Eagledad

Very narrow and challenging. Challenging enough to drive my wife to quit and take my daughter out the GSUSA. More often than not, BSA parents don't take this stuff very well. I find that discussions with older scouts is very productive when they don't feel challenged. They don't want any of the scouts to be categorized as a pervert or predictor. They just need some guidelance sometimes as to where the line is drawn. Barry

I'm saying the broad statement without detail doesn't make sense.

My experienced opinion is that the 50% youth sex abuse statement doesn't make sense. And any suggestion to changing the program based on that statement is absurd.. Barry

Patrol Method has proven itself over 100 years all over the world. To break that up because of a very broad blanket statement that that 50% of the BSA abuse cases are from youth would be ridiculous. Barry

Data. Proof. It's not minimalizing, it's rationalizing. To my families frustration, I'm a black and white person. Some of us have many years experience at many levels of scouting. Broad statements that don't make sense against experience requires details before tearing apart a proven program just to appease cynics. Barry

That is why the knee jerk Zero Tolerance of youth sex abuse reaction from the poster yesterday is so concerning. Dividing the age groups doesn't approach fixing the problem, and how do we keep friends having curious private discussions alone in their tents? Discussion is getting a little crazy. Barry

An older scout tenting with a younger scout would be a red flag that would require further discussion, not so much because of a predatory behavior, but because it is so rare, something isn't normal. 99.9 percent of scouts tent with their friends. I certainly would have the discussion. Barry

The youth numbers could use some specifics also. We had mother/leader overhear a tent of scouts talking about sex. She filed on that. We investigated and found the tent had four scouts the same age who had all been close friends (her son was one of them) since Tigers. It was nothing more than curious sex talk. Mom felt here son was a victim. Not to say that youth sex abuse doesn't happen, we have had a couple of pretty bad scandal's of youth sex abuse in our state high schools, partially in sports.. But, I have also heard some edgy discussions from tents full of scouts on high adventure trips where we are forced to set up tents next to each other. Interestingly my wife had the same experience with girls in the the GSUSA. Innocent in the nature of the situation, but eye opening for parents/adults. My wife asked if there was anything she was supposed to do, and the leadership told her to call the police. Really? She didn't But, I can certainly see why there might appear to be so many sex abuse claims without further investigation. That's the problem I have had with this whole thing. I was accused in other posts of not having any experience with the data being used here. True, nobody here does. But i have experience with situations that were filed under the category of abuse that wouldn't come under the sex abuse most folks are thinking in these discussions. I would really like to know the real numbers. Barry

Then you really don't know. The future of Youth spending the night with other youth is going to be politically incorrect. And, anyone who was a scout should be shunned for being an abuser. Barry

Is this really a problem? What percent of scouts were abused? OK, give me some details of how those abuses occurred. You can't fix it if you don't know the problem. Ironic really. During the gay debates, nobody wanted to discuss sex abuse risks because they wanted gay youth in scouts really bad. Activist say youth know their sexual desire by the age of six. Is there a safe age to camp with other youth? The discussion crossed a line away from scouting. Now its about youth overnight stays with other youth. Is shutting down overnight sleep overs healthy for society? Will our grandkids know what a pillow fight was?

Ah, teenage cub scouts. That's healthy for the culture. Adults will never grow up. Barry

LOL, really! Please expand. Barry

Another nail in the Patrol Method coffin. Patrol Method works best with mature role models. Prepubescent scout are not mature enough for a mature program. Barry

My posts aren't being posted, so who knows what we will see. Bending to culture will always be social activism to somebody. The Oath and Law are moral principles to guide right decisions. Using Oath and Law as a weapon is not a right decision. Barry

Really! The BSA policies was part of the culture then as much as gays and girls are part of the culture now. Using the Oath and Law in a broad brush is a two edge sword. One has to respect the Oath and Law in their personal character to have any integrity for using them to attack whole organizations out of context. Barry

Your kidding right! The Catholic issue was on the news almost every day. TV shows and light night comedians hammered on it. Folks may not of knew of an incident personally, but they certainly knew about the issue. I don't see it being the same. Barry

How much of the article would change if they didn't wear the uniform?

I've mentioned before on this forum that the few folks I've talked to personally about this subject is they don't believe the abuse is substantial. It's not hardly even in the media. We are surrounded by media reports almost weekly of sexual abuse in our schools, government, family and so forth. But, most folks can't think of a single incidence from in scouting. In fact, most parents will say when it comes to sexual abuse, Scouting is a safe place. There are a few folks here who are passionately involved, but you can see even in this forum that there isn't much of an audience who are appalled at the BSA in general. And a couple of the louder folks here were BSA haters even before the bankruptcy started ramping up. So, I believe the pragmatic answer to the bankruptcy is we have to wait it out. As for the sexual abuse, we have to do a better job protecting scouts. Barry

Hmm, I'm trying to understand why the girls are wearing BSA uniforms. Something isn't right. Barry

Oh, I certainly agree. A mentor who I give the most credit for my style of Scoutmastering quit scouting when he realized that he was more of a babysitter of their new Venturing unit than advisor. He got no sleep even with his tent was set up between the Venturing tents. Barry

There are people running around who were the result of a BSA campout. I've wondered if that was the reason behind restricting scouts from camping without adults. Barry.

I admit I have little tolerance for hypocrisy. Barry.

Wait a minute. That is hypocritical considering you gave me numerous copious and indiscriminate downvotes. You didn't see me complain. Barry

And if some here have their way, more will be required for YP. Barry