Eagle92

Just a few thoughts, then off to lunch. 1) I would have a talk with the parents about the Webelos program, emphasizing advancement and the need for parents to learn how to let go. This is especially important on the Boy Scout level. Challenge I've encountered at this point is finding the time during the meeting to talk to the parents without the cubs interrupting or needign attenttion. Then again I'm with TCs at the moment. 2) if parents do sign off, do not accept signature as it hasn't been authorized. HOPEFULLY if the parent is the WDL, then they are follwoing procedures. 3) If it continues, talkt ot he parent 1 on 1.

A few comments, 1) as had been stated no Geneva back then, and I don't know British military procedures of the time. 2) He was exoneratedof any wrongdoing. 3)Unfortunately the documents are not posted for review. 4) I see this as sensationalism.

Have you thought of working staff? You would have to arrange your on travel to and from, but I bet it's cheaper than the contingent fees.

Yep it does come to priorities. However I would make a few exceptions for scouting related activities like Jambo, summer camp staff, NYLT (unless the troop is picking up the tab, THEN it's a troop activity in my book), HA activities, etc. IMHO if you take away those type of activities, you will lose the older ones. Besides is Scouting suppose to be FUN and ADVENTURE. As for extracurriculars, it IS possible to manage your time IF you are motivated and dedicated. On numerous occasions I've seen scouts coming to a meeting or outing directly from a game or meet. They brought their uniform on a hanger and changed in the bathroom. Oh did I mention my troop met on Friday nites? heck I've done it a few times myself. As for work, most employers I've encountered are willing to work with you on scheduling. While I missed most outing due to work, I was able to attend 95% of the meetings. Once I got into college and had more flexibility with work, I was not only able to go on 95% of the outing as well, but also abel to arrange to working summer camp during the week, and then come directly to my job for an 8 hour shift on Saturday evening (that was a long, but fun summer). (This message has been edited by eagle92)

John, See ya point, and it is a good one. But sometimes the scouts don't know all the members of the committee, or work directly with all the adult leaders. And also sometimes you want the best working on MBs. With my troop, unless the committee member went camping with the troop, the scouts really didn't know who was on the committee, except for COHs when those with uniforms wore them. And then we promptly forgot. Funny story, I knew the PM MBC as "Joey's dad" until approx. 3 months before my 18th B-day, when I found out I needed to go see him for PM. And I didn't know he was a VP of a bank until I went to his office for the first time, nd that was to get the paperwork signed off on the last requirements 5 days before my Bday. As to First Aid, my SM thought that that was one of those vital skills that you need the best to teach. He knew one great FA MBC who worked summer camp and advised us to take it from him. GREAT TEACHER. When he stopped workign summer camp, the cardiologist stepped up to the plate. And while he was one the committee and later and ASM, we were so youth oriented that the ASMs didn't really step in, letting the Leadership Corp do the teaching and mentoring. Most contact with adults came on the car rides to and from events.

As for my letter to Santa: Dear Santa, I've been a very good boy this year, balancing Scouting and family. Helps that oldest is now a Tiger. So for Christmass I want a MSR Whisperlite International Stove and 30 oz fuel bottle.That way when wife makes me play pack mule for family camping, I at least have a lite weight stove that can also be used at Philmont. Thank you very much Eagle92 PS can you also have national bring back knee socks. Don't care if they do away with the red tops, just bring back the kneee socks. E92

Another idea that I've heard of, never seen it though, is using a plastic knife. Again never seen it, but heard about it on here.

Stef, Welcome to the boards, abd welcome to being either a Gray Area Scouter (GAS), i.e. 18-21 so you are a yotuh for OA and vent programming, but an adult for everythign else, or an Old Fogey, i.e. anyone over 21. As for the H/W requirements, as of 1 January 2010, the new physical will go into effect, and it does have H/W requirements. LOTS of controversy on that one. But you can look it up here and on Scouting Community. HMMMMM guess my DE is going on a diet as he just became the Business director for summer camp and doesn't meet H/W requirements.

Unfortunately BP is correct in that it is an "old boys' network" once you get to that level. I saw someone with NO computer experience get "promoted" to head of SCOUTNET (which explains one reason why SCOUTNET is so screwed up) and another with a history of playing with th membership numbers get promoted to regional. And even is some thing criminal does happen, they may still keep there job. Know one guy had a DWI accident still retain his position, and get promoted to SE. Same person also caused a discrimination lawsuit against the council. BUT he had connections and was able to get promoted. Unfortunately he is still in the movement, but has been demoted to a FD again. Would love to know why he is still a professional, but bet ya it's connections.(This message has been edited by eagle92)

Pack, You'll be surprised how easy it is to find info on someone on the internet. Or if you are having difficulty, go see your local public librarian. One of the projects I did in library school was to find information that we didn't know about someone we do know. Let's just say it can be "interesting," especially if the person is a retired federal employee who worked for a certain agency. WOW. Also when my council was looking for a DE, they actually used social media and the net in the hiring process. Finally my wife, when we first met, did a literature search on me to verify who I am and what I told her was true. Luckily that Worked out I've actually had this discussion with a former poster on this site over on SC.

OGE, I think that's what my unit did to a degree. The until the time you received everything: Eagle certificate, card, and presentation kit, you were called "eagle candidiate." Some folks had their ECOH as soon as it came back from national. I waited about 4 months after the pw came back( 6 months after the EBOR) in order to have a friend and menotr at teh ECOH who was active duty attend. Friend of mine waited a full year for me to attend his ECOH. A very good friend and mentor waited 4 years to have his ECOH. He enlisted in the USAF and didn't have the ECOH until after his enlistment. He spent more time as a "Eagle Candidate" than as a Life scout.

JB, thanks for the link, VERY HELPFUL! As for my previous comments, hopefully they will not be taken as unscoutlike. That is not their intention. I know that it is rare for a pocket knife to fold onto someone while they are using it, but at the CS age I'ld rather the locking mechanism and that is where the personal preference come in. I can be a helicopter parent at times.

Sometimes it comes to personal preference. I'ld rather have a CS ask for help closing a knife, than it close on him inadvertently while working. As for my personal knives at the moment, Gerber gator, Leatherman multitool, and my new favorite, a reproduction 1800s skinning knife. It's carbon steel, razor sharp, and the OA ceremony team can use it as an accessory for their regalia. But with the exception of the multitool, wouldn't recommend what I'm using, and the multitool has more than they will need.(This message has been edited by eagle92)

"Since becoming ____rank____, attend 75% of your unit functions for a continuous period of _____#____ of months." You can use the wording above or similar wording for S-L-E. Personally would also like to see time requirements for T-2-1, but that is another thread

As someone who spent 4 years as a Life Scout, I have a few comments. 1) I do like to have a specific definition like the Sea Scouts do, and 75% seems reasonable. 2)I would word it to state "for a continuous _#__ month period since turning ___rank_____ you must have attended 75% of unit functions. I know that once I got job, I missed almost all of the campouts and didn't got to summer camp; I had to work to support myself and help out. BUT i did attend almost every meeting and did take what I learned and passed it along. So expectign older scouts to work with youth isn't unreasonable. I do admit another reason, besides the money I was earning working, for not going to summer camp was that I already took the one HA program at the camp at 14 and there was nothing challenging left. Yes I could have taken BSA Lifeguard, which I would recommend prior to the new changes this past year, but I was already a YMCA lifeguard when they still taught the 'hand to hand combat" and didn't see the need.

Never heard that one before, but it's been a while since I taught Totin Chit and won't have to deal with Whittling Chip anytime soon. Also every city, county/parish and state has their own laws dealing with knives, so it may be a local thing. When I was CS age, I used the classic CS knife found here It was a hand me down from my brothers, and was very nice. Somewhere in my box I got one for my sons when the time comes. One nice thing is that they do have a locking mechanism. http://www.scoutstuff.org/BSASupply/ItemDetail.aspx?cat=01RTL&ctgy=PRODUCTS&c2=CAMPING&c3=KNIVES&c4=&lv=3&item=1885 The CS Utility knife is almost identical to the knife above, but it is more expensive. I've seen them in use an can also recommend it.It also has a locking mechanism. http://www.scoutstuff.org/BSASupply/ItemDetail.aspx?cat=01RTL&ctgy=PRODUCTS&c2=CAMPING&c3=KNIVES&c4=&lv=3&item=1883 I don't recommend the Swiss Army Knife as it doesn't have a locking mechanism like the two above, and costs as much as the classic. Basically you are paying for the Swiss Army name. http://www.scoutstuff.org/BSASupply/ItemDetail.aspx?cat=01RTL&ctgy=PRODUCTS&c2=CAMPING&C3=KNIVES&C4=&LV=3&item=1865&prodid=1865^8^01RTL& Don't know much about the CS lockback found below, but I am not a big fan of stainless steel knives as they lose their edge fast, and a sharp knife is actually a safe knife. Also learning how to sharpen knives is not part of Whittling Chip. http://www.scoutstuff.org/BSASupply/ItemDetail.aspx?cat=01RTL&ctgy=PRODUCTS&c2=CAMPING&c3=KNIVES&c4=&lv=3&item=24076

For me, I work on memorizing the Promis and LotP with my Tigers every week. However once they can give a good rendition, sometimes with prompting, and UNDERSTAND what it means, I sign them off if the parent hasn't already.

NEPA, Thanks for posting. WOW under those standards, I know of several viable camps that do not meet criteria.

BP, Sorry I forgot to post the link that shows the requirements for QUARTERMASTER. It is the following http://www.scouting.org/scoutsource/Venturing/Awards/quarter.aspx Also for ABLE it is found here http://seascout.org/about/program/advancement/able.html # Active Membership 3 Attend at least 75 percent of your ship meetings and special activities for one year. Note: Check with your ship's yeoman. 4 Serve effectively either as an elected petty officer of your ship or as the chair of a major ship activity. References: See "Election of Petty Officers" on page 5 and "Conducting the Activities" on page 61. Web Reference: Ethics: Scouting is a game with a purpose For ORDINARY here http://seascout.org/about/program/advancement/ordinary.html # Active Membership 3 Attend at least 75 percent of your ship's meetings and special activities for six months. Note: Check with your ship's yeoman. 4 Complete quarterdeck training, either as a petty officer or as a prospective petty officer, as provided and required by your ship and council. Web Reference: Quarterdeck Seminar Only APPRENTICE has no percetnage, only insure that your dues are paid, and you have a uniform under membership http://seascout.org/about/program/advancement/apprentice.html

A few points. Hopefully no one will think I am a "only go to our council camp" person. I am a "GO TO CAMP" person whether the local camp or OOC. Gotta brag about my SE 'cause he is of the same mindset, although he would prefer everyone to go to our camp. One thing I liked visiting camps was finding out how other camps did things, and bringing back those ideas to my camp. But I recommend going OOC every 2-3 years though. Just my opinion. In reference to the SEs selling the property, yep they can do it. BUT if the property is not being used, and there are financial problems, then it is a way to solve them. Now grant you I think that should be the LAST option, after everything else has been tried to solve the problems, including belt tightening at the council, but it does need to be an option. I agree that once you sell a camp, it is GONE forever. In referecne to the special meetings. Yep it happens and it sucks. Again gotta praise my SE as he has asked for input from everyone on one council property. We've been leasing the bulk of the property to another organization, and now that the lease is up they aren't renewing it. Overnite that section of the property went from being an asset bringing in income to support the program and the other council camps to a liability. Hopefully they can find someone lese to use the land, otherwise they may be selling the land that is not in use. DON"T WANT TO SEE IT HAPPEN.

if memoryu serves, the literature and training materials say the scout is to "DO YOUR BEST", so as long as an honest effort is made, and he knows it with a little prodding, he is good to go!

I actually posted a response over there. Since it's a moderated forum, don't know if the question or answer will be posted Real quick question,if Registered = Active, then why is that not policy across the board for all BSA awards and recognitions? One example is the Venturing Gold Award Venturing Gold Award candidates must be active and registered [emphasisis added] Venturers for at least 12 months before final qualification. taken from http://www.scouting.org/scoutsource/Venturing/Awards/gold.aspx Other examples include teh Sea Scout ranks that require, i.e from the QUARTEMASTER requirements Membership. Attend at least 75 percent [emphasis added] of ship meetings and activities for 18 months. Present a talk on Sea Scouting and complete a service project.

Short, You are correct in that you don't have to have blind loyalty to your camp. But I do have to offer a few comments But do support the OA which helps maintain the camp. I've noticed that the troops that go OOC usually are not involved with the OA. And this does hurt the council camp Attend your local summer camp once in a while and/or do one of the specialty programs. I understand if scouts love a certain summer camp, but variety can help break the monotomy. Also some camps that had earned a bad rep have been inproved since a unit may have last attended. Also a leader can take the best of Camp A's programs and facilities and offer these ideas to Camp B. One example I can give is the troop that hadn't been to the camp I worked at in 12 years, yep 12 years. Trust me the camp had changed alot in the 12 years, all for the better. As for specialty programs, do take advantage of them. NYLT, high adventure programs, skills weekends, etc are ways to help the camp, help improve future summer camp program, and help the scouts. And if see your camp having problems, COMPLAIN Seriously though, politely, that's the key politely, bring it up to people's attention and then offer ideas to resolve the problem.

John, In my old troop, a scout HAD to take that Personal Management MB from the troop treasurer, but he was also a bank VP . Seriously though, some SMs will direct scouts to specific MBCs. usually becasue they know the MBC is knowledgeable and has the experience to teach the topic. My troop was lucky in that we had some very qualified adults serving as MBCs, ie. the bank VP for PM, a cardiologist teaching FA and EP, etc.

For whatever reason this topic has brought up a story from one of my HS teachers. The teacher had a gift for languages,was a missionary and spoke 14 different languages: French, Spanish, Flemish, German, Italian, Hindi, Latin, etc as well as ancient Greek. Well he was vacationing in Greece with a friend and his car broke down. He couldn't speak modern Greek, so he when somebody asked if he needed help, he responded in Attic Greek, "Yes, my chariot broke down." Luckily he got the aid he needed.