Eagle92

SSS, SHHHSHSHSHSHSHSH! [in a low voice) let's not give some Cub Scouts and their leaders in my area any more ideas. Seriously though I HAVE seen this with one of the local CS packs in my area, both youth and adult. That pack does their own thing, never seen one at a training, round up, or event except Webeloree. they usually just show up, complain about the uniform inspection that they usually do not get point on, and leave a mess. EDITED Forgot to add that that's how the Belgians I met display their patches, all over the shirt.(This message has been edited by Eagle92)

Bart, When I worked for Supply, they loved me b/c I was one of handful who bought the pins for my knots, and I bought up all the "Sea Explorer Device" pins as all of my pins kept coming off frequently. Since I do not need to have the pins on my knots, I don't wear them. I also don't wear my service stars, although they stayed on a little longer when I did wear them compared to the knot pins. That said 2 tricks I've seen. 1) use the back of an eraser. That can only be used with the service stars, not the knot pins. 2) mount the knots on a military ribbon bar. The ones I've used had a hole in the center to put the military devices on the ribbons. It works for the knots too as you have room to put the knot device on them, but you need to use glue to mount the knots on the ribbon bar.

Don't know about other inspectors, but the COPE inspector I ran into the year we opened up the course was very thorough and understanding. Some of out equipment was still in boxes, and some hadn't arrived yet! Worked with us, told us what needed to be done, and did check up a few days later. Kinda helped that one of the DEs use to work for a company that built COPE courses though

Moose, One of the beautiful things about Scouting is that it is adaptable. If you want to follow a traditional program, then you can do it, as along as it follows G2SS, and everything that Kudu mentions is permitted. Grant you Kudu does sometimes goes overboard on the WB21C course, but he is passionate about the BSA, and that is a good thing. He probably saw first hand what the 1972 program did to scouting, prays that it never happens again, and will fight tooth and nail to keep the "OUTING in ScOUTING." My personal opinion is that you let the scouts do the work and let the adults do an 'Al Bundy' impersonation of sitting around a campfire, drinking coffee, and letting the scouts run things. Yep they will be mistakes, screw up things, heck maybe even do things a little differently than you would do it. But it's their chance to learn and grow.

Been a while since I had to deal with resident camp certs, but isn't the cert good for a year? So when camp opens up, they are still certified until the inspectors show up, usually the first week of camp in my expereince.

Hot, We may need to bring back the garters as well. My inlaws bought me a dozen knee socks before they were discontinued, and of the 4 pair I've worn, they do not stay up like the pair I have form the 90s still. heck my original pair still stay up, but they are "well loved" and not really presentable at meetings, only camping.

BP, We can only hope that teh experience of folks coming up to him while in uniform and talking about their expereinces in scouting will change his mind. I know I had a conversation with a former GS leader who is upset that the GS uniform is virtually non existant to the point that she can only recognize Girl Scouts when they sell the cookies,a nd that's b/c of the cookies, not the vests.

Stosh, Mixed emotions about the committee meeting. Don't like the fact that the SPL got reamed, but if this was after being notifiied of what was expected, aided by you in preparing (Ok what have you got ready, what about....) and still not prepared, then maybe it was in order (that's the problem with message communication vs face to face, can't get the tone or facial gestures). On the other hand, that is a real world expereince on the importance of preparation. Also like the fact that the CC gets the program AND demands a HA activity for the older scouts. Further she clarified that she won't interfere, which is always a plus.

What happened to the CSE is a normal occurance whenever I go to the store before or after a meeting. This is the result of being a suit for way to long and not being in the field. On a related note, I think some of the uniforming problem may stem indirectly from Exploring and the Distintive Identity Dress. I'm willing to bet that some leaders thought, "well if one program can create their own uniform, why not us?"

Bart, that link is VERY old as the term SEA EXPLORER hasn't been used officially since August 1998.

Yep it's Ok. FYI One thing to remember though: all female leaders (doesn't mention female Venturers though) AND all male Cub Scout leaders can wear one temporary patch either on the right pocket OR above the BSA strip over the right pocket. http://scoutstuff.org/BSASupply/images/pdfs/34048.pdf ...Cub Scout leaders and female leaders wearing the official uniform shirt or blouse may wear one temporary insignia centered above the Boy Scouts of America strip.

Sue, Once uniform, always uniform. So that my 1950s vintage Den Mother's dress I bought my wife is still official and can be worn. Just as all those Webelos and CS leaders are wearing the green and tan numbers and trained strips are in an official vintage August 2008- April 2009 uniform.

Folks, That's not me as I am quoting a Scot I met in '95. Oneof his Scouts did have shorts on as he was climbing trees with a kilt on. When I asked about it he gave me that reply.

here's the link. http://www.scouter.com/forums/viewThread.asp?threadID=246471&p=1

Not speculation, but an experiment going on right now in Maryland right now. http://www.baltimorebsa.org/openrosters/ViewOrgPageLink.asp?LinkKey=35982&orgkey=749 Apparently the UnderArmour T-shirts incorporate the rank in them, so each rank would be about $13.10 to $16.10 per rank. But the full trial is not out yet, other items are comign out in may. If you do a search on alternate uniforms, there is a thread onthis topic from within the past year. EDITED: Forgot to add, if memory serves from doing a comparison from a link that I cannot find now on what the proposed alternate uniform would be AND what retail prices for the items form a sporting goods store, I beleive Cabella's, the alternate uniform is actually more expensive. (This message has been edited by eagle92)

Actually District Committee earn the Scouter's Key. Don't ask me why though. i also never heard it cvalled Boy Scout Leader, always Scouter's training Award. FYI National has reinstated the Skipper's Key, so Skippers can earn that one instead.

Out of curiosity, when did they change the name of the award? Online IG call it the Scouter's Training Award, as well as Supply. I'm curious.

Just remember to wear something underneath it. As a friend from the 105th Glasgow Scout Troop once said "99% of the time we have to wear something underneath as the women might get a wee bit offended, and... all the men would be jealous."

WOW with the backstory, I agree, pass and give him other options. Only person has the right to "run the troop," and that is the duly elected SPL. Whether he is a Tenderfoot or an Eagle is irrelevent to the position.

Ok here is my $.01 cents worth. Until a separate committee award is available, i.e. the various CS awards, then the Scouter's Training Award will have to do.

'Nut, The committee is paper at the moment. Most of the folks listed left when their kids aged out, or they are part of the CO which has a hands off apporach. They appointed the COR/CC, but I've only met him one time, doing a popcorn sale after church. Our pack is relatively young, being approx. 5 years old, and the original CM and ACM were a two man show as they did 90% of the work. Current CM has been here a year, and will be moving up in December. My concern is that if I do take CM, it will be expected of me to do everything, and with other family commitments, that isn't possible. I'll need help doing round ups. I'll need help organizing activities, etc. I can not be a one man show. And the CO does have a history of being hands off. The troop is in desparate need of ASMs, and the CO is clueless, despite meetings with the SM, district folks, etc, on their responsibility to help find one. And don't get me started about how they work with the crew. Let's just say the crew meets at the library b/c the CO doesn't know anything about Venturing. Having talked to my friend mentioned above, who was the adviser for the CO's crew, he told me reality with the CO is that I will have to recruit folks, I'll have to run the leaders' meeting, etc. The CO wants one of their own to be the CC. As for me stepping down, that is a big yes: down from the district committee. All I'll be doing is CSDC and possibly some training. EDITED: forgot to add down as DL too. Luckily I have a good ADL and DC who I am comfortable taking over. Plus with the new Program Resource Book,it makes planning a lot easier. I got everything roughly scheduled until Jan 24th. Just need to make 2 calls for field trips. As for upcoming sons, my friend the former CM said it will take about 2 years to get the pack in automode. That should be enough time for middle child to be a TC.(This message has been edited by eagle92)

I think that's part of the problem, we don't have folks in place anymore. Sure we have DLs, but we don't have anyoen supporting them or giving guidance to them. As a friend of mine just told me on the phone, he's a former CM, the first year will be hellish b/c I will be recruiting support folks and establishing a routine, esp since my pack is not old enough yet to have one yet. I still want input from everyone, so please help a scouter out

Ok I am reopening this thread as last nite's meeting was, to put it mildly, a mess. Lets just say you know it's bad when parents start leaving early. Folks I want to hear about your expereinces as CM: good, bad, and ugly. You can PM me or you can post here. I want stories about how involved or uninvolved your CORs are. I want to hear about good committees, as well as committees in name only. Basically I want to have an idea of what I am getting into if I do volunteer for CM and get selected. One thing our CO does do properly is review and approve leaders, and they have turned down folks in the past. The situation has gotten worse, to the point that it has now interfered with my den meeting and providing a good program to my Cubs. Thankfully I have a great ADL and DC who helped out and provided some leadership while I was dealing with stuff behind the scenes and with parents. If, and again I am stressing if, I need to quit being DL, I know the den is in capable hands. Thanks (This message has been edited by eagle92)

We had a similar situation. We had a scout leave us, not b/c of problems but b/c he got involved with stuff in HS and knew he couldn't truly keep a POR for advancement with us due to the different schedules, so he transfers. It was an amicable split. And he left us as a First Class or Star Scout. 2.5 years later as a Life Scout, he switches back to us. His other troop was having challenges, being mostly adult led and not youth led, and the scheduling conflicts ended, so he could join us. While he didn't get elected SPL, he was appointed ASPL,a nd was part of our Leadership Corps. He was an asset as he did pick up a few things that were done differenly and helped us out. He did get Eagle and stayed with us a few months afterwards, until he left for college. Talk to the Scout and see what he wants is a very good suggestion. Or if he Eagled, and is looking for more challenges, maybe a Venturing Crew or Sea Scotu Ship is what he needs. If he wants to give back to the troop that was his foundationin Scouting, by all means accept him.

Didn't read all the posts when I posted earlier, been dealing with pack problems again. So when I was rereading, this statement hit a nerve. And BP please do not take it personally as it is not an attack on you, but more of a vent on my pack's situation. "The SM and ASM, CM, WL, DL devote more of their personal blood sweat and tears to the boys than any other volunteer and should not be lumped in with those who write policy and push paper in the background. " Yes "direct contact" leaders do put a lot of blood, sweat, tears, and time into the program. But without a good committee providing support to the "direct contact leaders" by helping out with such things as arraning cook crews ( I'm in CS mode), spreading out activities so that you do not have 2 events back to back or worse double booking the same weekend, working with the COR to book dates for facilities, helping to recruit new ASMs or CMs,ad nauseum, then your direct contact leaders will be spending more time dealig with stuff they really shouldn't than spending time with the youth. A good committee provides support for the program, allowing the leaders to deal directly with the youth. They help provide resources to make programming possible. They are are part of the team, not a bunch of paperpushers, and if they are doing their jobs and a little extra, then that are worthy of recognition. Again I apologize if this seem an attack on BP b/c it isn't. This is more of a vent. right now my pack doesn't have a working committee, and it's putting a lot of pressure on me and a few other leaders. I got an event this weekend and A) we don't know who is going as there was no committee member coordinating the registration, B) we do not have a cook crew as the regular crew are going to an event the following weekend with the troop and no one was there to pick up the slack, C) we do not have someone to deal with advancement, i.ee record everything, buy everything, and prep it for the pack meeting ( only awards given out were the ones I purchased for my den as not giving out something that was earned is a pet peeve of mine), and I can go on. If we had an active committee, I could focus on my den.