dsteele

One . . . two . . . three . . . deep breath . . . four . . . fades off to sleep. Oh well. Unc.

KS -- Thank you, sir. I was going to elaborate . . . but I think I'll put the people who want to impose age minimums on the rank of Eagle through the exercise of finding out why (if they desire) I'm thanking you. I believe you know why I'm thanking you, so I'll say it one more time. Thank you, sir. Unc.

I don't have the exact quote in front of me, but I believe the idea of an Eagle Scout Service Project is that the candidate demonstrate leadership by leading others in the completion of the project. If the idea is to demonstrate leadership, I would actually recommend that he include non-scouts and/or non-scouters in the project. When that Eagle Scout grows up, he's expected to lead. Not everyone in the real world is a former Scout . . . as much as we hate to admit it. Unc.

Talk to your pack's committee and request permission to use a portion of the funds your den raises through the council popcorn sale (whether the pack participates or not) to purchase a kit of hand tools. Then do it. Unc.

Congratulations on your Eagle Scout and planning the court of honor. Congratulations as well on having 25 Life Scouts. One note: 25 Life Scouts won't translate into 25 Eagle Scouts in a year. Some will drop out, some will simply never complete it, and some will become Eagle Scouts. As to holding an Eagle Court of Honor on a regular meeting night (which I assume means the Eagle Court would supercede the meeting,) I would simply guide the Eagle Scout to the realization that one of his duties as an Eagle Scout is to help his lesser-ranked fellow Scouts. He should do this in a couple of ways 1) provide the Scouts an opportunity to be inspired by his receiving of the Eagle badge and 2) allowing the other Scouts the opportunity to progress in Scouting on their own without robbing them of a troop meeting. Not a by-law. Not a rule. Simply advice. Unc.

A mountain has been made of a molehill here. Speak with your council service center's finance director or other senior professional for specific information to your council. I understand the BSA has excellent liability coverage . . . in some cases it's secondary, but in many cases it's primary. There's also a difference between liability insurance and accident insurance. I think I've read some very sincere posts in this thread . . . but only your local council service center can give you the specifics to your council. Unc.

Is a TM the Scoutmaster? Not being funny, just confused. Unc.

Annie: I can't tell you how to make a sweet potato pie. They're virtually unheard of in the midwest. I also can't tell you how to control the temperature of a dutch oven using charcoal . . . but I do know it has to do with the number of coals on top and on the bottom. Others here, I suspect, can help you with that. What I CAN tell you is how to use the dutch oven with charcoal as an oven. I hope it helps. Whether you're making a pizza pie, a sweet potato pie, or any other kind of baked good in a dutch oven: You need even heat all the way around the potentially baked good. With a cobbler, you can pour the stuff on the bottom of the oven, put the fruit on top and be done with it. With using the dutch oven as an oven, here's the key: Use a pie pan and put it on top of some medium size pebbles or bottle caps in the bottom of the oven. This will allow the heat to rotate around the pan in a rather even fashion. That's how you bake in a dutch oven. Unc.

Mollie: Is your friend trained? Does the new Committee Chairman know what the pack should ultimately look like? If so, I'd recommend he do the following: 1. Start getting parents to take on "tasks" rather than "positions." Don't worry about who is registered as a den leader, who's a committee member, etc. He should start asking things like, "Mr. Smith . . . would you handle the pack check book and make a report at our parents meeting for the next couple of months?" Committee member in the bud. Or . . . Mrs. Keene -- would you handle the planning for our June picnic? Another committee member in the making. Perhaps den leadership of meetings (outings, or pack meetings) could be rotated among the parents until a clear leader emerges. Whenever someone takes on a task, give them the proper forms for the task -- i.e. advancement reports for whoever is "picking up the badges" for the month, etc. Do you see what I'm saying. I find it easier to recruit to the task and get agreement to accept the title later. I'm not suggesting the title be hidden . . . but what people really want to know is "what do I need to do?" I hope this helps. Unc.

Merlyn: Then you might want to request that Scouting for All revise their web site. Under the listing of your name as an Assistant Regional Director, it also lists you as SPOKESMAN. There's actually a hotlink that takes visitors to the job description of a SPOKESMAN. Unc.

Merlyn: If you are indeed a different Brian Westley than the one listed on the Scouting For All website under board members, then I hope you'll accept my apologies. There is no equivocation in your statement that you are not a spokesman for the SFA . . . and I don't know you to be a liar, so I will state the apology. After all, Brian Westley really isn't that uncommon for a name. I have no doubt that if you were a spokesman for SFA, you would admit it. Unc.

Merlyn raises a good point. He never said the BSA *is* like a public school, open to all. But he's a spokesman for Scouting for All who's mission statement sure makes it sound like he *wants* it to be like a public school. Here's the mission statement from Scouting For All's website: SCOUTING FOR ALL Committed to Scouting Open to Diversity OUR MISSION "THE MISSION of Scouting For All, a non-profit 501©(3) organization, is to advocate on behalf of its members and supporters for the restoration of the traditionally unbiased values of Scouting as expressed and embodied in the Scout Oath & the Scout Law, and to influence the Boy Scouts of America (BSA) to serve and include as participating members ALL youth and adult leaders, regardless of their spiritual belief, gender, or sexual orientation." I did a simple cut and paste. The emphasis on all is not mine. I find it interesting that although Merlyn continually points out that his beef with the BSA is that the organization accepts government support even while he serves as a spokesman for an organization committed to seeing that anyone who wants to be a leader or a scout in the BSA could be. Why not just come out and say that? Unc.

I can't claim to speak for Old Grey Eagle, but I do think you should apologize. I also, although I'm not Catholic, do think that Pope Benedict has not received a fair shake as Pope. He's only been Pope for a week or so and the press was immediately trying to predict his actions and thoughts. If you truly believe that God is behind the choice (I know I do,) you shouldn't judge what he's done or attempt to guess what he will do. Just have faith and go with it when it unfolds. Unc.

Merlyn: I wish you'd show that side of yourself more often. That was funny! Unc.

I know it's not a popular position, acco. One some might fight me on. Don't get me wrong guys -- lots of my friends and family are dead people. They just don't have the right "stuff" to be leaders in the Boy Scouts of America. Now I'll duck from the firestorm of controversy Unc.

This is either a stupid question, or an "Emporer has no clothes" question. What tote n' chip badge? As far as I know there's only a card. Unc.

Actually, gentlemen, I almost hate to break this to you. Even if Douglas Adams were a God-fearing American, he could not be registered as a leader in the Boy Scouts of America today. He's dead. Unc.

Although I agree with much of what was posted in this thread . . . I think the young man in question got the patch without the "Talk." The "talk" needs to come from a scouter he respects. I won't attempt to script it, but I'll give you the highlights in bullet format. PS -- you won't find this in Scouting texts, but I think it's appropriate: @ -- you're an adult now, John. Welcome to the Troop as an Assistant Scoutmaster @ -- There are some significant differences between being "one of the boys" and being an adult leader. @ Your job is to teach the boys to lead each other. You can't do that if you're playing along like you're one of them. That doesn't mean you can't have fun. Heck, I even have fun with the boys, but you can't lead them astray. @ You were a Scout a short while ago. As a former Scout (or current Eagle,) you know a lot about the troop and about being a Boy Scout. However, you don't know anything yet about being an adult leader. You've seen some examples, but you're now a Tenderfoot in the adult world. The training you need to take is only beginnning. This is not meant to demean you, just to get you ready for the advice you need: 1) Lay back and watch what the other adults are doing. Take direction from the adults and don't try to dive into the Scout's fun -- by that I mean learn to be an adult. 2) Hang out with us when we're giving the Scouts their room to learn. You'll be surprised to learn how much fun it is to watch and guide from a distance. 3) Stop calling me Mr. Scoutmaster (or whatever title or last name.) You're an adult now the same as any other. You're no longer a boy I work with, you're a man who helps me. Just a few random thoughts that should be given to 18 year olds who recently crossed over to adult leadership in the Boy Scouts of America. Unc.

NJ: I'm very proud that in spite of all the jabberwocky going on in this thread that you're able to remember and gently point out to all of us the importance of having a "towel." I know, you never mentioned a towel, but It's my way of saluting you for brining in the Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy. I loved that book as a kid and will (hopefully enjoy the movie.) Unc.

Karl, I would answer your question in the title of the forum if I could. However, I don't have a clue why you were asked to leave your troop, or even if you were. I do have a math question of my own for you. I'm not trying to be rude, but trying to figure this out: If you were asked to leave your troop in 1985, that is twenty years ago. You don't mention being a Cub Scout who earned the Arrow of Light, so I'll assume you joined the troop when you were at least 11 years old. That would put you somewhere near the age of 31. Even if you were asked to leave a troop 20 years ago and are now well past the age where you could start your own troop, which I assume you are and could do . . . what are we to do about what happened in 1985? How are we (forum members like yourself now) to know what happened there and then? Unc.

This line really threw me: " (the parents referenced in the first post)They indicated that if the boys want their Eagle achievement to be counted on high school transcript then it has to occur during high school year. " That dog don't hunt. Eagle Scout doesn't show up on transcripts. It may show up on a college application, but only because it is the Eagle Scout who fills out the application. Whether he earns Eagle as a 13 year old or as a 16 or 18 year old, he can still list it on his college application, and his resume later in life. If the boy's own parents are concerned he is earning the badge at an age they consider too young, they should counsel their own child and not try to drag you into it. The leaders of the troop and the leadership of the district have an obligation to follow the advancement policies and procedures of the Boy Scouts of America and I applaud you for doing it. I have to admit that the can't earn it until high school for it to show up on his transcripts is a new one to me. Unc.

Welcome to the forums! It's always nice to be joined by a youth with an interest in Scouting. Unc.

Zippie: About all I can offer you is sympathy. It sounds to me like this pack desperately needs you to take over as CM. I do hope you cancelled the trip if indeed everyone else cancelled out on you. If you did cancel, it should be up to the people who backed out to inform the Cubs that they couldn't go. Unc.

Actually, the Eagle Application does not suggest letters at all . . . from anyone. Well, requirement #6 demands that the Eagle Candidate provide a write-up about himself and his service to others. I understand that some districts and councils require the candidate to provide reference letters. I don't have a particular problem with that, but I do feel that it's a short-cut on the part of whichever advancement committee is requiring them. Quoting from the Eagle Scout application: "Requirement 2. Demonstrate that you live by the principals of the Scout Oath and Law in your daily life. List the names of individuals that know you personally and would be willing to provide a recommendation on your behalf." Please read the above carefully. You might not agree with my interpretation. I'm fine with that. I can also tell you that having a letter could be a very good thing . . . it would save someone the trouble of checking the references. I note that the application requires "list the names." It doesn't say "letter." I note "Know you personally." And "Would be willing to provide a recommendation on your behalf." It doesn't demand a written recommendation, but if someone calls those references, I think there had better be a positive response. Having said all that, when I applied for Eagle Scout, I made sure I had provided reference letters. In fact, the district provided return envelopes so those providing the recommendation didn't have to share their letters with me. I wish they HAD shared them with me . . . my understanding is that they were all very positive unc.

I have to preface this with a confession: I haven't been involved with a troop since Troop Program Features came out and haven't really looked them over. However, I suspect they are simply an enhanced version of Woods Wisdom -- which I used religiously as a Scoutmaster. The PLC should chose the program from the menu of "stuff" offered in Troop Program Features. If it's anything like Woods Wisdom, there are troop meeting plans in there. In the troop meeting plans, there is a layout for weekly programs for New Scout Patrols, Patrols, and Venture Patrols. Follow those and it sounds like a lot of your problem can be solved. Congrats on having a properly functioning troop! I think that's great, but I also find that a lot of the stronger troops don't use the written resources available from the BSA. It's often a matter of doing without them for so long that they don't know what's there. Unc.