Jump to content



Photo
- - - - -

"Boy lead" Programs - Presentations?


  • Please log in to reply
50 replies to this topic

#41 TAHAWK

TAHAWK

    Senior Member

  • Members
  • 2928 posts

Posted 14 November 2017 - 08:12 AM

"Corporal," have the squad line up."


  • 0

#42 blw2

blw2

    Troop Treasurer

  • Members
  • 2018 posts

Posted 14 November 2017 - 09:12 AM

 

“In a Troop in which the boys are shuffled together at frequent intervals and dealt out into new Patrols according to the whim of the Scoutmaster, there obviously can be little opportunity for the development of Patrol morale and Patrol traditions.”
 
                   Hillcourt, William, The Patrol Method, B.S.A. (1930) at p. 10.
 

 

in our case, it was fuzzier than that.  Not really the whim of the scoutmaster, exactly.

like with a lot of things, "the boys decided"

but I would contend that yeah, they might have come up with the idea, or otherwise decided.....but often it was at the steerage of the adult(s)....sometime that even happens almost subconsciously, with the adult not really intending it, but the little hints and nudges can be an influence no doubt


  • 0

#43 Stosh

Stosh

    Senior Member

  • Members
  • 12429 posts

Posted 14 November 2017 - 10:43 AM

"Corporal," have the squad line up."

 

The older scout literature used to refer to the PL as "Corporal".  I'm sure that dropped when it portrayed the image of Scouting as too militaristic.  After all a Scout, patrol, troop, etc. by definition are military terms.  Kinda hard to get around that.


  • 0

#44 Eagledad

Eagledad

    Senior Member

  • Members
  • 6048 posts

Posted 14 November 2017 - 11:35 AM

in our case, it was fuzzier than that.  Not really the whim of the scoutmaster, exactly.

like with a lot of things, "the boys decided"

but I would contend that yeah, they might have come up with the idea, or otherwise decided.....but often it was at the steerage of the adult(s)....sometime that even happens almost subconsciously, with the adult not really intending it, but the little hints and nudges can be an influence no doubt

Little hints and nudges are very powerful.  

 

But let's assume for a moment the scouts did come up with the idea on their own. Should a SM who doesn't agree with shuffling get involved with the scouts' decision? Why or why not?

 

Barry


  • 0

"Experience is the hardest teacher. It gives the test first, then the lesson."


#45 blw2

blw2

    Troop Treasurer

  • Members
  • 2018 posts

Posted 14 November 2017 - 03:38 PM

great question. 

   I'd say perhaps.

 

I can think of an example of a time, not related to patrol assignments, but instead the patrol name.  Still an example that shows similar idea.

 

The scouts voted on patrol name, but instead of trying to find consensus, the majority ruled...lead by a very overbearing scout.  So the patrol had a name and a patch, that not quite half of the scouts did not want to sew on their uniforms.

 

In defense of the scouts, they did not even know the meaning of the word consensus. 

 

That, in my opinion, is an example where a SM can earn his pay with some gentle nudging and coaching BEFORE something like that gets set in stone.....to head of that win/loose with a win/win instead


  • 0

#46 TAHAWK

TAHAWK

    Senior Member

  • Members
  • 2928 posts

Posted 14 November 2017 - 06:47 PM

If, as BSA continues to say, a patrol is a small group of friends who are largely self-selected, the PLC members may need training.  Until 2001, districts offered Junior Leader Orientation Workshop, a one day course of the Patrol method and leadership skills.  That went away and has never been replaced, despite many promises that a new syllabus would be forthcoming (A Scout is . . .). 

 

All there is short of NYLT is Introduction to Leadership  Skills for Troops - a not too subtle shift away from emphasis on BSA's "most important method" taught, on average, by an adult with an nine months as an SM.

 

Note the words.  They have power.

 

"Among the activities encountered by a troop’s leaders are

• Organizing the troop

• Planning and organizing activities and meetings

• Assigning duties to others

• Planning menus and figuring out food costs

• Encouraging advancement

• Guiding a troop’s involvement in problem-solving

• Teaching outdoor, sports, or craft skills

• Ensuring the troop’s safety during meetings and outings

• Handling the troop’s finances

• Helping other Boy Scouts make the most of their own leadership opportunities

• Encouraging participation

 

The badge of office presented to a Boy Scout who is accepting a position of troop leadership does not automatically make him a good leader.

 

What happened to patrols ? !!!!


  • 0

#47 Stosh

Stosh

    Senior Member

  • Members
  • 12429 posts

Posted 14 November 2017 - 09:21 PM

What happened to patrols ? !!!!

 

If one is managing a troop, one might as well call them departments.  The Department of Newbies, Department of Members and Department of Veterans.  If one is not too fussy on membership they can have the Department of This, the Department of That and the Department of Other Things.  Take your cue off the nudging of your supervisory mentor and have a good day.  Just git 'er done.  If not it will be reflected in your performance review at the end of 6 months.

 

Patrols have been outdated for the past 50 years, obsolete for the past 20.  We have leadership though.  Team Leads are specialty nudging supervisory mentors over a mixed-bag team of people too embarrassed to admit their involvement in the operation.

 

That sound about right?


Edited by Stosh, 14 November 2017 - 09:21 PM.

  • 0

#48 TAHAWK

TAHAWK

    Senior Member

  • Members
  • 2928 posts

Posted 14 November 2017 - 09:30 PM

You forgot the emoticon:  :rolleyes:

 

"‘[T]he Patrol System is not one method in which Scouting for boys can be carried out, but it is the only method. . . . ’"

 

        B.S.A., The Patrol Method (1930)

 

"The patrol method isn’t one way to run a troop. It’s the only way."

 

           B.S.A., Scouting.org   (2014)

 

“[U]nless the patrol method is in operation, you don’t really have a Boy Scout troop.

 

        B.S.A., Scouting.org (citing Baden-Powell) (September, 2015)

 

“Scouting happens in the context of a patrol.”

 

        B.S.A., Scoutmaster Position Specific Training (current syllabus, 11/2017)


  • 0

#49 Stosh

Stosh

    Senior Member

  • Members
  • 12429 posts

Posted 14 November 2017 - 10:07 PM

Nope, one uses the :rolleyes: when they are being sarcastic.  I'm thinking this would be better.  :unsure:


  • 0

#50 MattR

MattR

    Member

  • Members
  • 1038 posts

Posted 14 November 2017 - 10:14 PM

If, as BSA continues to say, a patrol is a small group of friends who are largely self-selected, the PLC members may need training.  Until 2001, districts offered Junior Leader Orientation Workshop, a one day course of the Patrol method and leadership skills.  That went away and has never been replaced, despite many promises that a new syllabus would be forthcoming (A Scout is . . .). 

I always thought it would be great to have a one day training to explain at least what PLs are supposed to do. I searched and it looks like some districts still do this. It would be great to see a syllabus.


  • 0

#51 TAHAWK

TAHAWK

    Senior Member

  • Members
  • 2928 posts

Posted 14 November 2017 - 10:26 PM

My old troop 1987-2011) did it three times as an "unofficial" course using the old syllabus.

 

I took BSA's failure to keep its promise to produce a replacement syllabus as a measure of its institutional commitment to the Patrol Method.  As a later national training director said, it was not so much a change in policy as ignorance.  The Patrol method was "misplaced."  Some are fighting to bring it back.  That the Handbook again says that a troop is composed of patrols is significant, but only a start.


  • 0




1 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 1 guests, 0 anonymous users