Eagle92

JoeBob, Must respectfully disagree with the "God is good" comment. It should be "God is great, beer is good, and people are crazy" Sorry I couldn't exist. I know how you feel. He was looking after us in both cases, especially when the family was camping.

Now I admit, we advertise the conclave as a big party. In my lodge we work hard: 3 Ordeals/year, 1 lodge workday/year, chapters do their own work days, and staffing various district and council events. Our 2 "fun" events on the lodge level are conclave and fall fellowship every year, and NOAC when they occur. Grant you I haven't attended a conclave in several years, and I've been involved with AIA when I did attend, but various training did occur, and in regards to AIA training and competitions, were excellent. I cannot comment on other areas as I practically lived at AIA site those weekends. But I agree if somethign about our Obligation and cheerful service isn't mentioned at a conclave, something is wrong.

What I've seen done is a flag held up, and 14 quotes from important Americans as the stripes are cut from the flag and placed in the fire. Each stripe has a quote, and the blue union has it's own quote.

2Cub, Scouts cannot selectively abstain from voting from someone. They either turn in a ballot with names on it, turn in a ballot with no names on it thus voting for no one, or they do not turn in a ballot. I'll give you a hypothetical to explain. Troop has 24 registered scouts: 8 brand new scouts and 16 older scouts. Troop holds an election where 15 members show up: the 8 new scouts and 7 older scouts. They have over 50% of the membership so a quorum is met. If the 8 new scouts decide to abstain, as in not turn in a ballot at all, then 7 ballots are turned in. A scout would need 4 ballots to get in. If the 8 brand new scouts turned in blank ballots, thinking that was abstaining, and the older scouts submit their 7 with names, NO ONE would be elected because those 8 blank ballots count as voting against. So a second vote would be needed. So in a nutshell you need 50+% of the troop or team to conduct an election, and 50+% of the ballots turned in to be elected. A blank ballot does count as a no vote. No ballot submitted is an abstention. To answer your question, I've never seen a ballot with ABSTAIN on it. According to the G2I, and probably other pubs as well, If a ballot had abstain on it, it WOULD count as a NO VOTE (caps for emphasis). In order to truly abstain, and not count against the Scout, an abstainer would not turn in a ballot at all. Hope it helps

We lucked out. I was at in-laws on the 16th when the first batch of tornadoes hit, and one hit a block away. Worse thing they had was a branches in the yard, and lots of insulation all over. My house was 2.5 miles away, and it looked as if nothing occured. We basically raced the storms comign home from vacation without realizing how bad they were. We left my father's the day before his area got hit, and left the campgrounda few hours before the storms hit.

Base, AHHHH you got me, I got a mortgage and student loans. 23 more years and the house paid for. Also I noticed that the cost of living is lower in TN than NC. Milk and gas was about $.20-$.25; and fast food prices were a little lower too.

It's challenging at times. Cost of living in NC is higher than in MS and LA where I've also lived. Plus my utiltiies are monopolized by the city, so they are higher than the rest of the area.

For candidates, the elangomats are responsible for keeping track of them. In one instance I also had candidate dad helping keep track of special needs candidate son, and darn glad too. Son got away from me, the other elangomat, and dad. Luckily we found him within 5 minutes about 50 yards ahead of us working on the trail, but it was a LONG 5 minutes for all of us. For members we work as a chapter.

I'm paraphrasing the GTI, page 2-2 of the appendixes specifically, if the 4 new scouts did not vote at all, then there would be a total of 8 ballots, and 4 would be needed to get in. They would not, repeat NOT, turn in any ballots as if they turned in an unmarked one, it would be counted as a no vote, not an abstention. Since they turned in ballots, as shown by the one elected scout with 11 votes, it's a done deal, only one person got elected. Had a similar situation happen to me. New scouts didn't know anyone in the troop, except one of their brothers. They only put his name on the ballot and he got in. Funny thing was that he wasn't interested in the OA, the older scouts knew this, and didn't vote for him. But the new scouts outnumbered the older scouts and he got in. This was under the old procedures, so he was the only one elected. Way the PLC handled it the next year was that the new scouts would abstain since they did not have enough time (less than a month)to know everyone eligible prior to the election. That worked out well and the new scouts understood, and the group that elected the scout from the year before were big proponents of it, since they saw what happened.

just be glad it wasn't a used feminine hygiene product smeared all over. I've dealt with both situations.

Base, Yes b/c of gas. Unfortunately I commute to work, and between travel to work, around town, and the commute for son's bi-weekly speech therapy (where I work at. I know it's a drive, but it's better and more organized than the local school system, don't ask), a good chunk of money goes towards gas. As it is now, we are looking for ways to cut down on all travel. Trips to places is one of them. Walking more is also part of the solution. I've redone the family budget based upon $5/gal and it's going to get VERY tight now as we are essentially a one income family. Not only is gas prices going up, but also food prices. We are tightening the belt. I'm glad I got a rice cooker for Christmas, 'cause I'm going to be eating a lot of rice until the economy turns around.

We are fortunate in that my district has one of the 6 council camps in it's territory, about 30 minutes away from the house. But the price of gas IS limiting my trips. We have a camp out about 2 hours away, and I am not going b/c of gas, and family in town.

I've been fortunate in that the dirtiest job I ever had was summer camp staff. Cleaning up vandalized bathrooms and "dumpster dancing," i.e. placing plywood on top of the garbage and jumping on it to compact the garbage b/c the council is too cheap to have the dumpster emptied more often. Luckily I never had to get into the biohazard gear and go inside the spetic tank like one ranger did at a camp I worked at.

OX, Actually beaded sashes are now against policy.Don't know when the change occurred, but it is mentioned in some BSA literature that beaded sashes are not allowed.

hawk, I remember when YPT was good forever. BSA changes things as they want.

Kinda like a vest in the USA = a waistcoat in the UK, and vest in the UK = abra in the USA.

#1 WELCOME TO THE FORUMS! #2 Please tell us a little about yourself, your unit, etc, i.e. an intro. #3 Sometimes folks get upset when a person posts something, either selling stuff or asking for donations on their first post. Let's face it, we don't know you from Adam, and folks have abused BSA uniforms. If you're in the SF area, I bet you know what I'm talking about.

Skeptic, You could get up to 5 notches?!?!?!!?! man it was 3 notches you're out in my old lodge. Seriously though I too think that policy should be back in place, and it is NOT hazing. I agree with ya. We had an adult who talked and complained the entire time at one Ordeal. Lodge could not send him home despite his refusal to keep quiet. Finally we ended up sending him with an adult member on a 2 man work party to keep him away from everyone else. I do remember seeing him get his sash, but never saw him again.

here's a link to the national PDF on "What Makes a Trained Leader" http://scouting.org/filestore/training/pdf/What_makes_a_trained_leader.pdf Also this link may help http://scouting.org/sitecore/content/Home/BoyScouts/Adults/Training/Trained%20Leader.aspx What I find intersting is that Troop Committee Challenge is listed as "supplemental" training, and not position specific on the pdf, and not mentioned at all on the second link, go figure.

probably b/c folks are considered minors until 21. I personally don't understand that b/c A) you can get married without parental consent at 18 B) Vote at 18, C) enlist in the military at 18, D) have various medical procedures done without parents' knowledge (ok that is actually a MUCH younger age thanks to HIPAA), etc, etc.

The longer I am on this board, the more thankful I am of the SM I had, Mr. Joe, and the troop I was in. We were a "hiking and camping troop," and the youth were in charge, for better or worse. We were not perfect, not by a long shot, but we did alot on our own. And that included the service projects. Now grant you I did mine back in the day when the form was a one page form, and not the booklet it became, but we were the ones who picked our projects. Yes we did have to get the approvals and we had discussions, but Mr. Joe, and the other leaders, both youth and adult, would always ask questions and made us think, coming up with our own answers. I remember one project was organizing a blood drive. Ok the scouts in hte troop didn't do much, we went door to door passing out flyers, help set up, did the sign in at the event and passed out cookies and juice, but the Eagle had to secure lcoations, organzie, etc. He was intersted in medicine, and it was up his alley. Another scout saw a need for books on tape, and organized his project put the Bible on tape for reproduction for several nursing homes. Another project I rememebr was making and distributing hurricane emergency kits to needy families. We came up withe the projects based upon our interests and experiences. Any sorry for the ramble.

Well I hate that you folks are leaving, but it may force the issue with the troop to improve. Most troops tend to go in cycles, event he ones with a SM who's been in the role 25 years, as my troop growing up did. As for your DE, sounds like my type of DE, hopefully some of the "Old Guard" don't treat them like I was some, not all but SOME, of the "Old Guard" when I was a 21yo chapter adviser and on the district committee. Good luck.

JBlake brought up a very good point, something that I found was meaningful back in my day and the scuots in my unit loved, as well as the Cubs i'm working with, and trying to install: Traditions. Look at some of the things that troops did in the past, and ask the scouts if they want to do that. One thing I liked, and my pack may do, is an Investiture Ceremony formally recognizing the new scouts. Another tradition was the use of a tree stump that was cut on either the first campout or first summer camp the troop went on (I know, I know I should remember these things but I'm getting old, but I think it was summer camp) Ditto the Scout Law candlabra that the troop's plankowners made from a log from their first summer camp (I do remember that one ) Simple things that may not seem like much, but instill pride and memories. And the best tradition is giving the scouts ownership of their troop, letting them "fail" when you can easily prevent the problem form arising so that they learn and grow.

This may sound a little strange, but please go with me. For about the first 6 months, YOU act as the SPL. You guide them, set the example and train them to take over in 6 months. After about a month or so though, you slowly let them taking over and ease the process so that by 6 months, you are sitting outside your tent, reading a book, and drinking coffee responding to all scouts, save one, "Have you asked your PL?" ( with 8-10 scouts, probably best to start off with 1 patrol as BP tried 5 man patrols and decided on 6-8 man patrols). I know that the above sounds strange, but get yourself a copy of the 3rd edition SM Handbook, both volumes, ASAP and read the section on starting and training a new troop. Green Bar Bill wrote the book, and while you may need to make some slight modifications for today's technology and BSA policies (remember patrols can no longer go camping on their own without an adult like whenthe book was written among other changes), that info is the FOUNDATION of the patrol method. Good luck!

One thing I have a question as I hear it alot, Where is everyone keep getting a 100 hour requirement for Eagle projects? I know there was no such requirement when I was doing my project, although I bet I easily went over that with planning, getting approvals, recruiting, and executing the project. Just curious.