dsteele

I do wish you luck. I think you're on the right track with BLUE and GREEN. I wish you luck on quitting smoking. It hasn't worked for me. I've quit quitting, but admire those who do. Especially if they don't preach to those of us who choose to excersize our rights. Best of luck to you. I should do what you're doing, but, for reasons of my own, will not. Unc.

I can understand your dilema. I also understand where nldscout is coming from. If your pack has such a rule, you're within your rights to exercise it. However, the boy is still a registered member of the Boy Scouts of America and is entitled to all the rights and priviledges of membership. I would look at this overnight opportunity on the battleship as a chance to "re-recruit" father and son into Cub Scouting. Sometime during the day, have a boy or two have a discussion with the "quit" Cub Scout about why he's quitting and ask if he would like to stay, or what it would take to get him to stay. An adult should have a similar conversation with the father. If I had a last chance like this one to keep a boy in Scouting, I'd take advantage of it. Please let us know how it turns out. Unc.

Rooster: Funny you should mention Microsoft. I was going to tell my 13 year old self that I should buy Microsoft. Then I decided against throwing it in. If I had bought it, I'm pretty sure it would have fundamentally changed me. I am what I am and that's all what I am. I'm happy with it. Unc.

Trailers are the choice of the troop. I was merely giving my opinion. If I were a smart man, I'd be a lawyer. I'm not a lawyer, so therefore . . . don't put too much stock in my writings. All I ask is a bit of thought. If you'd like a troop trailer, and that's what your troop needs, then go for it. Whatever is best for your boys is best for your boys and is something you should do. I merely tried to point out an angle or two you may not have thought of. I do have to admit that I smile when I see troop trailers on the road -- it is good pr for the BSA. Unc.

I once helped our DE do a boy talk in the 7th grade for new Scouts. My jaw dropped at his methods (which were unorthadox to say the least,) but we signed up 11 new Scouts as a result. Kept most of 'em, too. Unc. Ask me later and I'll tell you what he did. For now, I'm off to a meeting. UG

I've seen a lot of good district advancement chairmen over the years. Most are very good about tracking on and approving Eagle Scout stuff, many are very good about tracking the mathematics of advancement -- percentage of kids advancing, etc. However, the one piece that I think is missed by many advancement chairmen, is monitoring and encouraging the use of advancement as a method of Scouting. I think it would be great if the district advancement chairman attended our monthly commissioner meeting. Just to point out that troop 123 hasn't had any advancement for the past two months. Commissioners, from my experience, rarely get that information. It's something they can use in discussions with the Scoutmaster to help the troop's program and retention. It's funny how this Scouting stuff can coordinate itself as long as we all share information. I wouldn't expect a district advancement chairman to go to troop meetings for the sheer purpose of looking at the troop's program -- that's a commissioner function. However, keeping commissioners informed is important and statistics kept to themselves don't do anyone any good. Just a few thoughts. Unc.

Okay, this may be unpopular, but I'll give you my personal thoughts on troop trailers. These are my thoughts, and quite possibly mine alone, but having said that, here goes: 1) It's not a cost, but it is a potential one. Where are you going to store the troop trailer? Someone's driveway? The Church or school parking lot? Elsewhere? That thing is going to exist 24/7, so you have to park it somewhere. This is not an insurmountable hurtle, but it must be considered. 2) Others have brought up insurance, etc. so I don't need to go there. Now we get to my philosophy about the things. Realize that I grew up in an era (1970's Scouting) when all the really cool troops had their own bus. Most were worn out school buses, but that's a story in itself. Secondly, my troop did just fine with no troop trailer and no bus. The way I see it, here are some of the benefits of having a troop trailer: a) All the troop's gear in one place b) Good place to store equipment when not in use c) If built to do so, can be used for shelter, cooking, storing food, etc. d) The sides can be great advertising for a troop. e) You don't need extra adults/vehicles just to haul gear Those were in no particular order other than how they struck my little brain. The down-side is easier for me to list because I've seen it happen too many times 1) Storage of the trailer itself will eventually become an issue. Okay, the church lets you park there . . . until 10 years from now when they have an addition built to the church, or it grows, or the city decides a trailer is a vehicle and can not be left out. 2) The troop grows reliant on the trailer and begins to limit its camping opportunities to places where they can park the trailer. 3) Eventually, you find two people consistently on campouts -- the Scoutmaster and the guy who hauls the trailer. When I was a Scoutmaster, there was a time or two when extra adults came along (and often stayed) because we had to haul boys and gear in multiple vehicles. 4) No, we didn't have our troop number, etc. pasted outside of a trailer -- which would have been good advertising. However, we did have multiple vehicles filled with boys in uniform inside, which with their propensity to wave at people also made good advertising. 5) I've seen this one myself. Troop trailers make it pretty easy to ignore gear that was put away wet or dirty until just before (or after) you need it on the next campout. The disadvantages shouldn't rule out a troop trailer. All I'm saying is that I think taking the time to think it through -- long term (5-10 years) is worth it. Just don't get me started on buses. Unc.

Welcome to the forums! Finding information out about training may take a couple of steps, but it can be done. You should begin by finding out which council you're in. You can do that by typing your zip code at the "council locator" spot at www.scouting.org -- that's National's Web Site. They'll probably point you to your council's web site and, even if the training information is not up to date, the people information probably is. Then call the council service center and ask about training. Let us know how it works out. Unc.

Sunday schools don't give tests, guys. It's all pass/fail. Unc.

If you can't get through the daily schools (those that meet Monday - Friday) go to the Sunday Schools! All of 'em. Unc.

The good professor said this, and I just want to add a little clarification to this one small point in his posts. I can't address the other points becuase I don't have the answers: "-Unfortunately, our council is "understaffed" and thus new subscriptions to Boys' Life are often times handled in a lacadasical manner. This causes our boys to not receive their new "gift" for at least 2-3 months - post payment." I learned the hard way when I accidently held a Scout's application too long. Boy's Life subscriptions begin two months after the registration is sent in. It's a national thing. Take a look at your recharter papers next time you see them. You'll notice that the Boy's Life term begins and ends two months after the charter period does. The council may be understaffed, but they're not the reason behind the lag. Unc.

Perception is simply a matter of reading the greens correctly for your putt. Not for everyone's putt. To Hops: Ta-Da! Talk around and soon you'll have a Crew, or a Post, depending on good advice from your council office and/or excited entity wanting help. Good luck! unc.

Redfeather: Of course you may re-print it and use it. That was my hope when I wrote it. My other hope was to try to pursuade those who are in favor of minimum age to earn Eagle that age is not the issue. I'd love to hear from more of those guys. Perhaps this thread will still be active when they get back from their Labor Day Weekend. In fact, Redfeather, if there's time, send me a cassette tape, and I'll read a cleaned up version of my advice and your young Eagle can hear it from the author in his own voice. PM me for the address. Unc.

John: I don't know if there is a policy or not, but I do know a few things having been around for a while and having met and gotten to know several people in Scouting. I can tell you that when the Iron Curtain finally came down, the BSA was involved in creating the Russian Boy Scouts -- which had been banned for years and years. Volunteers and professionals at the National level worked with them to develop a handbook for boys. I can also tell you that the money from chapel services and summer camps, Wood Badge Courses, etc. goes to the International Fund to support Scouting programs in other countries. The profits from the sale of the World Scouting patch (the purple one on the left above the pocket) also go to that fund. Whether the funding goes to specific projects or programs is beyond my purview. Unc.

Yes, some of you know I was one of those young Eagle Scouts I see written about here from time to time. If I could send a note back to that kid now, at the age of 38, here's what I would send him. When I'm done posting, I'd love to see what you would tell yourself at 13, or, if you're an Eagle, what you would tell your newly "minted" Eagle Scout self. Young Unc: 1. Brush up on your basic "Scout skills." Re-learn and become proficient with every knot, lash, cooking skill, everything. Because you're a young Eagle, if you try something and it doesn't "glow" youth and adults will question your Eagle Badge. It isn't fair, but it will happen. 2. You didn't get Eagle because you can light a fire in the rain. You goy Eagle because you earned it. Believe me, there are enough protections in place to make sure you earned it -- boards of review, time requirements, leadership requirements, and, most importantly others perception of how well you live up to the Scout Oath and Law. That's the one called "Scout Spirit." 3. Your mother did not earn your Eagle Scout. She did make sure you did what you said you were going to do and when you said you were going to do it. That is also a testiment of an Eagle Scout. Your father didn't make it any easier or harder for you to earn your Eagle. 4. All that stuff about responsibility and duty that's in your Eagle Charge -- true. Every word of it. Re-read it frequently because that is truly what the world expects of you. 5. Eagle is not something you have, it is what you ARE. No one says, I have Eagle. They say I am an Eagle Scout. Never forget it. 6. People, including adults you respect very much, but not those who truly know you, will question the integrity of an Eagle badge on the shirt of one so young. They think you don't know they're saying it. But you'll know. Let me save you the time of making it up as you went along and tell you how I did it when I was in your shoes: Try not to let it get to you. That won't work after a while. You'll know when the right time to do it is, but if you overhear one of those old OA advisors -- the guy with the zipper on his shorts that seems like it's 12 feet long -- say someting he thinks you didn't hear about "that little kid" being an Eagle. Ask him what year he earned his Eagle Badge and how old he was. I'll tell you right now that he never earned it. That's how he "knows" you're too young. Nice talking to you, young Unc. While I'm at it, here's a free, outside of Scouting, bit of advice: Never date a girl named Melvin. Unc. What would you tell yourself, or what advice would you give a young Eagle Scout? UG

Along the lines, but not quite SAR, would be a Venture Crew chartered to a downhill ski business. I'm sure they have people who patrol the hill for skiers in trouble (I forget what the term is, I don't ski) and I'm sure those guys and gals would be happy to train competent, serious teens, to take over when they're old enough. Oh yeah -- ski patrol! That's the name. It even sounds like Scouting! Unc.

Venture Crew or Explorer Post? SAR could go either way. I worked with an SAR Crew as a commissioner for a while. They were chartered by a volunteer fire department (some parts of the world, that's all they have) and focused mostly on scuba searches. However, they also trained for other emergency stuff. Most of it's members had no intention of a career in SAR, because they don't plan to move from their small town. Hops, I think it's probable that you have volunteer fire departments in your neck of the woods. Talk to them and run your idea past them. If you get some interest, call your council office. Good luck! Unc.

Excellent advice. Unc.

So you thought you were going off to FOS school to learn, and were instead there to teach? And you ended up learning as well? Wow! Quelle Suprise! Please let me pause for a second while I take my tongue out of my cheek before I bite it off. Job well done, friend! Unc.

Well, er, back to the origional question: Can a pack be run with women leaders? Yes. Thanks for the opportunity to avoid the fray. Unc.

I'm glad Hops closed the thread. Although I agree with many of the reasons given, mine is a little different. I feel not only for the Scout's family and Troop, but also for those who searched for him on the ground. How frustrated must the SAR team be? Perhaps some of them are Scouters or have searched the internet for the topic. They would probably read our speculations with a mixture of pain and hope that I wouldn't wish on anyone. They may react with, "Don't you think we looked there?!" when they're hoping for a "I never thought of that!" moment that will probably never come. Unc.

When I was an SPL as a kid, I used the silent signals as printed in the Scout Handbook. I found them far more effective than shouting commands. It only took one or two Scouts to catch on to make the entire 40+ troop fall into order. As a Scoutmaster, I taught my SPL to use the signals. Amazingly enough, it worked for him, too. Peer pressure is a wonderful thing. Unc.

Eamonn: I'll go with FScouter's advice to teach the young man a good handshake. I have a feeling that you know what I think about the rest. Unc.

If I were in your shoes, and I have been, I'd walk in with one month's program helps. Have sufficient copies for all. Walk them through a typical den meeting and the make sure to make the ask -- "Can we use your church as a meeting place." Then I would answer questions, having armed myself with the information from the other people posting here. Good Luck! Let us know how it turns out. Unc.

gentlemen: My respect for both of you is boundless. Shake hands and please continue the discussion. I'm proud of both of you. Unc.