Eagle707

Membership ID numbers are issued by individual councils. Therefore, if you are registered in multiple councils, you have multiple ID numbers. I wish there was one universal number for each member but that is not the case.

I may be mistaken but I believe that would defeat the purpose of chapters. Chapters are designed to make the OA accessible to units and members in their districts. The OA is not meant to be a replacement for unit activities. The "Guide to Officers and Advisers" has this to say: "Arrowmen are expected first to give service to and be active in their own units. Then as time permits, they can assist the lodge in such activities as unit elections, camping promotion, service to council camping facilities, etc." As I read it, there is a distinct division between lodge/chapter activities and unit service. Your professionals, as staff advisers, should know this also but they may need reminders. Also, as far as creating chapters goes, I would recommend having one chapter per district so that the lodge aligns with the council/district organization. Good luck to you!

I'm in the same boat with my concerns. I went to the 2005 and 2010 jamborees and, both times, I was impressed with how the US Army handled the logistics of the event. This leaves me wondering how badly we will miss them in 2013. I'm guessing we will be seeing a ton of requests for volunteers with EMS training and other "specialized" qualifications in order to fill the gap that the army has left. The other option would be paying for on-site EMS services from the county. My other thought about filling the gap is this: we have plenty of Fire/EMS, Police, and Search and Rescue Exploring posts and the Jamboree could be an excellent way for them to get hands-on experience in their fields. Perhaps we could see a scenario where entire posts could attend for a discount in exchange for their services. Any thoughts on this one? It could bring the whole BSA "corporate family" together at one event without compromising either division (or at least that's how I see it).

Let me preface this with a disclaimer: I am NOT a lawyer. I would avoid making a big deal of this for one main reason: you shouldn't know this. You have gained access to confidential information and would have to explain how you got it. It's hard to expect Scouts to be trustworthy if you are ignoring confidentiality rules. Also, if you didn't have a problem with him before you learned this, why do you have a problem now? It sounds like he's working to keep these things out of his Scouting life (if not his whole life). If it was truly a concern, it would probably be public knowledge. In fact, it probably is, to some extent (you know how boys talk). If you REALLY feel compelled to do something, talk to your COR and your CC about the Scout and ask if they will revoke his membership in the unit (perhaps get your DE involved in the conversation too). I'm not sure I would go this route though. Personally, I would continue to let him participate and keep a close eye on him. If Scouting is keeping him from living out part of this other life, I would try to keep him in Scouting. Every minute he's in Scouting is a minute he's away from his other life and those minutes add up. Do I condone his actions? No. Do I think this is a situation for vigilante action? No. Am I attacking you? No. At least, I'm not trying to attack you. I'm just trying to ask some important questions about an awkward situation. I work with HIPPA and FERPA and I know that breaches of confidentiality are taken very seriously. Be careful how you proceed on this one.

When I was a Boy Scout, I was in my high school's marching band and my troop's "Flag Team." In Scouts, my friend and I did teach a clinic about how to do "about face" and which foot to start on; marching band, conversely, was hours of drills. In Scouts, we did not spend hours (or even half an hour) working on drills. Serving on flag team was a big deal in my troop so Scouts wanted to learn how to look sharp and that was what our brief practice session (at the request of the PLC) entailed: sharp turns and sharp salutes. We didn't need hours of training for flag team. Similarly, when I was a New Zealand Sea Scout, my ship was asked to participate in an ANZAC Day parade and we did spend most of the preceding meeting learning how to march (basically a roll step). However, after ANZAC Day, we never worried about it again. We went back to sailing, pioneering, and doing our flag ceremonies in "The Ship." It was just like Scouting here: we practiced only when we needed to instead of practicing in case we were needed. I think the former is the better approach to take to drill in Scouting. It shouldn't be a program focus but can be used to expand program opportunities.

My former troop did their planning exactly as Alabama Scouter described. It worked quite well for us too.

Thanks. That makes sense.

No worries, Oak Tree. I'm glad you put it up for discussion. As a bonus, I understand the body type you're talking about: I'm a distance runner as well as a swimmer. I was trying to be facetious on that one but was unsuccessful. Edited: I'm not sure why it spun a thread from my last comment. Sorry for any confusion.(This message has been edited by Eagle707)

I'm the one who originally posted that so I'll take a moment to defend my comments. I should have been careful not to use an absolute. I am one of those people with very little body fat but, curiously, I cannot sink (it makes being a mock victim difficult ). I posted that comment on a thread where we were discussing a Scout who was afraid of swimming. The point I was actually trying to make was that many people cannot float because they tense up from fear and then sink. In this case, you need to get them floating as the first step in making them comfortable in the water. What I should have said was "make sure he's water-adjusted before you make him start swimming." These people are whom I was referring to, not to those who are gifted with more density and muscle mass. Does the comment make more sense now?(This message has been edited by Eagle707)

I know this is a long post so I'll say this up front: I'm an Eagle Scout and an American Red Cross-certified Water Safety Instructor so reading this post shouldn't be a waste of your time. First, I wouldn't tell him "he's done" at all! Instead, I would encourage him to take private lessons to get over his fear of swimming. Yes, private lessons. They may cost more but by removing them from a "conventional" class environment, the instructor can give the Scout his or her full attention and the Scout doesn't have to feel self-conscious about his fear. As far as the facing the fear, it will take an experienced instructor to coax him through it. Make sure this Scout is taking lessons from someone who is an American Red Cross-certified Water Safety Instructor (WSI). WSIs have the skill set and the training to tackle situations like this and do well in them. Also, one bonus point: Eagle92 said it is important to learn how to float. This is 100% for two reasons: 1) If you float you aren't sinking. 2) If you cannot float, you cannot swim. I know someone who trains triathletes and, because of this, makes sure his clients can float before he does anything else. Once you get him to learn how to float, swimming will come faster. Happy Scouting and (hopefully) happy swimming!

I meant "treatise" in jest, as I'm sure you recognized. I would caution you to be careful in how you use your words, though. As Beavah said, the College Board would not look kindly on misuse of "permeated" or "conceited." That's not really important to this discussion though and I'll keep my feedback brief this time. 1) NYLT and a rigorous high-school curriculum are focused on different things so, actually, reading that you are NYLT-trained would be encouraging. Are you? 2) Does your troop do annual "Troop Leadership Training" for your Scouts? That training can make a big difference for your Scouts. 3) Again, why not spin off the older Scouts into a Venture Patrol so that you can spend time mentoring these younger Scouts? That takes care of your size problem and forces the older Scouts to practice what they have already learned. I'm impressed that you want to contribute so much to Scouting but I also know that high-achieving youth (Scouts or not) tend to take on big tasks when delegating would suffice. I would really encourage you to split your patrol, and use patrol games and competitions to develop their skills, instead of trying to cover all of this yourself. Lean on your older Scouts to help you too. One way to bring discipline to unruly older Scouts is to challenge them to take on leadership roles (mostly as Instructors). You may be surprised by the results.

I think that you have some fantastic ideas- and I applaud your for your devotion to Scouting- but I want to post a few questions/comments: -Given that an "ideal" patrol is eight Scouts, why are you trying to run a patrol of more than twice that number? You seem eager to delegate authority to your "sub-PLC" so why not split your patrol into three patrols? That would create two new PL slots and two new APL slots and give the Scouts in your troop more opportunities to practice their own leadership abilities. -If you have rowdy older Scouts, why haven't they been split off into a Venture Patrol? Venture Patrols are designed to give older Scouts new high-adventure experiences so they aren't stuck doing the "same old, same old" at every meeting. -Why is your tag "MapleScouter?" I'm under the impression that you are under 18 so that would make you a Scout. Revel in that and serve as PL of a patrol that receives an NHP award. After that, you can serve as SPL and JASM. You could also ask your SM to let you help with the troop's annual Troop Leadership Training. Leading TLT would help cultivate the leaders that you want to see in your troop and would also give you another chance to develop your leadership abilities. -This one is just a comment: you sound almost paternalistic in your post. The way I read your post, it sounds like you feel that your fellow Scouts are unable to lead themselves and, thus, need you to step in to manage them. Scouting enables Scouts to succeed but also gives them a place to try and fail. Don't think I am trying to crush all of your dreams and please do not think I hold your academic abilities against you. I do caution you, though, against discounting Scouts simply because they do not attend your school or share some other quality you deem important. You say you do not tolerate mediocrity and to this I ask, what made you the arbiter of what is mediocre? Boy Scouts is a program where Scouts can choose different paths and, if you want to make more of your experience, options are available. You can pursue NYLT/NAYLE or work at "Summer Camp B" as a CIT or a counselor. You can also pick both options. The reason I have answered your treatise with my own really just boils down to one thing though: You appear to have a very solid understanding for Scouting and a great passion for the program. However, it seems you are trying to run a program that differs from Scouting because "you know better." I have seen this attitude manifested in adults many times- often to the detriment of Scouts- so I want to leave some questions and feedback for you to consider before you go too far in this direction. Ultimately, there is one Scouting program and we need to follow it. You seem like the kind of leader that could help deliver a fantastic program, so I would encourage you to do everything you can to ensure that happens. Good luck!(This message has been edited by Eagle707)(This message has been edited by Eagle707)

The other posters are correct! You have the power to help effect change in your current troop: you are still a youth leader. Also, as JASM, you are in a position to mentor your SPL. I'd suggest that you, the SPL, and the Scoutmaster talk about the changes you want to see in the troop. If the SM wavers, or is afraid of the committee, mention that, as a JASM, your job is to mentor the youth leaders and help them deliver "Scouting" and not "Dad and Lad." You're old enough that you have the luxury to take these stands. Don't worry about currying favor or needing an ASM job to say active past 18 (College Scouter Reserve can cover you). Your willingness to take ownership of the program should sway people who truly want to be Scouters (and not just relive their glory days). After the three of you have talked, schedule a meeting with your Chartered Organization Representative. Show him/her your Scout handbook and say that this is how you want to run the program. Ask for his/her support for the program and then meet with the Troop Committee and announce these changes. If any of them openly obstruct your efforts, the COR can invite them to leave your troop. Really. The COR has hire/fire power over the adult leaders of the unit. I doubt you're in for a bloody struggle but getting people to change can be difficult, especially when a troop has "always done it that way." Think of it as your legacy: you're making sure that these young men will have a great Scouting experience.(This message has been edited by Eagle707)

Fantastic idea, Beavah! Here's a list from the troop I was in (and since I'm a College Scouter, there can't be any "that was then, this was now" ): -The OA Troop Rep was responsible for contacting the chapter for an election team and for determining who was eligible (the adults DID give him a nights camping print-out, though). -There is only one adult at the annual Troop Planning Meeting: the Scoutmaster. Otherwise, it's only youth leaders, led by the SPL. -The Scouts handle their SPL and PL elections themselves. -They have an annual patrol cooking competition (judged by adults but menus are up to the Scouts). -The PLC sets duty rosters at summer camps -Patrols rotate responsibilities for the Courts of Honor and troop meetings -The SPL works with the SM to run Troop Leadership Training -Scouts ran the (occasional) uniform inspections and rewarded the best uniformed patrol -Once Scouts reach First Class, they are permitted to sign off on any rank below theirs (Eagles did A LOT of signing). -Patrols did their own menus and cooking when they went camping.

If you're interested in learning more about these older programs, check out seniorscoutinghistory.org The person who maintains this site has information about every incarnation of Exploring so definitely reference it if you want to use the shirt as part of an exhibit.

I'm not saying grammar isn't important, I'm just saying that AFOSP addresses the order in which problems should be fixed. Grammatical mistakes impede communication but there's no point in communicating if there is nothing to be said. The promotion of grammar over everything is what I'm cautioning against. Grammatical mistakes irritate me to no end but they are minor failings compared to the inability to answer a question. Writing is like owning a car: the stuff under the hood is most important to maintain. Once the car runs, THEN it makes sense to wash and wax it. It's cool to have a nice-looking car but, unless you can drive it around, it doesn't do much for you. Same with writing: grammar is the polish to a functional paper.

I think Lisabob posted an excellent explanation but I'll add my two cents anyway. I definitely agree that not everybody enters college well-prepared to write. However, a major misconception that people have is that appropriate grammar is the indicator of a solid paper. I work in one of the top college writing programs in the country as a tutor and as a facilitator for English 102 (a tutorial for students who do not pass our writing diagnostic test) and what we teach students in these settings is a concept we call "AFOSP." Each of the components is listed in order of importance. AFOSP Assignment (meeting the requirements) Focus (Staying on target) Organization Support (with evidence, examples) Proofreading (grammar) Proofreading is at the bottom because there are other components that need to be addressed in order for the student to have a chance at succeeding on an assignment. You can write a paper that has perfect grammar but, if you turn in a disorganized and unfocused mess, the wonderful grammar will not be reflected in your grade. I do not advocate for ignoring grammar but I do believe, with developing writers, we need to appreciate what they are able to do and help them with their individual problems. We don't need to gloss over grammatical errors but if you can help a student with the earlier parts of AFOSP, THAT is what makes them stronger writers. Make working with grammar a component of helping them but focus on the other issues first.

I just want to leave a final answer in this thread in case a future college student finds it. Despite what may have been said in the past, the College Scouter Reserve is still a valid registration category. I called the National Office to confirm this and I am currently registered as a College Scouter (Position 92). The only training required for this position is YPT. As far as how it works, College Scouters are on their own for figuring out what they do. If they are Arrowmen, encourage them to stay active in a lodge. If not, it is best to contact the local DE and go from there.

Sparrows- What the other posters have said is true: your son can be a Scout and I'm glad you support him! Parental support is key to a Scout's success and it seems like he will have plenty of it. While you are unable to register as an adult leader, you are able to wear the "mother's pins" he receives as he advances. Welcome to Scouting!

I think you're ok. Scouts wear uniforms when they volunteer at cemeteries and at patriotic events. I think this qualifies as both. My only caution: make sure the uniform is complete--even if the bugler has to borrow some pants from another Scout.

Does his Scouting season end by personal choice or because his troop "shuts down" for the summer?

Go for it! The Den Chief position benefits everyone involved: the DL gets help, the Cub Scouts get an older Boy Scout to mentor them, and the Scout gets to practice his leadership skills.

You shouldn't have a problem. Don't worry about the cards but, if you're concerned about being stopped, bring your son's book to the Scout shop in case they ask to see some sort of documentation. That should the most anyone needs to sell you the badges.

Touche, packsaddle. I'm definitely out of patience. For the record, though, I didn't suggest he START an organization. I'll just say I agree with FScouter's observation and leave it at that. I'm excited to see what local units can do with this award.(This message has been edited by Eagle707)

BadenP, I must have misinterpreted your posts. If that is the case, I apologize. That being said, I have a few candid remarks of my own. I'm glad you have no problem with science and Scouting but I'm sure you would agree that mentioning the downfall of the BSA in every comment on these threads could very easily be misconstrued: I have gone through all of your posts and I have found exactly one remark that explicitly suggests that you welcome science in Scouting. Otherwise, you have only derogatory jokes and stereotypes about people who might be interested in STEM-focused awards and those vastly outnumber your token statement. You've also made similar mistakes in saying that we believe that the outdoors should no longer be the focus of the BSA: you are equating minor change with a total paradigm shift. Nobody here has said that so apparently I'm not the only one misreading posts. On those grounds, please cool it with your insults. You and I both know that insults are only brought out when the speaker is running out of arguments. If you want to write about the downfall of the BSA, spin off another thread and leave this discussion to the people who want to discuss the award. Your discussion of "Soccer and Scouting" in this thread is reason enough for you to move your discussion to another thread. Also, if you really have a problem with the BSA, consider joining the Baden-Powell Service Association: they use Baden-Powell's original handbook. The BSA will evolve whether we want it to or not so we, as elective members, need to deliver the program we are given. By the way: Soccer and Scouting was launched under Roy Williams, not Bob Mazzuca. I guess I'm not the only one who is presenting "inaccurate" facts. If you want to rant about Bob Mazzuca, please spin off a thread. Otherwise, contain the jokes and discuss the requirements as a Scouter and not as a jaded individual.(This message has been edited by Eagle707)