Eagle92

To be honest I've seen it happen in a few instances: 1) LDS units as their leaders are "called" to be leaders. this is the most common. 2)new units that haven't found the 'right" leader. this happened with one of the units I started 3) units that are having leader challenges. this has happened twice with established units I know. In one instance, the 1st SM went back to school and needed to step down after 10 years. 2nd SM took over for 1.6 year, then received a promotion with work, requiring a move. In the other unit, 1st SM retired after 20+ years. 2nd SM did 2 years, but stepped down due to work.

yep 3 is the MINIMUM number of camping trips. My advice, when in doubt, bring it up with the District Advancement chair.

For normal sized CSPs, go with the CSP holders. For the larger CSPs and Sets, check out Michaels' craft store and look in scrapbooking. One serious collector I met goes everyweek, with her 50% off coupon, and buys supplies

Ditto. Summer camp is one activity, not 7. A service project is 1 activity. BUT if you have popcorn sale in the morning, and then a a COH that nite, say the popcorn sale ended at 12PM and COH prep is 7PM, that would be 2 activities. EDITED, but if you go straight from the the sale to the court of honor via troop transpo, then it''s one activity.(This message has been edited by Eagle92)

A few comments. 1) Definitely contact the SM of the other troop. Something doesn't sound right, and I would check the signatures. Again something is fishy. 2) If they did register with the other troop, and if memory serves you can still be registered in multiple units as a youth (I know I was registered in two troops for Canadian trip), and the SM did sign it, it is a legitimate signature, even if they cannot do it. But as I mentioned above, something isn't sounding right. Are you sure they were not Cub Scouts at one time and dad is use to signing off still? 3)As others have mentioned, nothing prevents them from continueing to use the skills they learned and did at the T-2-1 level. Heck maybe have them teach the other new scouts. EDITED: when I originally posted, I forgot that youth can be duel registered in multiple units of the same type. When I did it, my "home" troop was responsible for advancement, and my "trip" troop was responsible for the HA trip. Grant you the trip troop's SM was an ASM in my troop, but still everything advment related went through the home SM. Definitely talk to the other SM ASAP. And yes another reason to A) bring back time requirements for T-2-1 like pre 1989 and B) make First Aid MB required for First Class again. (This message has been edited by Eagle92)

The entire intracrew and member/leader dating brings back a meeting I attended in college. The school was creating an outdoor club, and somehow I was asked to talk about Exploring, as this was a year before the Venturing split. Things were going well, the folks starting the club liked everything the BSA had to offer. Only two things they didn't like: the fraternization policy, yes it was around then, and , since we are talking college students, the no alcohol policy.

Quick question: Who are the scouts registered with? If they have been registered with your unit since May, then why is another SM signing of on SMCs and allowing BORs? As Bac has commented, some summer camp programs will do the bulk of T-2-1 reqirements in their first year camper program, and I have personally sat on a BOR of one such scout (OK it was actually 3 BORs in one nite as this was just after the time requirements were removed and the committee didn't realize one BOR can cover all three ranks). As for MBs, once the counselor signs off, it is a done deal. However if the troop goes on a canoing expedition, nothing says they cannot have their skills checked off in order to go. BUT my major concern is why is another SM doing SMCs and why is another troop doing a BOR?

In ref to when Camping SA became required. Again I want to check my BSHB from that time, but if that is indeed the case, then I would guess in 1979, when GBB's handbook came out, which brought back the "OUTING in ScOUTING" (caps in original)

Need to double check my BSHB, but I think Camping SA became a requirement in the 2-1 range in 79 or therabouts. I know not at the T level as that was Citizenship and another SA.

Every troop has its own customs and traditions. Some troop have it as part of their regular COH, others have special ECOHs. Some units have individual ECOHs, while others will have one huge ECOH once a year for all of their Eagles. Some have indoor ECOHs, while others do outdoor. And one ECOH I wish I could gone to, I was not available that nite, was done where his Eagle project was done at: a sheltar at a local nature preserve. So do what you and more importantly your Eagles want.

While my troop does have a history of having a separate ECOHs, one Eagle did want his ECOH the same nite as a reguallry scheduled COH. So we had 2 COHs, one after the other. The scheduled COH was first, and while we didn't rush it, we did keep it focused and to the point. Then we did his ECOH. It was a simple affair,with no "roasting" of the Eagle, no guest speakers , no extra awards, etc. both event s were KISS event. If that is what the Eagles want, then by all means respect their wishes.

'Foot #1 Welcome to the forums. #2 that's a new one for me, but I am use to a campwide Scout's Own being done. At some camporees the service is done on the subcamp level. I've seen it done with an ordained minister, and sometimes with a lay church leader. Now I have heard about some areas out west, specifcally LDS country, where camporees end saturday nite for them. I'm out east so that hasn't affected us.

Another reason to make First Aid MB required for First Class again.

RD, Somewhere in the past 12 years, Bronze, Gold, Silver, Ranger, Ranger, Trust, and Quest went form being recognitions to advancement. Check out this lonk which quotes the Advancement book: http://meritbadge.org/wiki/index.php/Venturing_advancement

Base said "I stated something similar a couple of years ago the BSA is great except for the adults." I can see that, not all of the adults, but some

I want to echo Base's comment in that it's your son's program, and if he wants to transfer to another unit, you need to do it. I've seen cubs and scouts stay in the unit or program only b/c dad is a leader. The scouts are not happy, are not motivated, and get into trouble. It usually hurts the unit, as well as the parent-child relationship. Family first! I also know how difficult it is to back away from trying to provide all the boys in your troop teh same expereinces, or better ones, that you had as youth, but for your son's sake you need to do what is best for him. I love the OA, and had been very involved in my chapter and lodge because I wanted to help youth have the same good times I had in the OA. But when my son became a TC, his needs and wants trumped what I wanted to do. He needed a TCDL, and that's the job I took. I'm now his CSDL. Yes I do additional duties on the district level, and am part of a council committee, but that CSDL position trumps all of it. Again do what is best for your son. Forgot to add, we had a CC that left b/c of his son. CC was great, long time member of the troop, camped with the troop, did ASM work when needed, etc. His CS son joined another troop b/c that was where his den was going, and he wanted to stay with friends. They got an excellent ASM in him(This message has been edited by eagle92)(This message has been edited by eagle92)

"I heard a quote by someone, that 'The BSA would be great if it wasn't for the boys'... " Then why don't they start their own program with no kids. The person saying the "the BSA would be...." quote is one who doesn't get it.

Ditto what others have said about giving the rank ASAP. TRUST ME if you don't give the rank when he earns it and KNOWS he's going to get it, only to not receive it. I've seen the meltdown. Yep the new program is very advancement oriented at the den level. But you still have cubs going to CSDC, resident camp, etc, who will be doing things and not even knowing until they look in the book and want it signed off. So I still won't hold back. On a side note, it will be interesting to see what happens with the new program and supply of ranks come February. I would start to stockpile now as I bet supply will have problems, if the past year or two is a sign of things to come.

Radio, Welcome to the forums and glad you are having fun in Venturing. I have to ditto what others have said.

I don't know the official, by-the-book, reason, But when I worked for them there were several reasons. 1) Due to the nature of restricted items, they did not want anyone coming in and buying them, i.e. Eagle, QM, WB beads etc. You needed to have proof in order to get them. Anything rank related usually entailed an advancement report. However if mom was coming in to buy extra Star patches for Joe Starscout's extra jambo uniforms, some type of proof was needed, usually the shirt, and we had them fill out the form and mark "replacement." yes you do have folks trying to buy things they didn't earn. 2)The ARs need to be turned in to have the advancement properly recorded. If my experiences with training records is any indicator, I have had people who said they turned in copies of their records, and they didn't. So i'm willing to bet some adults thoughtthey turned in paperwork for advancement, when they didn't 3) The council also used the ARs as a check on their reports. Yes even replacements needed the approximate date on the AR since the council's records were messed up in a few cases. I know going for Eagle, their records had the wrong dates for some MBs and that caused problems. 4)national uses the ARs to keep track of advancement for stats. Now this is what my unit did, and I recommend. You get a few extras using actual names of recipients and mark "REPLACEMENT" on the form. Then as folks advance, you take the stuff out of your 'war chest" for giving out, then fill out thepaperwork, turn it in, and get the ranks for the war chest.

Jet, I am playing Devil's Advocate here, so bear with me. At some schools and school districts, band can count as a subject. Practices held before and after school, as well as performances (games, concerts, etc) are considered part of the "class" and if you miss, it is reflectedt in your grades. My HS did that. Ditto on sports. While their sport was in session, the practices and games were considered the PE class, and again attendance was reflected in the grade. However once their season was over, they took regular PE. Again my HS did that. Not saying it's right or fair about tying what should be an extracurricual activity to a grade, but I've seen it done. Now that said, I've known folks, and have done so myself, come from straight one activity to a meeting or COH, and change into their uniform. Heck 1 ECOH was fortunately for me scheduled between my HS ring ceremony (mandatory by school) and the ring dance (optional), So I did all three that day

Maybe I'm old fashioned, but I like patrol competitions that have actual patrols, i.e. groups of 6-10 scouts that work together yearround together on outings, meetings, hikes, etc. than a group of 6-10 scouts who leave their normal patrol to create a patrol just for a weekend in order to win the compeition. I think it takes away from the regular patrols, and really distorts the patrol method. Now if a group of older scouts got together and created a "Gung Ho Patrol," or in my case growing up the "Leadership Corps," that worked together year round and was a normal patrol in the troop then I have no problem whatsoever with them competing. They are not taking people away from their normal patrols, and are using the patrol method properly IMHO. Competition is a good thing until misused.

'box Actually they change the youth course, can't say scouts' course as Venturers can take it now, to correspond to the adult course. Which leads to a question: if a 17 yo takes NLTC, what will he learn from WB21C whenhe turns 18+? This is not meant to be sarcastic, but is a serious question.

Short, My understanding is that it is permissible to use the 4 principles n ceremonies other than those used at the Ordeal. yo just cannot use their names and titles.

OGE, If the patrol is there year-round, i.e. it's a normal patrol in the troop, then I find it acceptable. But if it's a patrol that is assembled just for the weekend, with the intent to win, I am against.