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Boys and Girls (Co-Ed) Cub and Boy Scouts Are Coming


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#121 Peregrinator

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Posted 11 March 2017 - 08:14 AM

If the "bump" in cubs is real and represents an infusion of more than Lions, there may be room for optimism.

 

Apparently about 30K of the cubs in this year's report are Lions. So there's your answer.


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#122 Pack18Alex

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Posted 20 March 2017 - 02:03 PM

On a few pages of this thread, people would probably call my program "co-ed" -- and I guess it is.

 

Our sibling den evolved into a Girl Scout Troop, which tried to forge it's own identity and collapsed under the crappiness of GSUSA.  At this point, the GS Troop functions without our Pack as a Patrol (or two, depending as size), where they work of GS Advancement during Den Meeting nights and the Pack Activity during Pack Activity nights.

 

We got a lot of amused looks at a district cub event last year where I had two patrols of girl scouts at it.

 

My take on the matter:

Cubs could go entirely co-ed.  The new program is very "boy" oriented but not gendered as strongly as the old one.  The old one I'd make tweaks for a Cub-Girls program, and designate Den's co-ed.

Boy Scouts should not be Co-Ed, but I'd create a middle school Girls program that is similar.  Alternatively I'd permit a CO to charter Male and Female troops, but not co-ed ones.

 

In our neck of the woods, the major Council Events all invite GSUSA units to participate, and some did.  There was huge excitement when a Girl Scout Troop won a "Chief's Choice" gateway competition at Camporee.

 

I'm just not seeing the issue.  I think it's a regional cultural issue, and Councils should have some flexibility.

 

But it does bug me that our Girl Scout "Troop" sends money to GSUSA instead of BSA, and they'd all drop GSUSA in a heart beat.

 

Caveat: my wife is the Girl Scout Leader, our GS Troop was started as an adjunct.

Our units are very religious in nature, with strong gender separation, so I don't see co-ed patrols/dens in our future anyway.

We don't use the LFL backdoor, doesn't seem trustworthy.  Our events are all "family" events and open to the family members of all unit members.  The participating "girl scouts" are almost always siblings of "boy scouts."  In the few cases where they aren't, we signup and train a girl scout dad as an Adult Leader, and they participate as the Adult Leader's family.

 

It works for us.  When our Boy Scouts visit the Pack campsite and discuss pioneering with Daisy/Brownie girl scouts, it's an utter riot.


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#123 4CouncilsScouter

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Posted 21 March 2017 - 10:40 PM

But see? You still miss the point:

- Change VENTURING to allow girls to join at 11.
- Revamp the VENTURING program to allow MB-like activities.
- Have BSA help folks like you invest your time building strong VENTURING crews.

 

@Back Pack

 

Why would Venturing need these changes? Having been an adult leader in a crew currently and a youth back when Venturing was Exploring, I have to again ask why?

 

The current programming in Venturing is designed for older youth. Adding younger ages to Venturing defeats the program's purpose. That being said, Venturing, by its nature, is meant to be adaptable and flexible. Before the updates to the Venturing program, less than 1% of Venturers actually pursued advancement. This isn't so much an issue on the BSA-side but more so a testament that most Venturers join Venturing for the experience not the number of medals you can wear on a shirt. Besides that, the merit badge system is designed to introduce 11-18 Boy Scouts to future hobbies and careers. Venturing crews are intended to specialize around a hobby or interest that they have previously encountered or want to develop in.

 

No problem with your third idea though! Let's get more Greenshirts on the radar!

 

My two-cents.


Edited by 4CouncilsScouter, 21 March 2017 - 10:40 PM.

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#124 Back Pack

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Posted Yesterday, 06:54 AM

Answer: To leave Scouting as it is because we already have a coed program.
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#125 Stosh

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Posted Yesterday, 07:29 AM

Dropping the age of Venturing to 11 and making it a Boy Scout program with the MB's and advancement for girls is nothing more than an end-around co-ed scouting that drops the patrol method and boy led from it.

 

It kinda reminds me of the putting lipstick on a pig analogy.


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Stosh

 

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#126 NJCubScouter

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Posted Yesterday, 04:46 PM



Dropping the age of Venturing to 11 and making it a Boy Scout program with the MB's and advancement for girls is nothing more than an end-around co-ed scouting that drops the patrol method and boy led from it.

 

One person's "end-around" is another person's "compromise".  And let me ask you this:  As long as Boy Scouts remains all-male, why do you care whether the BSA has a separate program for 11-to-17 year olds that is coed?  Forget the fact that some people want Venturing to be that program. (I don't, because there needs to be a program for older youth.)  The BSA could create a separate program that is exactly the same as a Boy Scout troop, same ages, same ranks and advancement system, same leadership positions, youth-led, same everything except that both boys and girls can join and coed units would have to follow the YP guidelines applicable to coed units, which already exist for Venture crews.  You and I agree that Boy Scout troops should be for boys.  But why not a parallel program?


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#127 Col. Flagg

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Posted Yesterday, 05:17 PM

 

The BSA could create a separate program that is exactly the same as a Boy Scout troop, same ages, same ranks and advancement system, same leadership positions, youth-led, same everything except that both boys and girls can join and coed units would have to follow the YP guidelines applicable to coed units, which already exist for Venture crews.  You and I agree that Boy Scout troops should be for boys.  But why not a parallel program?

 

Marketing Rule 101: Never create a competing product that cannibalizes your best performing brand.  :D


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#128 Stosh

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Posted Yesterday, 07:03 PM

In the late 70's when Exploring was tanking because it was a parallel program to compete with the high school boys where they wouldn't have to hang out with middle school boys.  The powers that were introduced this new program, known as Learning for Life, oops, I mean co-ed Exploring with the career/hobby emphasis.  Now after a wait period they do now call it Learning for Life, but now have the excuse of running a parallel program to compete with the high school boys where they won't have to hang out with the middle school boys, but they have completed the end around introducing the program as co-ed.  Shell-and-Pea marketing.

 

However, now that they have completed the cycle, the girls are asking why can't they be Eagles?  Simple enough question, and like everything else male in the program, that, too, will be worked around.  There hasn't been anything parallel these past 40 years, it has been nothing but jockeying and positioning to accommodate an agenda that's been around a long time and now coming to fruition. 

 

Scouting isn't for the boys anymore, no matter how much we give that idea lip-service.  It's only for the sake the program that needs to be sold/marketed to the public.  There's been a bait-and-switch done on the consumer and they never saw it coming.  Marketing 101.


Edited by Stosh, Yesterday, 07:05 PM.

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Stosh

 

There's a reason why I don't always answer the phone, doorbell or comments on forums.  :)





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