Eagle92

Andee, 1) Forgot to shout at you 'WELCOME TO THE FORUMS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! 2) JTE and its predecessors are tools to make sure a program is viable. I personally like JTE requirements over previous ones b/c they are more program oriented than in the past. BUT they can be a major PITB to do the math, or if the council's records on you are incorrect, i.e. training records messed up, missing leaders on the charter after several attemts to rectify, scouts not being removed form the charter after several attempts, etc. 3) My opinion is that if you want to show the folks what you got planned fro recruiting, hand out calendars, bring photos, and other props. This is esp. useful when you have 2-3 packs at the same school. 4) Good luck with recruiting.

Whatever you decide to do, make sure it's easily portable, i.e. can fit into some pocket. One thing I saw was a small notepad that was laminated and you could use a dry erase marker on it and reuse.

Sentinal, I can relate. I was suppose to staff NOAC in '96 and had to cancel last minute b/c of college bills.

Nope, nothing special, just handed out.

Notebooks, I haven't seen notebooks in use since BROWNSEA 22 and JLT. If you are trying to make sure that things get done, i.e. cook are cooking, KP folks doing KP, etc, try a bulletin board for each patrol with the duties on it. Now SPL and PLs I can see with notebooks, but not the heavy, 3 ring binders. When I did BA22 and staffed JLT, we used steno-type wirebound notebooks that fit easily in the small of your back.

TT, I'm just waiting until the youngest can hold his own on backpacking. Oldest is now using my old pack. Right now we are in the "car camp here, let's go hiking here" stage.

'732, Brotherhood Conversion has been around longer than JTE. I remember hearing about it as a "yute" way back in the day. I don't know the details of the JTE requirements, but with Quality Lodge, it was black and white: you MUST have X% Brotherhood conversion, or you will not get Quality Lodge, despite meeting all the other requirements. If memory serves, one lodge I was in missed Quality Lodge by 2 or 3 conversions. Everything else was met.

Some lodges and chapters add on to the national registration fee. I know my chapter charges $2/year to cover incidentals during the year: Candidate Info Session and Social, pool party, etc. We do fundraising as well, patch auctions and concession stands, but those funds are dedicated to camperships and local camp needs.

Anyone who serves as a director at most summer camps are required to go to NCS. Some Director spots require NCS certified folks, i.e. COPE, Swiming, Shooting Sports, etc and some do not, i.e. Chaplain, Camp Commissioner, etc. I had both times at NCS, COPE and CSDC. Just wondering where I can get another Cub Scout NCS patch.

Pack, With all due respect, you are thinking like a Cub Scout leader. Not knocking you, especially since I am one too, but as Green Bar Bill said, " Train them, trust them, LET THEM LEAD!" (I beleive the emphasis is in the original, sorry don't have the bookin front of me.) Boy Scout and Venturers can do just find making major purchases if you let them. Heck I know in one instance they did a better job than an adult. My troop as a youth was growing. While we needed new tents and other gear, and the QM spent some time doing the research and finding a deal. Everything was sent to the committee to buy. When the order went to the treasurer, they found "a deal" on some disncontinued tents that was not what we wanted. Needless to say we were disappointed when we got the tents, especially since 1/2 broke on the first camp out, and the otehr 1/2 broke on the second one a month later. And because of the way they were designed, they were the "pop up" tents that had the poles built into the tent, once the cheap poles broke, you could not repair them. We ended up having to order the original tents we wanted anyway, and wasted money of the "deal."(This message has been edited by eagle92)

IMK, With no disrespect, but you may never know when an episode may hit. One of my HS teachers had a flashback in the school cafeteria when a plate dropped. One of the most reserved, polite teachers I know, he taught theology BTW, became one of the most foulmouthed and vicious people because he was back in 'Nam under heavy attack for a moment. Luckily another teacher who was a vet, and worked with the flashback teacher in the past, was outside the cafeteria and was able to get the situation under control. Still, I do not see anxiety disorders as a problem. As for me, the trip I missed and regret was the district camporee that if I attended, I would have been Tapped Out as a candidate into the OA. That was the last year Tap Outs were officially permitted.

One thing I wish they would remove from the form, and that is the Social Security number request. National states that "may be required by medical facilities for treatment" which is not true. If it is an emergency, they MUST treat you, irregardless of a SSN or not. That is EMTALA law. Now if it is a non-emergency, then yes they can request it for billing pruposes. But how often does a scout go in for non-emergency care during a scouting event, i.e. a scheduled surgery?

All the advice is spot on. I've found it's hard, very, very, VERY hard fro former Cub Scout leaders to make the transition to Boy Scout Leader. Not knocking Cub leaders, heck I am one, but after 2,3,5 years of being trained to run meetings and do things, it is an adjustment to sit back and say to one of your scouts "Have you asked yout patrol leader?" As others stated, 1) Get trained in SM Specific and Intro to Outdoor Leadership Skills. Unlike what the IOLS syllabus suggests, at least frm my interpretation of it, YOU WILL NOT BECOME AN OUTDOOR EXPERT OVER ONE WEEKEND. (emphasis) You need to spend time AWAY FROM THE SCOUTS (emph. again) and work on those skills with other adults. 2) Have a cup of coffee withthe SM or another ASM, and if possible have them mentor you. Almost as bad as a Cub Leader becoming a Scout Leader is a junior leader moving to ASM. Trust me, I had some issues makign the trasnition from youth to adult, and I was doing too much. A sit down chat, and mentoring helped out a lot. And yes I was mentored AFTER I completed training. 3) Get a copy of and read William "Green Bar Bill's" 3rd. ed. SM Handbook, volumes 1 and 2. Is it dated, yes it is. BUT the info in it is the FOUNDATION of the Scouting, THE PATROL METHOD, and is a must read. 4) Memorize the following two sentences: "Have you asked your Patrol Leader?" whenever a scout asks you something and "Have you asked your Senior Patrol? Leader" whenever a PL asks you something. 5) Get yourself a comfortable camping chair, and a large travel coffee mug. Good Luck.

In regards to leader apps to change positions, do they have to be originals, or can copies work? Ditto on new members and new leaders who are not listed. So what I am hearing is the following: 1) Bring all copies of completed applications, both youth and adult. 2) Bring copy of the pack's actual, vs. council provided, rooster to compare differences. 3) Bring Hotspot is possible. QUESTION: how many wireless computers can access a Hotspot, and does the more you computers you use use slower the download and upload times? 3) PRINT MULTIPLE COPIES OF REVISED CHARTER ( caps for MAJOR emphasis ) 4) IE only, no Mozilla. Thanks all.

Ok, I admit I have not done online rechartering so I have no idea how it works. So I am going to ask a bunch of questions directly and indirectly realted to the topic so please bear with me. I am asking because these questions because my council has stated that paper charters will only be issued by request this year, and next year will be 100% online. Since I'm the RT commish, I need to get this info out, and be prepared for questions. 1) What do you do for those units either without internet access, or dialup? Yes I'm out in the boonies and we have folks who do not have internet, or if they do it's dial up. Best example is the 4 hours it took to download the online YPT via dial up. If people do use the internet, it's usually at the library. Being that those are public computers, and internet stuff do leave trails (remember I'm a librarian and you'd be surprised at what I find on my computers: homework, TurboTax Documents, etc.) 2) How exactly does the process work? 3) How fast does it take to upload the changes onto SCOUTNET? 4) How easy is it to change people's leadership codes, i.e. a Committee Member to Cubmaster? That's a biggie for some units in my area as we have people who are listed in the wrong positions. 5) Can the council registrar overrule the changes to the online charter? Another biggie as one pack stated they did the online recharter and changes they made were not showing when they reviewed the charter during the summer. The pack removed scouts who were no longer active, submitted copies of applications of scouts and leaders that somehow were not put on the charter, and updated information on the scouts and leaders. They took it on faith that the changes were made, but when they reviewed the charter durring the summer, those changes were not made. So folks leaders are not on the charter and scouts who have earned advancement are not showing up. Thanks in advance.

Since the topic of Online rechartering is coming up, and I have a bunch of questions on the topic, I am spinning off a new thread.

Maybe I misunderstood, so let me clarify. My understanding is that Blue is friends with folks in the pack b/c the wife and kids go to the same school as some of the pack members. In normal conversations, activities on the council level get mentioned that the pack leadership is not informing everyone else about. Pack members go the CM for more info, which ticks CM off. If that is the case, then I would not stop discussing upcoming activities with my friends b/c the CM doesn't want me talking to them. Now as others mentioned, going out of the way to talk to folks and get them to attend stuff is another story.

Since my goal is to make sure that scouts have as many opportunities to have fun as possible, and since Cubs have their families tag along, and since council events tend to allow both pack and individual registration, I would keep on promoting Scouting.

The Brotherhood Hike is something that a lodge came up with and now national is promoting its use. I'm fortunate in that I met one of the guys working on it and improving it. Again the goal is have a series of reflection questions and see how the Arrowman can improve himself and live the Obligation. It's not meant to be a replacement for the testing.

I hate to say it, but probably when Brotherhood Conversion became a requirement for Honor/Quality/JTE Lodge. I know there are different ways of doing the testing. Some do a normal school test, grade it, and then work with you on the answers. That's how mine was. Others do a discussion type questioning. Brotherhood candidate talks to a Nimat about the different things he is suppose to know and works with them. Then off to the Brotherhood Hike later in the day. I like this method as it's more personal, friendly, and allows a Brotherhood candidate to explain things. Some of the terms can be difficult. An still others do the questioning on the Brotherhood Hike in addition to the reflections done on the hike. I admit I've only done 1 Brotherhood Hike since it has come out, I've been busy as an elangomat or with the chapter. And I think only the reflection questions should be asked on the hike. My advice, talk to the youth in charge and discuss this with them. and if that doesn't work, move to the adviser.

Skeptic, As your name implies, you gotta realize hearing of a 12 YO Eagle raises eyebrows, even if short of 13. I'll be honest I can count on one hand the number of under 15yo Eagles I would completely trust with my life in the backwoods if things hit the fan. It wasn't always like that, but in the past 10-15 years, unfortunately that has been the case. Now the ones I could count on my hands in the past 10-15 years, I would trust. One stayed in the troop until his family moved. I want to say he joined a Sea Scout ship after the move. One stayed involved with his troop, a crew, and OA. He just started college, so I don't plan on seeing him around, esp. since he's a walk on for AFROTC. Hopefully he can pull up his PT scores. Big shock when he didn't get an appointment to the academy, and then I talked to him. While grades and leadership were above par, the PT scores were mediocre. A third is still in, but "The Fumes" are starting to get him. Now there is a Life Scout who only needs 1 MB, service project, and EBOR, and not only would I trust him with my life, I trusted him with my son's life when he was a DC. He's 14, and I know why he slowed down a bit on the Trail to Eagle; OA. He's very active with the OA.

One reason for the different responses is that there are two categories of sellers: nationally owned Scout Shops and local distributors (local stores selling scout merchandise, local councils that own their own store, etc.) I've been told that local distributors cannot return defective stuff without paying a restocking fee. Coming from the source, I believe them as they are 110% behind Scouting, provided a service when they opened up despite opposition from the national store about 45 minutes away (yes national scout shops do have a say in these things). Because nationally owned stores don't have restock fees, have to honor national's policies, etc. it's best to return defective merchandise to them.

My $.02 worth as you described me to a point. I left my first troop and didn't tell anyone where I was going, only that I was leaving and why (I didn't like the new SM but that is a very different and very story). I didn't tell my friends where I was going. About 6 months later, the troop I was in was having some problems b/c of the new SM, and only his son remained from my group.

It depends. Some OA members may see it as a service opportunity. Some may see it as a service opportunity, and if their lodge flaps are restricted and they need so many service hours to get one, they may do it. Oh and ask you to sign their paperwork. If your OA lodge has a negative attitude towards Cubs, they may not do it. If your OA lodge has a possitive attitude towards Cubs, they may do it.

MAKE THOSE CALLS!!!!!!!!!! Yep screaming this time around, gotta keep on top of them until they come to the first activity and are hooked