been questioning where God's nature will come out of this and seeing these families was a sign of hope for me. Family. That's me of course, but it's comforting in a time of stress. Barry

I wasn't thinking right or wrong, I was thinking that scouting is way way down on a families priority list. They can call a meeting, but even in the best conditions, who would come. Barry

I guess I don't understand; who wants to go to meetings? Barry

I believe our scouts would have a full satisfying scouting experience without summer camp. But, our average 16 year old scouts have attended at least 5 summer camps. And maybe that is indicative of our troop program because we add more program within our summer camp program. Add that our scouts are pretty much on their own with the adults in a separate camp site, summer camp is a great experience. But I learned as a volunteer at the district and council levels that there are as many approaches to running a scout unit as there are adult leaders. If, units are given full autonomy for their program, then for better or more often worse, the unit culture tends to represent the personality of the the unit leader. I would be curious to hear what district has to say of this unit. Barry

I have one that is warning me that this site has political content. I’m curious what it’s marketing, but I don’t want to select it. I’ll trade it for lingerie or golf balls. Barry

As someone who has been involved at several levels of rechartering and developing membership data, I would be interested in learning how rechartering is the greatest cause of membership losses than anything else. While I agree the current process is inefficient and could be improved, my experience is that rechartering inflates the membership data. Barry

It's a lot of fun and A LOT of work. The main difference is logistics of food. How much to buy, how much it will cost, when to purchase it, where to store it and how to distribute it. It's not reasonable to think a Patrol can manage a weeks worth of food. You will need a mature Quartermaster Corp. The other challenge is program and who will run it. We found that just about every adult is needed as a resource. The scouts lead the planning, with equal help from adult assistants. Lots of planning meetings with a lot of action items. Even Woodbadge spends several months planning and they have instructions. I will say that planning and running such a thing matured our scouts and the boy run program more than any other activity we did over the years. You will have a different troop after you are finished. Everyone will also be exhausted. Barry

Contact the DE and ask for advice. I can't imagine they won't extend the time, but there might be a process that should be followed. Also, your scout might be the reason they come up with policies for this problem now, which is going to catch a lot of scouts in the same boat. Barry