Eagle92

Frank, The OA changed their election policy a few years back so that a scout can vote for as many people they feel worthy. It is theorectical that all 11 could get in.

HICO, While there is a standard procedure that should be followed, unfortunately the "popularity contests" do appear. I blame part of the problem on the lodge/and or election team. They really need to do a better job of stating that the it is not a popularity contest, but one which is who the best individuals who live up to the Scout Oath and Law. I've used the phrase, and trained my ETs toas well, "who would you want ona backpakcing trip gone wrong?'

While I understand the CC's position in referecne to his mother, the EBOR appeal is not rocket science and the decision should have been made last nite at the meeting. I think it is now time to formally appeal to the district/council level. I thinking that they are stonewalling you.

Yepo good luck tonite. pl;ease keep us posted

Hico, 4th ed. is OK, good info on lots of different topics, but it's basic info. Stuff you'ld find in a MBP if you ask me BUt it has backp[acking, kayakaing, Horsemanship, sailing. Still a good resource, but I prefer 2nd edition. Then again the 2nd ed. was a gift I got pre-cub scout and have amazed me since I first got it, so I may be biased.

GWD, Good for you in trying to NOT get involved too much in your son's project. catching errors after receivign them IMHO is not getting involved. Think about it, if you knew Scout Smuckatella had plans to do this project and he came to you for advice, would you give it? If Smuckatella sent out an email with wrong info from his plans, wouldn't you send him somethingabout the cinfusion? Again Good for you for NOT getting to involved. You are doing OK.

WAIT ONE MINUTE! you said "the CC was one of the first people to come to me with problems." It's my understanding that the CC can fire the SM. Usually they do so AFTER discussing the situation with the COR and/or IH, but the CC can do the firing. As for who the next SM will be, that's a good point. You need someone in place before anything is done ot the SM.

Stosh, The term 'romance" is a misnomer in that it is going back to, I believe, the Victorian era's defination of the term. Not to be confused with the current defination, as in the ditzy romance books ladies like with Fabio ont he cover. if I am not mistaken, soem of those line drawings were by BP himself.

I myslef miss the romance of scouting. I commented about that on myscouting. Hopefully the new handbook coming out in June will reinstill some of that since they stated that they will be bringing back some of the older material from past editions.

Concur with getting training outsdie the district, and council if possible. My district is in a weird location in that 2 other councils have their offices closer than the council 1 am in. SO if you are in that situation, check out he other council's info. As for books. 1) Intro to Outdoor leadership Skills. yeah it's the training syllabus, but it is handy/ 2) the 3 Volumes of Programs Helps and the Troop Resource Book. Better still if you can find it is the old Woods Wisdom Book. They broke WW into 4 books. 3) 2nd ed. of the Scout FieldBook. haven't read the 1st or 3rd, but compared to the 4th ed. I like the 2nd better.

BP, Thanks for the heads up. This is interesting in that I've not heard a thing about the new traiing from council yet. Then again, we don't have a training chair for the district.

Sorry I got cut off, that pesky thing called a job you know. 3) GET BUY IN FOR YOUR PLAN. Not only from the scouts, but also the parents. if you don't get buy in for the plan, then no matter what yuou do or say, it aint happening. 4)talk about succession planning. If it is known that in 18 months, he's history, then I would try to recruit a replacement NOW. Once hook line and sinker, then get them to training ASAP. As some have mentioned, he is doing something right, i.e. attending PLC,etc. It may be alittle different than what you went through, but Scotuing has changed over the years, even as little as 7 years ago. As a was saying, again lots of great advice. I will add that being an SM is an AWESOME responsibility, one that is not to be takely lightly. It is one of the most important positions. The SM is the one that molds the troop, trains and inspires the Jr. leaders, and is ultimately responsible to teh committee for program. A good SM can make or break a troop. Since it is known that he will be gone in 2 years, I would confirm it, and if true talk about succession planing NOW as it is never too early. Heck the troop that my son's pack feeds into has already said they want me in 6 years as SM, and that is freaking me out!

Lots of good advice here. Understand your loyalty to the unit, it is hard seeing something that you put alot of energy and was a part of fall apart. I know. I still have contact with my old troop, and since Katrina they've only had about 10-12 active. This from a time when we had 4 patrols of 8-10 each. here is my $.02 worth. 1) have a leadership meeting, i.e. SM and all ASMs and discuss what needs to be done. I would also invite the UC. DEVELOP A PLAN OF ACTION TO IMPROVE THE TROOP WITH DETAILS TO MAKE IT YOUTH RUN. 2) Make sure everyone is Trained and know what resources are out there. There are hundreds of things out there to help the troop. Again lots of great advice. I will add that being an SM is an AWESOME responsibility, one that is not to be takely ligtly. It is one of the most important positions.

Well the new scouts in my old troop knew to expect some shenanigans Nothing bad was intended, and the new guys did get the chance to get back at the odler ones, heck some of the older ones who were part of the hijinks on the younger ones also got themselves as well. especially when talk went ot pranks in the past. I think that whoever posted some rules had a good idea. That does help and makes sure no one gets out of line. As for me, yep I was a victim of the shoreline. I also got back at the SPL by tricking him into letting me use the camp phone to call home

In reference to CPR Professional offered by ARC, will the AHA equivelent, Basic Life Support for the Healthcare Provider work? Gotta know if I should offer that class so that folks can get BSA Lifeguard now

This brings back memories. I was a "victim" of the shore line one. Knew what is was, but went straight to the waterfront with a bucket, and got 50 feet of shoreline. They never said how wide it had to be, just 50' of it As for the Royal Order of Siam, a group of guys at PDL-1 did that to the pros who were never part of Scouting for the camping portion. The national folks chewed everyone who knew that skit a new one for that joke. Most of the folks involved had a good laugh, but two or three were ticked.

GERN, Make sure he gets that WSI and keeps it current. Semiprivate and private swim lessons are where the money is at! Even with the college pool taking their cut, I had friends make their rent and grocery money, or beer money as the case may be, doing 4-6 hours a week in private lessons while I was in college! As for the Aquatics Supervision Courses do training for troop work ( Paddle Craft and Water Rescue ) are they online or do I need to pay a visit to camp to get these? Also when do they go into effect? i am supposed to be teaching basic canoeing next month.

I doubt YMCA is out since I get an occasional letter trying to get me to renew my certification still. The problem with reciprocity between BSA lifeguard and both ARC and YMCA is that BSA Lifeguard IS more advanced. ARC and YMCA do NOT cover lakes and waterfronts. They do NOT cover the hand to hand combat, just suck tuck and duck. NO releases, NO front head hold with Body scissors, NO rear headhold with body scissors, and NO double drownings. Also ARC and YMCA do NOT cover row boats, canoes or two man rescues. They emphasis the "go with support" using rescue tubes and buoys. OSrry I cannot go into more details, it's been a while and my books got lost in my latest move. TRUST ME ON THIS ONE I was a YMCA Lifeguard Instructor and BSA Lifeguard. I was certified as an instructor just before YMCA made the changes, and had to be "recertified" less than nine months later with the new format came out. I complained to national YMCA about some of the changes and how it will hurt someone. BSA may not get the national respect they deserve, but there are places who will accept it. AND it is the harder program. Now in reference to what will get you a job, do what you have to. But there is a world of difference between the programs

EMB, Unfortunately the way my current council uses the YAA, it is an academic award. Info is given to every HS in the council for them to recommend the best well rounded person for the award, so they give it to the best student. Apparently oneof the Exec brd. memberr got upset at a HS awards ceremony with the emphasis on sports and not academics. He pushed YAA ont he council as abn academic awards program, got sponsors for scholarships (don't know if they still do it or not)and it turned into a big deal in this council. Heck 2 national YAA recipients came form this council and were in SCOUTING in 96 and 98.

Actually YMCA will not accept ARC lifeguard certification, at least when I was teaching. While ARC is the more commonly accepted course, it's becasue they are offered more. But IME most places recognize either one. YMCA did do a few things differently. It's kinda of funny b/c when I started teaching YMCA they used the vicegrip then changed to in place lock, i.e. arms lockign the head into position. ARC Went from the inplace lock to vicegrip, basically both organizations reveresed their positons on spinal injuries. Yep both ARC and YMCA did away with the hand to hand, BSA still keeps it. That's why I'ld let a few BSA 'rejects" protect me than some folks i've seen certified via YMCA, or ARC for that matter. Also in reference to BSA certification, 1) there are some places that do accept BSA Lifeguard. Mostly camps and lakes faciltiies. 2) If you can pass BSA Lifeguard, the other courses are a piece of cake.

i've been told it's cheaper to buy the book and take it to Staples or Office depot and have it spiralbound there. Just don't buy a new BS handbook yet as the new ones will come out in JUNE. Thinking about it, did they say it's a new edition that is coming out? They may be replacing all the books at one time.

Back when I was a lifeguard isntructor for YMCA, there was no reciprocity agreement. This was when YMCA still taught the "hand to hand combat" stuff To the best of my knowledge, both ARC and YMCA took out a bunch of the releases, and the double drowning info that BSA still practices. Plus BSA still requires knowledge of row boats and canoes, again to the best of my knowledge. Gern if son is ARC lifeguard, a good portion of BSA will be review. But there is alot more to BSA Lifeguard. Heck I saw a few kids fail BSA lifeguard that I would trust over people who passed YMCA lifeguard. BSA is the toughest program of the three.

depending upon the council, the Young American Award may be what the council uses to recognize academic excellence. SELAC doesn't do it that way, but some do.

Just let the scout come up with the ideas. Don't woryy about easy, worry about having the youth come up with it, organizing it, and doing it. I would think a recycling awareness program would eb a good one. just make sure others are involved. Pierre Part eh? I had a few guys from PP in my canoeing class at S2R a few years back. It was fun reminding them that a canoe is not a pirogue.

Another thing about mandatory training, beside making sure SCOUTNET has the correct info in it, is to offer more than just face to face training. Do offer self-study courses with online tests. Do offer more online courses. Heck do online courses and then have the person contact their trainer to sign of the skills like AHA does with CPR. Allow challenges fo those with the skills and knowledge already Some districts have no problem with trainers. other are begging for a training chair. Do not penalize the units for a district/council problem.