Eagle92

OK the pack needs to decide A) can they afford to lose a Webelos Leader or B) Can they hold out until the son crosses over to Boy Scouts. If they can hold out, that may be the best way out, with ample warning to whatever troop the son joins. If the problem needs to be solved immediately, the someone in the PACK needs to grab the bull by the horns.

ALRRIGHT Keep up the great work of motivating those Venturers.Glad to hear they have agood reputationon a well known scout skill.

As an UC you have no authority to do anything as it is a CO matter. NOW if the CM, CC, COR, etc want to remove the person and/or family, then you can give advice. Basically a unit can refund the remaining registration fee and pack/den dues, fill out the transfer paperwork (giving a COPY to the CS or parent), or better yet a copy of their SCOUTNET records, double checking to make sure the SCOUTNET records and Pack records coincide, and write a letter stating WHY you are removing hte individual from the charter, sending a copy to the scout office. Before anything happens though the PACK leaders need to #1 make sure they want to do this as it WILL stir up a hornets nest and leave bad feelings #2 have the support of the COR & IH since they ultimately own the Pack, and #3 make sure the DE is informed as a courtesy because the DE will be getting a late night phone call from this parent. Had to deal with a removal of a leader, so I been there, done that, lost the hearing from an outraged volunteer. EDITED: the COR can overrule the decision to remove the family from the unit over everyone EXCEPT the IH. And then the IH's word IS the final word on the matter, so if the PAck wants to do this, then the IH needs to be on board.(This message has been edited by eagle92)

pack said "I have seen leaders at summer camp with electric fans and televisions. GAD!!! Makes me want to do mischief somehow. " You aint kidding. I went camping with a CS pack this weekend, and there were fans and what not in abundance. It was only 88 degrees for crying out loud.

In reference to ceremonies, the only time I've heard music is when the folks are coming into and out of the ceremony. Flute music is good, but I prefer the Drum with some singers

How many of these adults are trained, ie. YP, fast start, position, iols, etc.? if they've doen any type of training they would know better. I have mixed emotions on disolving the VP. I've seen them work and keep interested older scouts involved. I think the thorns and roses needs to be done first with the VP,taking notes, but without having names recorded. that way there is some anominity and the scouts won't be between a rock and a hard plac ewith the parents. Then with ALL participants need to have a thorns and roses session. The notes should be read aloud, so that they are expressed in case the youth don't want to confront their parents. IF another VP trip is tried, and I hope it is, a clear set of rules needs to be made before the trip informing everyone of their roles. I would organize 2 groups, adults only and the VP with NO adults. As a concession to the adults, I would allow cell phones or radios for communication. have them start 30 minutes apart, knowing scouts their will easily outpace the adults. make the adutls work as a patrol to keep them occupied. it sounds as if the ASM needs to practice what I call the "All Bundy Approach to Scoutmastering." He needs a camp chair, a cup of coffee, and is only allowed to get out of his chair for A) another cup of coffe, B) calls of nature C) Sleeping, and D) Life or death situtations. As a good friend of mine told me, "If no one is dead or goign to the hospital, it's all good."

From the April 2nd 2009 Training Update found here: http://community.scouting.org/groups/national_volunteer_development_training/media/p/8696.aspx -The centennial edition (12th) of the Boy Scout Handbook will be available in July, 2009. It will feature a mixture of parts of many of the early hand books with a 21st century flair. The handbook features chapters on Leadership and Leave No Trace, which both are firsts. There will be a supplemental 100 year timeline book with the first printing and a mini-book with the rank requirements that is pockets size. A website will provide in-depth information on many subjects.

Why couldn't they make the CS uniform simple. All CS (Tigers, Wolves, Bears, and Webelos) wear blue and yellow socks, blue shorts/pants, blue belt, blue shirt, and a colored necker depending upon program lever (those neckers do help on outings) and a blue and yellow hat for the first three years, repalced by an all blue hat for the last two years for Webelos. Webelos Still have the option of going to the BS uniform with the CS trimmings, i.e. blue loops, Web. necker, tricolors, etc.

I just want to know where a sonic screwdriver fall under G2SS.

This was announced on the MYSCOUTING.ORG site under the national training thread in the April 2009 update that was posted. The only thing is that the update said it will come out in JUNE. HOPEFULLY it will not be chock full of errors like the Insignia Guide.

This will sound crazy, but if I could afford to give more to FOS, I would in a heartbeat. Unfortunately I will be downgrading b/c #1 the economy is hurting the finances and #2 with Oldest son joining June 1, I will need to budget both of us at CS events. My council is in a unique position. We got a new SE who is not only a "program freak," he is also a local, having grown up in a pack and troop in the council, going to summer camp at one council camp, and staffing the second council camp when it took over summer camp duties. So this is a homecoming for him, and his goal is to revitalize the council. Much needed and he is in the process of implementing his ideas. The #1 reason is purely selfish: he is trying to get improvements made at the original council camp, which is in my district and has been neglected for at least 15 years, if not longer. the cmap is beautiful, perfect for small unit camping, and I had the pleasure of taking my oldest there this weekend with the pack he's joining in June. #2 is that he is putting an emphasis on quality program. he share my philosophy in that if you have an awesome program, they will come. #3 he is trying to get funds to provide more camperships. As one who has received a campership once, I knwo how important that is, and I want another scout to have the same opportunity.

UNIT stands for "UNified Intelligence Taskforce formerly known as the United Nations Intelligence Task force, a fictional military organisation from the British science fiction television series Doctor Who." OH wait in refernce to the BSA The term unit is the overall term for Cub Scout packs, Boy Scout troops, Varsity Scout teams, Venturing Crews, and Sea Scout ships. Sorry couldn't help myself with the Doctor Who reference.

Also when I tried to find the new tan and red unit numbers on Scout Stuff, the could not be found. Now I was told a new tan and red is also coming out, but again nothing on Scotu Stuff.

I can tell you why I stayeda s long as I did, and at times regret stepping down as a pro. The comraderie I had with my volunteers was awesome, as they would do just about anythign I asked. One example was that I was short one unit, but knew a pack that was about to graduate some webelos and wanted to start a new troop. I was able to get them to complete the paperwork completed and turned in because of the relationship I had with the vols. I also loved workign with the district committee and seeing them develope some great programs for our youth. I always loved going to an activity, walking around and talkign to scouts, parents, and leaders. If it wasn't for the council leadership at the time, I would have stayed around. Heck I did the 6 month rule and went on to work in supply, b/c I loved scouting and wanted to make a difference.

EMB, Funnys story, I knew of a SPL/Venture patrol member (way it worked in troop was that SPL could do Venture Crew/patrol activities when they were on their own) thought that they could do Venturing adavancement. When he found out they couldn't, he turned the Venture patrol into a venturing crew, got the entire venture patrol to sign on as Venturers, as well as a few of the 18-20 Y.O. ASMs, and got the crew going. In some aspects the unit looked like the 1950s model with the Venturing Crew wearing the green and grey at troop meetings, doing the isntruction and mentoring to the younger scouts, and then plannign their stuff during patrol corners.

I would have to clarify it a bit more. Those in blue CS uniforms, yellow and blue female CS leader uniforms, and Venturers wear the red and whites. Those in in tan shirts wear tan and green, and Sea Scouts don't wear any per national policy.

Very tricky situation. If this was at a scout event, then the obvious answer would be to remove him. If this wasn't a scout event, then it gets tricky. Definately talk to CC,COR, and/or IH about the situation. A call to teh SE may be needed as well. I do know that 10 years ago DUI was not a dismissable offense, had a DFS caught over the limit and he still had a job. I understand Packsaddle's response, lost a friend to a drunk driver when she was 18 and had her life in front of her. But I also met one guy who luckily didn't hurt anyone but himself. He was left paralized and his entire purpose inliving is to tell people the evils of drinking and driving.

Also just noticed that there is NO mention of tan and red numbers for the female leaders.

Cimmarron, When did this PDF come out as it must have came out within the past 3 weeks. I say that because I called a national scout shop about this and they knew nothing about the red and tan numbers. Also Why are the CS leaders' numbers tan and red, but the Webs wear tan and green? See page 4 on that one. So council shops and distributorships will have to carry yet another 10 items of inventory! Why couldn't they leave well enough alone. I am, I'm keeping the tan and green numbers on my new shirt.

ScoutNut Prior to Venturing coming out in August 1998, the name of the subunit of a troop that replaced the Leadership Corps was called a Venture Crew. They wore the same uniform as a Scout, with the tan Venture strip aboce the BSA strip. When Venturing came out, the term Venture Crew was replaced with Venture Patrol and traditional Exploring Posts became Venturing Crews, while career oriented posts remained. That's why EMB and some other Venturing leaders get upset when some of us old fogeys call VENTURING crews VENTURE crews. And yes national was made aware of how confusing it could get prior to Venturing splitting off of Exploring as a bunch of us told the national Venturing director about the oncoming confusion when we met him in may of 1998 at PDL. As for the maroon shirt and Venturing, I am not talking about the maroon, green and white shirt with the Venturing Logo. I am talking about the all maroon polo with the universal emblem and the word VENTURE underneath. Again they were not very popular, but few folks have them.

Well the new handbook comes out in June. Supposedly sections from previous editions are placed back into the HB so that it is truly a 'centennial' edition. I hope they bring back some of the artwork, the basic scouting skills, and some of the 'romance" of scouting, i.e. the codes of chilvarly (sp) the Athenians, etc.

Again all I have to say is; YOU LUCKY DOG !

Eamon, Problem is that with the new WB21C Cub Scout leader and Venturing Leaders who don't do SM and SM Specifics and IOLS. So some folks get the patrol method for the first time at WB. And since WB is still considered by many as the epitome of training for Scouting, I've seen some folks NOT go through SM/ASM Specifics or IOLS becasue they are considered fully Trained by going through WB. Grant you I have not been through either WB course, only the scout versions (Brownsea 22 and JLT) of the old course. but from what I've been told by very respected WB SMs of both courses, is that WB has lost some of the basic scouting skills and focuses more on leadership management. Grant you that is important, but one of thet things i've learned is to lead by example. Scouters need to know and master these scouting skills. While we may not be experts in everything, we need to know the basics. Also with the creation of Powderhorn, my take is that Powderhorn is where the Outing in Scouting and patrol method really come into play as it is advertised for both Venturing leaders and Scout leaders now. Further that new post WB course Philmont came up with and is shown in the recent SCOUTING also gives the impression that patrol method and the Outing in Scouting comes later. Again these are my impressions. I do plan on taking WB when I can, but I am more interested in Powderhorn at this time.

Mike forgot to mention the maroon VENTURE activity shirt for scouts in Venture Crews now called Venture Patrols. These items were not very popular, but I got the shorts, red shirt, and maroon shirt as an present from one of my Eagles. Before these items were discontinued, one of the local distributers got tired of having them and not selling them, So he gave a few away to his staff, of which my friend was one, and sold them at cost to get them out of his inventory. And still he couldn't get rid of all of them.

Johnny, Welcome to teh forums. This has been a PITA question. the official source for all unifroming questions, is the Insignia Guide, and is full of errors. Accoring to a source at a national scout shop, they written portions of the Guide still have Webs and Cub leaders in the ODL uniforms. BUT the pics accompaning the text show the new uniforms. Also the Inspection Sheet for Web show the ODL uniform, but the info sheet telling what a Web needs shows the the centennial uniform. Long story short, the editor of the Guide either A) didn't knwo what they were doing and the BSA's programs and uniforms, B) had this laid on him at the last minute so the Guide wasa rush job, C) tried to cut and paste sections of the old guide to make sure the Guide came out by the March deadline (months after the new uniforms came out BTW), or D) All the above. This is what I was told by my national source. If you are a Cub leader wearing the Centennial, you wear the tan and green numbers and trained strip. If you are wearing an tan and green ODL uniform, you can either wear the red number and old trained strip, or tan and green numbers with the new trained strip. If you are wearing the Yellow and Blue ladies uniform, then you still wear the red numbers and either the old khaki and red trained strip, or the new, smaller knaki and red trained strip that just came out within the past month.. To paraphrase that "wascally wabbit" Buggs Bunny, "Confusing isn't it."