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How does your bowline tie?

knots skills rubrics international

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#1 qwazse

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Posted 20 December 2016 - 09:38 AM

So my venturers, while snacking on the coal I gave them, were working on the knots. The Italian would try to figure out which they were talking about. It didn't help that they started by saying "a noose that doesn't slip."

"Noose?"

Then a minute of futile pantomime ... at which point they decided it was best to actually tie the thing.

Finally, when she saw it, would exclaim something like "Oh, bolino!"

 

Beyond the translation challenges. They had learned it by different stories:

  • Most of the boys used the "pretzel" method.
  • I grew up with a "hole" in front of a "tree", and a "rabbit" coming out of the hole, around the tree and back in.
  • The Italian had a "lake" and a "frog" jumping in and out of it.

The Italian said, "Do you know this knot? We call it something like daisy."

One boy said, "Maybe it's a girl scout knot." :huh:

She said, "I'm not a girl scout. I'm a scout." :rolleyes:

I'm staring and staring, then I pick up both ends and pull and say "Oh, sheepshank!"

One of my co-leaders then (knowing that my brothers were Navy men) smarts off "Daisy is probably what sailors probably call it!" :p

 

Anyway, a knot by any other name still holds, unless it slips.


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#2 Stosh

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Posted 20 December 2016 - 10:17 AM

I teach the bowline because it is required for advancement.  It's the only time I ever "use" the knot.  If I want a knot that doesn't slip I tie the figure-8 loop or double it if 2 loops are necessary.  Both are easier to teach than the bowline.  The loop also doesn't need an end of the rope, but can be tied multiple times on a bite.  Far more useful than the bowline.  Every canoe that gets tied to the trailer or roof rack is tightened down with the trucker's hitch using the figure-8 loop and a double half-hitch.


Edited by Stosh, 20 December 2016 - 10:18 AM.

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Stosh

 

There's a reason why I don't always answer the phone, doorbell or comments on forums.  :)


#3 CalicoPenn

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Posted 20 December 2016 - 06:50 PM

I use "The rabbit goes up the hole, around the tree and back through the hole" method. Not that I ever use a bowline.
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#4 SSScout

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Posted 20 December 2016 - 09:50 PM

Over, under, over,  thru....Three types of Bowline, only one good one.

 

Bowline with running end INSIDE the working loop, next to it's other part.  This is the good one.  "Pass" this version.

Bowline with the running end OUTSIDE the working loop, still adjacent to it's other part.   This is a BAD bowline, but it still might hold tight.

Bowline with the running end INSIDE the working loop , but NOT adjacent to it's other part , separated by the edge of the "rabbits hole".  This is the other BAD one, and will slip.


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#5 Cambridgeskip

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Posted 21 December 2016 - 03:41 AM

Same as calicopenn. Rabbit hole etc. It's a long time since I've actually used a bowline though. Figure 8 is much better.


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#6 DuctTape

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Posted 21 December 2016 - 07:01 AM

I tie it a couple of ways, it depends if the main loop is around my waist, or in my hand. Most who are proficient in knots settle on just a few which they use most of the time. Some knots have more specific uses than others, while some are general use. Like most skills in scouting, the required knots provide an overview of the basic general forms of various types. Of all the knots, the bowline is my most used, followed by a slippery taughtline hitch and then the constrictor hitch (cousin of the clove hitch). A few others I also use regularly, but those are the top 3.
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#7 SSScout

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Posted 21 December 2016 - 02:43 PM

Now three years ago, I hiked the Camino de Santiago in northern Spain.  Many stories to tell from that jaunt. 

Apropos to this thread, I made it out to the fishing village known as Finisterre, "the end of the earth", where there is a small museum dedicated to the fishermen and their craft.  Old boats, tackle, techniques.  With my tourist Spanish (Rosetta Stone is very useful), I had a good conversation with the Docent there (same word!)  . He had a placard of knots, and rope useage.   I do not remember the Spanish names, but I recognized almost all the knots and splices and rigging. In maybe an hour,  I was able to give him an English label for almost every item in the display.  Muchos Gracias!  He gave me an autographed book (in Spanish!)  about the scallop industry. 

 

Scouting 'round the world.  On the bus trip back to Santiago and Madrid, I met several Pfadfinder und Pfadfinderren (boy and Girl Scouts from Germany.  Met  no Spanish Scouts...  


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#8 Hedgehog

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Posted 22 December 2016 - 07:52 AM

At a meeting of the Den my son is Den Chief for, the Den Leader asked him is he knew how to tie a sheepshank.  He promptly said "of course" and tied a sheet bend.

 

There is an ongoing issue about whether a bowline is pronounced "bo lynne" "bo line" or "bow line."  A knot by anyother name is tied as sweetly.


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#9 blw2

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Posted 22 December 2016 - 08:00 AM

As the son of a USCG Master Chief Boatswains Mate, I can tell you that the "bo lynne" is one of the few knots I learned as a kid.  He of course knew a lot of the knots, but that and the half hitch were really the only two I learned.  He tried to teach others, but when it came to practical use these are the two he used most. I remember him teaching the 8, but don't know why it wasn't a go-to knot. .....


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#10 Eagle94-A1

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Posted 22 December 2016 - 01:54 PM

I use "The rabbit goes up the hole, around the tree and back through the hole" method. Not that I ever use a bowline.

 

Coming from Southeast Louisiana, instead of a rabbit, it was a crawfish out of his hole, around the tree, and back in the hole.  here in NC, it's a snake.


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"Train 'em. Trust 'em. LET THEM LEAD!" William "Green Bar Bill" Hillcourt


#11 TAHAWK

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Posted 22 December 2016 - 08:24 PM

If the rabbit goes around the tree twice before going back down the hole, it holds much better.  

 

 

Find ways for the Scouts to actually use the knots, and they will actually learn them. (We removed all the "sliders" from all the tent ropes. Those who knew showed them a solution.  In a short period, all the Scouts knew the taut-line very well.  We also have a "Knot Club."  A new knot, demonstrated whenever asked, gets [and keeps] a bead on a thing.)


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#12 Stosh

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Posted 22 December 2016 - 10:39 PM

Is the double bunny looping adding to the requirement?  :)


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#13 Tampa Turtle

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Posted 03 January 2017 - 09:03 AM

I am shamefully a rabbit and hole man and need to do the entire story to make it correctly.  :o


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#14 Stosh

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Posted 03 January 2017 - 09:40 AM

I use the bunny hole routine for the younger boys it's easy to demonstrate and for the boys to learn.  It fulfills the requirement but the figure-8 routine for the older boys.  Personally I always use the figure-8 when I need a loop that doesn't slip.


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Stosh

 

There's a reason why I don't always answer the phone, doorbell or comments on forums.  :)


#15 TAHAWK

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Posted 03 January 2017 - 05:23 PM

People learn differently.  Some see a picture.  Some need "landmarks" to get there.


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