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Balancing Act Revisited


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#21 Stosh

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Posted 09 June 2016 - 08:55 AM

I've talked with a few of the parents already and gotten a variety of different "reasons" (i.e. excuses) for their boy not going into Boy Scouts.  Some of them have identified valid issues, increase in time commitment, location change, added expenses, etc.  After contacting everyone, I can make better judgments on how to approach the families a second time to address more of their concerns.

 

The 10 families that had no contact with our troop other than an invite to the AOL classes are of primary concern because they just might have dropped because of the unit, the leaders and the fact that they didn't want to go where their WDL went.  They will be some of the first ones I contact.


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There's a reason why I don't always answer the phone, doorbell or comments on forums.  :)


#22 TAHAWK

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Posted 09 June 2016 - 06:01 PM

"Generally speakin', I think a Patrol-Method, youth-led troop needs a lot more time spent on Patrol Leader / Youth Leader training than what da modern BSA materials call for. "

 

Amen !  Officially speaking ("speakin' ") B.S.A. offers troop-level training by the SM (average tenure 9 mos.) - the horribly titled "Introduction to leadership Skills for Troops" (IT'S THE PATROL METHOD, LESS-THAN-KNOWLEDGEABLE PERSON.).  Other than that weak reed, B.S.A. offers only N.Y.L.T.  or  even more expensive and seldom used courses (NAYLE for example).  The district-level training went away fifteen years ago, and the promised "new" district-level syllabus ceased to be promised at least nine years ago.  

 

This paucity of  youth training materials is no problem for the savvy SM.  They will access the training of decades past, but such critters are a distinct minority.   I mentioned Bill Hillcourt in the course of a session at BPI in March and a SM's hand shot up: "Bill who?"

 

B.S.A. sometimes says training youth leaders is Job One - second only to safety, but the training support from National belies that claimed priority.  But, then, someone(s) at B.S.A. thinks: "Patrols are one component of what we call youth-run, or youth-led, troop."  Yup.  The good ol'  Youth-run troop method.


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#23 JoeBob

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Posted 09 June 2016 - 06:02 PM

Is the an official BSA policy on boys recruiting boys?  Seems like most of this discussion is about Adults recruiting boys...


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#24 MrBob

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Posted 09 June 2016 - 06:08 PM

Is the an official BSA policy on boys recruiting boys?  Seems like most of this discussion is about Adults recruiting boys...

 

Official policy?  Nothing that I'm aware of, aside from the 1st Class rank requirement:

 

10. Tell someone who is eligible to join Boy Scouts, or an inactive Boy Scout, about your Scouting activities. Invite him to an outing, activity, service project, or meeting. Tell him how to join, or encourage the inactive Boy Scout to become active. Share your efforts with your Scoutmaster or other adult leader. 

 

Haven't seen anything stating boys can't do #10 more than once.


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#25 TAHAWK

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Posted 09 June 2016 - 06:29 PM

Recruiter Strip   http://www.scouting....uiterStrip.aspx

 

http://www.scouting....t_PeerCards.pdf

 

No reason Scouts could not lead at least some of these activities:  

http://www.scouting....ent/Events.aspx

http://seattlebsa.or...ruiting-Efforts

 

 

Don't you find that a troop and patrol program that is truly exciting for boys is the best recruiting tool for troops?


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#26 TAHAWK

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Posted 09 June 2016 - 08:23 PM

"No. 2: Boy-to-Boy Recruiting

The most effective recruiter is an excited, enthusiastic Scout who has just completed the challenge of his lifetime (so far!) with his troop. Scouts should be encouraged to invite their friends to join the troop and become a member of their patrol.

A First Class rank requirement states that a Scout must invite a friend to a troop activity. To help the Scout meet this requirement, a fun, easy-to-use e-card tool is available at http://www.thescoutzone.org. Click on "Tell a Friend" and follow the instructions to select images and music, then send!

Consider having a recruitment campaign within the troop. Offer incentives to each Scout who brings in a friend, as well as an overall prize for the top recruiter."


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#27 SSScout

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Posted 12 June 2016 - 06:38 AM

Experience in Boy Led:

Life Scout (SM's son)  is presenting his proposed project to the Troop Committee for comment/approval.   It is a good project, to convert a  courtyard in the church into a meditation garden. It would convert a concrete gravel path into  a low maintenance,  bench lined , natural setting .  SM (dad) is sitting in the background. Scout has nice pictures, list of materials, everything is in good shape. Committee asks questions , seems pleased.

I ask, " whose project is this again?  "...  hesitation....

Scout: "  I guess it's mine  ?"

"And  when there is a problem, who makes the decision about what to do?"

Scout looks over to his dad.   "I will?"

(To the SM, who is usually a get in there and make things happen sort of guy):)  "Steve?  You good with that?"

He smiles, says " absolutely". 

 

Project goes off well.  Eagle awarded last month. 


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#28 Eagle94-A1

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Posted 12 June 2016 - 10:44 AM

Well the entire situation at the moment is so frustrating, I believe it is now causing the health issues I'm having. I could be wrong on that, and will await the results of the tests when they come in.

 

SPL has been in charge for a month, but the closest to anyone helping him is me suggesting things to do. No PLC has been conducted, and he has not planned a meeting yet. Adults have done it. And I admit I'm just as guilty as I suggested to the SPL a topic and choices of Scouts to do it. Then I had to help that Scout out a bit. Prior to that it was the SM lecturing, and last week's meeting was essentially the venture patrol's topic, but done with the entire troop. SPL didn't have any plans for tomorrow made until my son, the troop QM asked if he could have the two regular patrols inventory their patrol boxes since there are no records of who has what.

 

Again, I don't want to step on toes, and I do not want to tell the SPL what to do and how to do it. But this is driving me nuts.


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#29 Hedgehog

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Posted 12 June 2016 - 11:00 AM

Again, I don't want to step on toes, and I do not want to tell the SPL what to do and how to do it. But this is driving me nuts.

 

 

Maybe reach out to counsel and have them find someone to do training for the boys.  It seems like nobody in your troop is trained - adults or scouts.  

 

Heck, if you are located within 2 1/2 hours of Princeton, NJ or are willing to have the leadership do a weekend campout at a location somewhere in that range, I'd be glad to come out and do leadership training for both the Scouts and Adults (not SM Specific).  I"m currently (I mean moments before I checked in) working on a program to be done during a two night campout.


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#30 TAHAWK

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Posted 12 June 2016 - 11:04 AM

Adults are to train the leaders in their jobs and act as resources (suggestions/ideas/information).  But if the adults are either untrained, refuse to train the Scouts, or refuse to let the Scouts lead, you don;lt get Boy Scouting.


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#31 Eagle94-A1

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Posted 12 June 2016 - 11:39 AM

 It seems like nobody in your troop is trained - adults or scouts.  

 

That's the irony of the situation. You have 2 former district training chairs, me and the SM. Plus I did BA 22 and staffed JLT, so I know what is supposed to be done. Hence the balancing act. I'm trying to guide an mentor the Scouts without stepping on the toes of the SM. But I'm also trying to not tell the SPL what to do and how to do it, but give him advice and suggestions.

 

As for the SPL, he did ILST. Me personally I do not think it's goo training.

 

 

... refuse to train the Scouts, or refuse to let the Scouts lead, you don;lt get Boy Scouting.

 

In my humble opinion, that's the problem. We give them the training, but then do not follow through with mentoring and advising. Then when things go wrong, the adults say the Scouts aren't ready to lead, and take the experience away.

 

And again, I haven't been to the last two leaders meeting since they came about last minute. However when the results of those meetings came about, I went full bore on the patrol method. Resistance is coming from one leader who is trained, and he is influencing some of the others.

 

On a positive note, Son is getting his job done. I commented on how to implement real change, he needs to be SPL again. I think he is considering it.

 

Hopefully I will be cleared to go to summer camp for the first 3 days. I remember in BA22 the model PLC meeting with the whole troop in attendance as observers. I'm really thinking of doing that on Sunday between check in and Sunday dinner.


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#32 Eagle94-A1

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Posted 12 June 2016 - 12:56 PM

@desertrat77 said it in another thread on TGs in a mixed aged patrol thread:

 

"Saw this dynamic in the military--squadrons with two first sergeants had more issues than those with one.   Best to just let one go-getter take on the extra duties than have the confusion and overlap of having two."

 

And that seems to be the problem, Gunship and I. SM isn't doing everything he's suppose to, and both of use, as well as others, are picking up the slack. Problem is we both have two opposed methods to achieving the  same objective. And the other leaders are in the crossfire.


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#33 Beavah

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Posted 12 June 2016 - 02:01 PM


And that seems to be the problem, Gunship and I. SM isn't doing everything he's suppose to, and both of use, as well as others, are picking up the slack. Problem is we both have two opposed methods to achieving the  same objective. And the other leaders are in the crossfire.

 

Yah, yeh know yeh need to resolve this, right? :o   Preferably by becomin' Scoutmaster. :cool:


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#34 Eagle94-A1

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Posted 12 June 2016 - 03:24 PM

Yah, yeh know yeh need to resolve this, right? :o   Preferably by becomin' Scoutmaster. :cool:

 

Resolving this is a challenge as Gunship, for all practical purposes refuses to talk to me now. I've tried, heck I see where he is coming from and understand his thoughts. BUT IT AINT SCOUTING (emphasis). And when I came up with ways to do what he wants IN A SCOUTING MANNER ( again emphasis) he told me he can't take it anymore, and walked away. Since that incident. he has said maybe 10 words to me.

 

As for becoming SM, several months ago, while I had my wing clipped ;)  , I talked to the ASM who at one time was suppose to take over the troop, and the SM. Neither one had a problem with me becoming SM. It was when I talked to the CC/COR that it was brought to my attention that the CO wants a member as SM. They view the troop as an outreach ministry, and I understand. The CO has been extremely supportive of the troop. But even the CC/COR is hesitant to remove the SM. They have a long history together.


Edited by Eagle94-A1, 12 June 2016 - 03:25 PM.

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#35 David CO

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Posted 12 June 2016 - 04:08 PM

It may not be hesitation.  The CO might not wish to announce a decision until after they have chosen a replacement.


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